所有讨论 > Steam 论坛 > Off Topic > 主题详情
AUTI5T1X 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:11
Live Service Games, Should They Continue, or Should They Stop?
Hey there, I wanted to have a friendly discussion pertaining to the matter of live service games and how they've impacted the gaming industry. What are your thoughts? Have they benefited certain games, or have they been a detriment?
< >
正在显示第 1 - 15 条,共 35 条留言
ReBoot 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:16 
That depends on how that live is serviced. What A publishers understand as "live service" is actually "perpetual monetization", nothing about anything resembling "service".

That said, as long as there's people paying for this, there will be people selling this. It's pretty simple, actually.
Frostbringer 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:16 
What is a live service game ?
ReBoot 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:17 
引用自 Frostbringer
What is a live service game ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=166UJe9-P-8 describes that in quite the detail. Granted, dude's being rather negative, but he stays very close to the facts, meaning the negativity of this video does a good job at portraying the negative aspects of the topic.

The thing is, IN THEORY, the live service model is cool. But in practice, A game companies have found numerous ways to turn this concept into a grotesque caricature of the very idea of servicing players.
最后由 ReBoot 编辑于; 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:37
J4MESOX4D 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 9:32 
I'm not a fan of the live service model as it's encouraged publishers to push out unfinished or broken games. It's also changed some brands for the worse IMO like the latest range of Assassin's Creed titles. Many also have in-game stores attached or additional revenue streams which make them look tacky.

This model however is very successful irrespective of the quality of the games themselves so it will continue and only get worse. On the plus side, if you enjoy a game and it gets a wealth of new content and is regularly updated, it can be good but I'm more a fan of games being finished and released complete with no additional crap attached.
Quint the Alligator Snapper 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 11:45 
Jim Sterling's video (as much as I dislike his style) brings up MMOs, which is what this all reminded me of, including one major reason why I didn't like to play MMOs:

If the service shuts off, the game is gone. It's not like I have put money into a work of art that I can enjoy in perpetuity. It's gone.

Furthermore, games that have microtransaactions tend to be structured around said microtransactions. They're designed to incentivize microtransactions, such as by making doing things without microtransactions more tedious/annoying/time-consuming.

Frankly speaking, I have some friends who are into Final Fantasy XIV, and they've encouraged me to join them a few times, but I've turned them down, because...well, first I don't have the time for it, but second, I really prefer to just be able to buy my games and not need to pay a recurring subscription for them.

I can think of why companies do online games like this. There's a recurring pool of money to keep getting revenue from, obviously, and there are even some "art" ideas they can do with this, such as games as a service being updatable with new content and potentially feeling like a more "organic" fictional setting in the process. (Though this in turn also leaves a bad taste when people miss out on stuff. Also, it's technically still possible with games that have already been purchased; it's just that game companies don't get extra money out of those.)

But I don't prefer it. The design changes this arrangement incentivizes and the fact that I'd be spending my money into a bottomless pit deter me from this type of game. Not to mention the dependence on the service itself.
最后由 Quint the Alligator Snapper 编辑于; 2021 年 12 月 3 日 上午 1:32
Drab 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 12:28 
MMO's are still going strong, so, once again, a tiny minority has no influence on business.
Start_Running 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 2:27 
No reason not to. When they work they work gangbusters and are money printing machines. When they don't work they can still do well on initial sales alone. So there's not much of an impetus for companies not to shoot for getting it right via experimentation.

I don't play them. I prefer the more old fashion. GAme+dlc.
AUTI5T1X 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 2:37 
引用自 Start_Running
No reason not to. When they work they work gangbusters and are money printing machines. When they don't work they can still do well on initial sales alone. So there's not much of an impetus for companies not to shoot for getting it right via experimentation.

I don't play them. I prefer the more old fashion. GAme+dlc.
I'm in the same boat myself. I'm not apposed to games as a service entirely. I more so want them to be done well by the consumer/customer. A great example would be Overwatch. Hate it as much as you want, you can't tell me that it isn't one of the most consumer friendly GaaS games out there.

In most cases, I prefer my games to have hefty expansions that add a ton of content as apposed to said content being cosmetic and adding nothing to the overall experience in terms of gameplay.
☎need4naiim☎ 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 2:40 
Anything which stipulates constant internet connection to access a property of yours is detrimental. This is not freedom, instead a masked version of digital slavery.

Due to same reasons, i don't keep most of my money inside banks as digits.
🍋 Lemonfed 🍋 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 2:55 
in the perfect world games developers should be encouraged in providing a way to allow the players to be able to still play a game even after the ''live service'' had been shut down.

I would find it great if we could still legally host things like our own Matrix online server if we wanted to.
最后由 🍋 Lemonfed 🍋 编辑于; 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 3:08
Phirestar 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 3:15 
It's a double-edged sword.

On one hand, the concept has its merits. A game receiving continuous support post-launch is great for developers, because it means that they have a base to work on and don't have to invest loads of resources into building a new game from scratch, and it's enticing for players because they're able keep coming back to that game and get more out of it.

On the other hand, the live service model also exposes games to the problem of changing too much over time and chasing away long-time fans. This is an issue that I've had with Dead Cells, where the developers made radical changes to parts of the game's core design and, in my opinion, ruined it. I come back occasionally to see what new content has been added in the past few updates, but I don't find the experience fun like I did a couple years ago, because it's no longer the same game I loved playing.

