Building a low budget gaming PC?

[David Wolfe]

(Please check the latest post, this topic has changed a lot)
Original Title: Laptop or Desktop for Low end gaming?
Hello everyone, I am gathered enough pocket money (£250) in the last 4/5 years to buy what I want...
Anyway...so I never had a proper gaming thing...I own a PS2 and a Wii (and trust me, the Wii is the biggest regret to my money) and now my birthday is coming up, my laptop is broken since the last 6 month and it was those 1GB intergated AMD ones (Which suprisingly, still could run COD: WAW at 25fps...it was just a normal school laptop too...)
Now...I'm not a die hard gamer...but I think a desktop in the long run would be better, but a laptop is portable and would suit my daily needs.

My plan is that if I'm getting this pre-built (unfortunately, building one is NOT an option for me...for now...) desktop (specs here) (£229.99)
Windows 8.1
Intel® Pentium® Processor J2900
4 GB DDR3
1 TB HDD, 7200 rpm

EDIT: This computer is now out of stock, I did notice another computer with same specs (except it has 500GB and the case is small, its a Lenovo H500s model)


And then, after 2 years...adding a new graphics card to it like maybe GTX 750 (which might become cheaper in the next 2 years?)

Edit: a GTX 750 would be impossible to fit in, so
Edit: According to my research, a GTX 750 ti actually CAN FIT inside a H500s...

But I'm someone who goes around the house and like I said, I'm not a die hard gamer so i wont mind playing Battlefield 3 on Low 48 FPS.

So then there is this laptop. (£249.99)
AMD A4-6210 APU
4 GB DDR3L
AMD Radeon R3 (At first, I was getting happy because I thought it was dedicated, then realized that it's the GPU that comes with the APU...ah well...)
1 TB, 5400 rpm SATA

I COMPLETELY do not mind playing games on low setting.

The only thing I might upgrade to the laptop in 4 years time is the ram and add an SSD.
So what should I do? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

[Rove]

引用自 Katzen：

I think an APU is best for my style, I understand that your cpu is good, but you have a dedicated gpu, i wont if i have choose Rove's build.

If you have even a little spare cash I recommend upgrading the APU in my build to the A10-7800 which will give you better integrated graphics. The A8-7600 is okay, better than last generation of consoles, does like 550~ GFLOPS but the A10-7800 is best with 737~ GFLOPS.

If price is really a big issue don't worry about it. The A8-7600 is still great and other than speed settings it's the same CPU as in the A10, just not the same integrated graphics.

Once you can upgrade to a real graphics card (R7 250X or better, hopefully R9) then you can forget about the integrated graphics anyways.

I wish you the best of luck with that. There are lots of great and popular games you can play singleplayer or online with a A8 or A10 for free (DoTA2 was one of my favorite or Robocraft seems good) or after buying them.

[David Wolfe]

引用自 Rove：

引用自 Katzen：

I think an APU is best for my style, I understand that your cpu is good, but you have a dedicated gpu, i wont if i have choose Rove's build.

If you have even a little spare cash I recommend upgrading the APU in my build to the A10-7800 which will give you better integrated graphics. The A8-7600 is okay, better than last generation of consoles, does like 550~ GFLOPS but the A10-7800 is best with 737~ GFLOPS.

If price is really a big issue don't worry about it. The A8-7600 is still great and other than speed settings it's the same CPU as in the A10, just not the same integrated graphics.

Once you can upgrade to a real graphics card (R7 250X or better, hopefully R9) then you can forget about the integrated graphics anyways.

I wish you the best of luck with that. There are lots of great and popular games you can play singleplayer or online with a A8 or A10 for free (DoTA2 was one of my favorite or Robocraft seems good) or after buying them.

