the problems with denuvo

[Get out there]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjhjRy10-Lc

[BitSlash]

Glad to see that you are against Denuvo and using evidence to back that up~

Denuvo is a tremendous inconvenience to legitimate customers.

And Denuvo is quite hackable, as proven by multiple cracked versions of "Denuvo-protected" PC games.

[76561198122531442]

Originally posted by BitSlash:

Glad to see that you are against Denuvo and using evidence to back that up~

Denuvo is a tremendous inconvenience to legitimate customers.

And Denuvo is quite hackable, as proven by multiple cracked versions of "Denuvo-protected" PC games.

Whether Denuvo can be cracked or not is irrelevant
People need to realize how game sales work in order to realize why Denuvo is used

So lets say this game doesn't have Denuvo
its released at the EXACT TIME of its steam release you'll already see it on pirated websites...hell sometimes it will be way before that "maybe 3 days before"

A really huge percentage of people that would have bought it would be like "Hey I can just get it for free" And they do.

But if this game has Denuvo ...and it doesn't get cracked in lets say 7 days
in those 7 days the game's sales would have at least tripled the amount it would have been if the game wasn't protected

honestly you'd be surprised by the amount of players that would rather get a pirated version but don't want to wait so they end up buying it.

With all this said I have to disclose fully that I ABSOLUTELY do not support piracy of any type! You should totally buy these games if you're interested in them to support those developers, if the price is too much you can always wait for a good sale, there are always other games to try meanwhile

Me ? I dislike pre-purchasing games because I hate waiting a few days for my refund money to come back so I rather just wait for user reviews to come out and decide for myself to buy this or not.

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Cynic:

Whether Denuvo can be cracked or not is irrelevant
People need to realize how game sales work in order to realize why Denuvo is used

So lets say this game doesn't have Denuvo
its released at the EXACT TIME of its steam release you'll already see it on pirated websites...hell sometimes it will be way before that "maybe 3 days before"

A really huge percentage of people that would have bought it would be like "Hey I can just get it for free" And they do.

But if this game has Denuvo ...and it doesn't get cracked in lets say 7 days
in those 7 days the game's sales would have at least tripled the amount it would have been if the game wasn't protected

honestly you'd be surprised by the amount of players that would rather get a pirated version but don't want to wait so they end up buying it.

With all this said I have to disclose fully that I ABSOLUTELY do not support piracy of any type! You should totally buy these games if you're interested in them to support those developers, if the price is too much you can always wait for a good sale, there are always other games to try meanwhile

Me ? I dislike pre-purchasing games because I hate waiting a few days for my refund money to come back so I rather just wait for user reviews to come out and decide for myself to buy this or not.

I already know what Denuvo's purpose is; it is a DRM, that is not my problem.

My problem is that Denuvo is the type of DRM that can lock me out of my purchased product just because of a fault in their system's design; that fault has nothing to do with me.

You think that it is ok to get locked out of your own product just because Denuvo feels likes it or if there is an Internet Blackout and you can't connect to Denuvo's servers?

These scenarios CAN happen and when they happen it is the legitimate customer, who paid with their hard-earned money, that is screwed; not the pirates.

For me, there is NO justification for DRM implementation like that; absolutely NONE!

I will NEVER support Denuvo as long as they implement DRM like this, which unfortunately involves not purchasing Mega Man 11 until Denvo is removed from it.

[Colen Bardbarian]

Originally posted by Cynic:

Originally posted by BitSlash:

Glad to see that you are against Denuvo and using evidence to back that up~

Denuvo is a tremendous inconvenience to legitimate customers.

And Denuvo is quite hackable, as proven by multiple cracked versions of "Denuvo-protected" PC games.

Whether Denuvo can be cracked or not is irrelevant
People need to realize how game sales work in order to realize why Denuvo is used

So lets say this game doesn't have Denuvo
its released at the EXACT TIME of its steam release you'll already see it on pirated websites...hell sometimes it will be way before that "maybe 3 days before"

A really huge percentage of people that would have bought it would be like "Hey I can just get it for free" And they do.

But if this game has Denuvo ...and it doesn't get cracked in lets say 7 days
in those 7 days the game's sales would have at least tripled the amount it would have been if the game wasn't protected

honestly you'd be surprised by the amount of players that would rather get a pirated version but don't want to wait so they end up buying it.

With all this said I have to disclose fully that I ABSOLUTELY do not support piracy of any type! You should totally buy these games if you're interested in them to support those developers, if the price is too much you can always wait for a good sale, there are always other games to try meanwhile

Me ? I dislike pre-purchasing games because I hate waiting a few days for my refund money to come back so I rather just wait for user reviews to come out and decide for myself to buy this or not.