There really isn't a solid answer to the question of whether or not they're a good thing.
Quint the Alligator Snapper 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 3:17 
引用自 Start_Running
I don't play them. I prefer the more old fashion. GAme+dlc.
I'm even more old-fashioned; I prefer it when there isn't any DLC. :P



引用自 AUTI5T1X
I'm in the same boat myself. I'm not apposed to games as a service entirely. I more so want them to be done well by the consumer/customer. A great example would be Overwatch. Hate it as much as you want, you can't tell me that it isn't one of the most consumer friendly GaaS games out there.
I haven't played Overwatch, though one of my friends tried to get me into it and I almost got into it.

Honestly I'm not opposed to games-as-a-service existing. There are definitely interesting things that can be done with this model that can't be done with static game products.

But as far as my own enjoyment is concerned, I generally prefer to avoid them.
Morkonan 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 4:26 
引用自 AUTI5T1X
Hey there, I wanted to have a friendly discussion pertaining to the matter of live service games and how they've impacted the gaming industry. What are your thoughts? Have they benefited certain games, or have they been a detriment?

On average, they're a detriment for the consumer. Why?

Games that do not need a "live service" model in order to practically function for their intended use are often being manufactured, and in some cases remanufactured, in order to require that live service for it's own sake - To keep the customer exposed to their marketplace, in or out of game via the launcher, and to reinforce certain social models to keep players engaged. (Steam forums excluded, because we're all here and we already know what's really going on...:))

The important thing isn't whether or not they should or can exist. What's important are limiting the potential abuses of such shenanigans and improving the knowledge and habits of customers so they may better avoid "predatory product practices."

Some game developers are turning a game environment, which is supposed to be welcoming and fun, into a dark jungle full of dangers. It's their fault. We may fuel it because some of us still keep feeding them, but they're the ones who are designing their products to be money-printing machines with no ethics involved at all. (No matter how much they depend on ensure customers they're "one of us." They're not. That's a paid CM working for a company that is desperately trying to get a customer to give them their credit card info.)
AUTI5T1X 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 4:40 
引用自 Morkonan
引用自 AUTI5T1X
Hey there, I wanted to have a friendly discussion pertaining to the matter of live service games and how they've impacted the gaming industry. What are your thoughts? Have they benefited certain games, or have they been a detriment?

On average, they're a detriment for the consumer. Why?

Games that do not need a "live service" model in order to practically function for their intended use are often being manufactured, and in some cases remanufactured, in order to require that live service for it's own sake - To keep the customer exposed to their marketplace, in or out of game via the launcher, and to reinforce certain social models to keep players engaged. (Steam forums excluded, because we're all here and we already know what's really going on...:))

The important thing isn't whether or not they should or can exist. What's important are limiting the potential abuses of such shenanigans and improving the knowledge and habits of customers so they may better avoid "predatory product practices."

Some game developers are turning a game environment, which is supposed to be welcoming and fun, into a dark jungle full of dangers. It's their fault. We may fuel it because some of us still keep feeding them, but they're the ones who are designing their products to be money-printing machines with no ethics involved at all. (No matter how much they depend on ensure customers they're "one of us." They're not. That's a paid CM working for a company that is desperately trying to get a customer to give them their credit card info.)
This is a great take in all honesty. I tend to avoid buying into live service games. The only game that I play these days that could be considered "live service" to an extent, is Deep Rock Galactic. Even then, I play it through Xbox Game Pass for PC, and I've not spent a dime on it.

I do agree that gaming as an environment should be welcoming and enjoyable. I also hope I'm not wrong in claiming that games should be treated as a medium of art to a certain degree, as there are some games that are absolute masterpieces in terms of art direction, or visual style. Those that do have those areas really nailed, are a rarity these days. I find it to be a bit insulting when a game has great visuals, and it attempts to try to sell me something that adds to the overall art style. It makes me say to myself "Oh ♥♥♥♥ off, can I not get the complete package, and be done with it". I don't have a problem with expansions, so long as they're content that wasn't cut from the main game. I absolutely detest mtx and have very much learned my lesson to not buy into them. I feel ashamed that I've even spent money on them to begin with.
AUTI5T1X 2021 年 12 月 1 日 下午 4:43 
引用自 The Legend
I remember when "Disk locked DLC" first happened, and the opposition to it was pretty widespread, people didn't like it at all. Yet, somehow, they not only got away with it, but they've since got away with pushing it more, and farther. Because despite people's issues with these things, they turned around and bought these games anyway. This send the message to developers that they shouldn't care what you think because you're just gonna buy their slop anyway, and like it. And buy it again, and ultimately ask for seconds.
Shudders in Mysteries of the Sith. Jokes aside, that was a great expansion, despite not being canon. I do see your sentiment though. Mind you, it's hard for me to relate to it as I was all but a young child when "disc based" DLC/Expansions were a thing.
< >
正在显示第 1 - 15 条,共 35 条留言
每页显示数: 1530 50

所有讨论 > Steam 论坛 > Off Topic > 主题详情
发帖日期: 2021 年 12 月 1 日 上午 8:11
回复数: 35