Well said.

While Denuvo can be an inconvienience to some buyers, it's also an inconvienience to pirates, and the devs have the right to protect their game, anyone would.

Yes it will get cracked eventually, but as you say game sales can double in triple in that time as people just want to play it.

[76561198122531442]

BitSlash you know this video said a lot of false things

1 - that if denuvo servers got shut down that you'll lose access to playing the game, the owners of the product have the ability to remove denuvo dependency
So if Denuvo servers got shut down and they went bankrupt the game will be unplayable for maybe a day ? And then the developers of the game will release a patch removing denovo
it wont be the first time steam games removed Denuvo

2 - He compared doom and witcher 3 then he used darkspore and used "Niche" well that can be said for doom ? every pc gamer that built a new pc bought witcher 3 because it is "THE" game at the time, it is a game everyone wants to own and say " hey i played that " Sort of like Skyrim whereas doom is a game for a limited audience that are mostly old classic doom lovers and those that were interested on how it is ....also one game is open world and the other one is levels FPS style so comparing those two is very short sighted in his video rendering his entire statement false since he compared it to gamespy and what happened with darkspore which probably wont happen "due to point one" because denuvo doesn't store game info on their servers and you don't need to be online all the time to play its games "Just to verify every now and then"

There are videos that played games with denuvo and played them after denuvo was removed
and all games performed at better FPS and MUCH less loading times "less loading time = good thing" which made me believe after so many attempts myself that Denuvo probably does increase loading times in games and at some cases reduces fps performance, but he didn't even make that point in this video what he said were all speculations based on false data.

[Colen Bardbarian]

Originally posted by BitSlash:

Originally posted by Cynic:

Whether Denuvo can be cracked or not is irrelevant
People need to realize how game sales work in order to realize why Denuvo is used

So lets say this game doesn't have Denuvo
its released at the EXACT TIME of its steam release you'll already see it on pirated websites...hell sometimes it will be way before that "maybe 3 days before"

A really huge percentage of people that would have bought it would be like "Hey I can just get it for free" And they do.

But if this game has Denuvo ...and it doesn't get cracked in lets say 7 days
in those 7 days the game's sales would have at least tripled the amount it would have been if the game wasn't protected

honestly you'd be surprised by the amount of players that would rather get a pirated version but don't want to wait so they end up buying it.

With all this said I have to disclose fully that I ABSOLUTELY do not support piracy of any type! You should totally buy these games if you're interested in them to support those developers, if the price is too much you can always wait for a good sale, there are always other games to try meanwhile

Me ? I dislike pre-purchasing games because I hate waiting a few days for my refund money to come back so I rather just wait for user reviews to come out and decide for myself to buy this or not.

I already know what Denuvo's purpose is; it is a DRM, that is not my problem.

My problem is that Denuvo is the type of DRM that can lock me out of my purchased product just because of a fault in their system's design; that fault has nothing to do with me.

You think that it is ok to get locked out of your own product just because Denuvo feels likes it or if there is an Internet Blackout you can connect to Denuvo's servers?

These scenarios CAN happen and when they happen it is the legitimate customer, who paid with their hard-earned money, that is screwed; not the pirates.

For me, there is NO justification for DRM implementation like that; absolutely NONE!

I will NEVER support Denuvo as long as they implement DRM like this, which unfortunately involves not purchasing Mega Man 11 until Denvo is removed from it.

When has denuvo locked people out of their games?

Also, if you hate DRM so much, perhaps you shouldn't be on Steam as it is DRM also. If Steam goes down or is hacked etc. You can't play any of your games.

[Colen Bardbarian]

Originally posted by Dungeon Rogue:

Originally posted by BitSlash:

I already know what Denuvo's purpose is; it is a DRM, that is not my problem.

My problem is that Denuvo is the type of DRM that can lock me out of my purchased product just because of a fault in their system's design; that fault has nothing to do with me.

You think that it is ok to get locked out of your own product just because Denuvo feels likes it or if there is an Internet Blackout you can connect to Denuvo's servers?

These scenarios CAN happen and when they happen it is the legitimate customer, who paid with their hard-earned money, that is screwed; not the pirates.

For me, there is NO justification for DRM implementation like that; absolutely NONE!

I will NEVER support Denuvo as long as they implement DRM like this, which unfortunately involves not purchasing Mega Man 11 until Denvo is removed from it.

When has denuvo locked people out of their games?

Also, if you hate DRM so much, perhaps you shouldn't be on Steam as it is DRM also. If Steam goes down or is hacked etc. You can't play any of your games.

Also you don't need online everyday for Denuvo.

[Colen Bardbarian]

Originally posted by Mastodon Lion Thunderzord:

the main issue, for now until their 'anti-cheat' bs, is the online check bs which has negatively impacted me once when the only non-mmo/moba I had installed on a cross-country move was a denuvo game I saved for the offline play (LOL) and I discovered just what it was the disgusting way.

thank god for the TG**** networks and the 4 digits fromt he MAC trick with guessing their passwords, I still deleted the garbage game that wanted to phone home like ET immediately (It was mad max, and this was about a couple of years ago by now)... but at least I caught up on tv through *****tuner that weekend and made it worth the hassle. denuvo forced me to possibly commit a crime in order to access my 'rental'. Otherwise, they Literally, took my money and ran. As in swindled me. Conned me. Sold me something I could Not use. Which itself Should be a crime.

But I was so p*ssed I honestly didn't care and still don't care and will do it again if I have to, which I won't have to often sicne I tend to wait for the community to fix the online bug these days unless I either care about a series or fear having to half a year for the community to patch that bug which may be possible for alittle while but is looking up already though.

The irony, is that the ones that made denuvo, made Another drm in the past that Also drove people to community made fixes for it's woes. the cd fixes, that literally saved disc drives and lead people to deciding that only one person needed to buy the games and they would take their copy to everybody's place. since even with dial-up the cd fixes while it could take you all day maybe were still not a big deal back then when even a song also took forever back then. I got most games on cds and most concerts on bootleg cassette tapes. Also, the fix came with the game if you bought it from a friend instead... some people never learn, smfh

online ANY time AT ALL after the FIRST RUN that steam does installing the game is anti consumer, and should not be allowed. Plain and simple. Anybody supporting it, is clearly shilling for either denuvo, and/or a publisher. I see nothing but shills in this thread constantly shutting out the real posters actually, basically talking to themselves and each other at this point which is comical. Thank god for the new hidden posts (a good feature) when I block communication with shills on steam threads. I'm done with this thread since a shill always drowns out anything one of them isn't copying and pasting for denuvo/publisher

So you have bought this game why exactly?

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Cynic:

BitSlash you know this video said a lot of false things

1 - that if denuvo servers got shut down that you'll lose access to playing the game, the owners of the product have the ability to remove denuvo dependency
So if Denuvo servers got shut down and they went bankrupt the game will be unplayable for maybe a day ? And then the developers of the game will release a patch removing denovo
it wont be the first time steam games removed Denuvo

Oh really???

Do you know that for certain???

Where is the document evidence to support this convenient claim of yours???

Do you know why I am asking for that?

Because I have worked with businesses in my trade of occupation and every single one of those modern businesses ( like Capcom ) do NOT put the customer 1st; they put the customers AFTER the investors.

So, show me that evidence to support your claim, buddy!

Or I've got a nice big "I don't believe you" with your name on it~

Originally posted by Cynic:

2 - He compared doom and witcher 3 then he used darkspore and used "Niche" well that can be said for doom ? every pc gamer that built a new pc bought witcher 3 because it is "THE" game at the time, it is a game everyone wants to own and say " hey i played that " Sort of like Skyrim whereas doom is a game for a limited audience that are mostly old classic doom lovers and those that were interested on how it is ....also one game is open world and the other one is levels FPS style so comparing those two is very short sighted in his video rendering his entire statement false since he compared it to gamespy and what happened with darkspore which probably wont happen "due to point one" because denuvo doesn't store game info on their servers and you don't need to be online all the time to play its games "Just to verify every now and then"

There are videos that played games with denuvo and played them after denuvo was removed
and all games performed at better FPS and MUCH less loading times "less loading time = good thing" which made me believe after so many attempts myself that Denuvo probably does increase loading times in games and at some cases reduces fps performance, but he didn't even make that point in this video what he said were all speculations based on false data.

The problem isn't about "being online ALL the time"; the problem is that Denuvo CAN deny a legitimate customer ACCESS to their properly purchased game product whenver Denuvo feels like it.

Is that fact so hard to understand???

That is my ONLY problem with Denuvo; it is a inconveniently designed DRM for customers.

I find that fact to be unacceptable and that is why I am not currently supporting purchases of Mega Man 11.

Because currently supporting Mega Man 11 is supporting Denuvo.

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Dungeon Rogue:

When has denuvo locked people out of their games?

Also, if you hate DRM so much, perhaps you shouldn't be on Steam as it is DRM also. If Steam goes down or is hacked etc. You can't play any of your games.

Read this article and learn why Denuvo is a bad product:
https://whyisdenuvobad.github.io/

Also, I'm fine with Steam as a gaming platform; they are not the people to blame for Denuvo.

It is the publishers and game developers who are to blame.

[76561198122531442]

Why do I need to give you evidence ?
I cant provide any evidence that denuvo wont ever go bankrupt
But look at 2Dark this is one example out of my head
a game that had denuvo and removed it eventually
there's a list somewhere if you google it
all those games made one patch and removed denuvo and now working fine

there's your evidence
worry not I understand everything you're saying its just not applied here thats all.

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Cynic:

Why do I need to give you evidence ?
I cant provide any evidence that denuvo wont ever go bankrupt
But look at 2Dark this is one example out of my head
a game that had denuvo and removed it eventually
there's a list somewhere if you google it
all those games made one patch and removed denuvo and now working fine

there's your evidence
worry not I understand everything you're saying its just not applied here thats all.

Oh!

So, one example of 2Dark removing Denuvo means that ALL the other game companies will do that same thing when they need to, right?

Right???

...

Sorry, but I doubt it.

Most companies aren't thinking about putting the customer 1st; they are thinking about making their investors happy.

So, even though I appreciate your suggestion and example; I'm going to have to NOT trust your claim~

Do you know why?

Because you do not control Denuvo, or Capcom, or 2Dark, or any other company that makes the games or services that can influence my purchase; now THAT fact is the reality of the situation.

I hope that you have a better plan of supporting Denuvo than what you have provided, because I don't think that your words are looking very credible right about now~

[76561198122531442]

I think you misunderstood my position here
I have 0 interest in supporting Denuvo
I am interested in supporting game developers
You're a user with 42 games on your account so I am guessing you're not a fan of support developers like me so we'll probably never see eye to eye
And since you like to make assumptions here is one , you probably hate denuvo because you don't get to pirate your upcoming games on day one so you try to make other claims and pretend you have a reason to hate it.

{LINK REMOVED}https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denuvo

has a list of games that had denuvo and removed it because the devs felt they no longer needed it
yeah this happens and will continue to happen.

If you choose to not support denuvo I support your position, I don't agree but I understand but constantly having to comment on every new game as "DENUV OMGOGOEGMOM" doesn't work
I promise you every new game release we see the "ugh ...someone made that denuvo thread" it doesn't even put a dent on the game's sales because 99% of those complaining about denuvo are MOST LIKELY not even going to buy the game anyway and just wants a free pirated game

Developers have the right to protect their product just like you have the right to not buy it, if you want to come up with a new way to protect games then by all means make your own platform that wont go one day offline like what you're saying.

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Cynic:

I think you misunderstood my position here
I have 0 interest in supporting Denuvo
I am interested in supporting game developers
You're a user with 42 games on your account so I am guessing you're not a fan of support developers like me so we'll probably never see eye to eye

How elitist of you~
"You only have 42 games; I'm better than you because my game inventory is SO LARGE; ho, ho, ho"

If this snarky insult is any hint of your character as a person; I wouldn't want to see eye-to-eye with a person like you~

Originally posted by Cynic:

And since you like to make assumptions here is one , you probably hate denuvo because you don't get to pirate your upcoming games on day one so you try to make other claims and pretend you have a reason to hate it.

Actually, I hate Denuvo because of the reasons that I previously stated~

BUT HEY, just conveniently ignore all that information in order to fit your narrative~

Originally posted by Cynic:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denuvo

has a list of games that had denuvo and removed it because the devs felt they no longer needed it
yeah this happens and will continue to happen.

If you choose to not support denuvo I support your position, I don't agree but I understand but constantly having to comment on every new game as "DENUV OMGOGOEGMOM" doesn't work
I promise you every new game release we see the "ugh ...someone made that denuvo thread" it doesn't even put a dent on the game's sales because 99% of those complaining about denuvo are MOST LIKELY not even going to buy the game anyway and just wants a free pirated game

Developers have the right to protect their product just like you have the right to not buy it, if you want to come up with a new way to protect games then by all means make your own platform that wont go one day offline like what you're saying.

Hey, buddy, I never said developers COULDN'T protect their products.

All I want is a form of DRM protection that isn't as INEFFICIENT as Denuvo.

You think that you can try to process that fact without creating another misunderstanding?

[BitSlash]

Originally posted by Mastodon Lion Thunderzord:

steam discussions need their own form of drm sometimes

Don't give Steam any ideas; they might just do it~