Hello.
I am able to squeeze the A10 but the problem is that since this is the 1st time I'm making this build, I don't want to put so much luxury into it and then ACCIDENTALLY screw something up.
The most painful part is the A10 packaging, the package is red so so clear unlike the A8 bland white box...240p box....10fps....box................no DirectX compatiblity...
I'm seriously calling the PACKAGING of the A8 a 240p 10fps unoptimized game...
The packaging....
What's wrong with me?
I got the ram you mentioned before.
http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/rpmTt6
I understood you said that my Laptop HDD may not be compatible and my old family HDD might not be compatible as well, but I do want to put it to use and it will save me £40 that I can spend in 3 years when SSDs get cheaper.
So if it works, great.
If it doesn't...
:( I'm going to have to get that 1TB then and use the old harddrives as portable storage.

Edit; I also remembered, the OS is not included. I could install Windows XP as I got the ISO and a key, but...ummm...
Windows 10 is coming out....
People be rolling their eyes....
*THEY SEE ME ROLLING! MY EYES LOL!"
That sounds so stupid I think I lost all my respect and reputation.
So I'm going to have to find some sort of way to play Windows games on Linux or get Windows 7 Home for £69...but Windows 10 is coming...
Windows 9 didn't even come at...
Because....7 8 9...
Seven ate 9....
hahahahhahaha
.........
......................

[Rove]

I have managed to install a program called "Wine" on Linux Mint and then been able to install Steam for Windows and play windows games.

Note that to play games on Linux as native Linux games you actually need a second copy of Steam for Linux as well as the copy of Steam for Windows being run through Wine.

So anyways you can play Linux compatible Steam games natively and also Windows games and Windows programs with a little work after installing Wine.

I recommend not buying Windows as on your fairly low budget it's a waste of money. When and if you get more money then for sure. I use Windows but I also bought a much more expensive computer. Don't sacrifice your hardware for Windows, that's all I'm saying.

Also you can boot Linux from a USB flash drive and also run it from a portable storage or even live off of CD or DVD, at least Linux Mint. So even if your HDD don't work and you can't get a adpater you will at least be able to use this PC till you get a new HDD.

[_I_]

do not get a msi amd mobo
http://www.overclock.net/a/database-of-motherboard-vrm-failure-incidents

2133 cl11 is a poor choice for ram
the high timings negate the high speed

to compare kits
speed/cl = value (higher = better)

2133 / 11 = 197
1600 / 8 = 200
1866 / 9 = 207

2 better ram kits at that price
http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/mushkin-memory-997043s
http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/geil-memory-goc38gb1866c9dc

yo do not need a crossfire capable board, hybrid corssfire (dual graphics) isnt worth it
even on the best apu setups, it will give higher highs than the singel gpu, but you also get lower lows due to the apus system ram

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-motherboard-gaf2a88xmds2
when you want a better gpu, buy a better gpu than what hybrid crossfire (dual graphics) can deliver
http://www.eteknix.com/kaveri-hybrid-crossfire-a10-7850k-a10-7700k-r7-240-250/8/

[Rove]

引用自 _I_：

do not get a msi amd mobo
http://www.overclock.net/a/database-of-motherboard-vrm-failure-incidents

2133 cl11 is a poor choice for ram
the high timings negate the high speed

to compare kits
speed/cl = value (higher = better)

2133 / 11 = 197
1600 / 8 = 200
1866 / 9 = 207

2 better ram kits at that price
http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/mushkin-memory-997043s
http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/geil-memory-goc38gb1866c9dc

yo do not need a crossfire capable board, hybrid corssfire (dual graphics) isnt worth it
even on the best apu setups, it will give higher highs than the singel gpu, but you also get lower lows due to the apus system ram

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-motherboard-gaf2a88xmds2
when you want a better gpu, buy a better gpu than what hybrid crossfire (dual graphics) can deliver
http://www.eteknix.com/kaveri-hybrid-crossfire-a10-7850k-a10-7700k-r7-240-250/8/

I believe this is generally poor advice:

*There is nothing wrong with that MSI motherboard for a A8-7600 or A10-7800 as they are not for overclocking. I would not recommend pairing that with a K-series APU if possible but it's fine as-is. It's also the cheapest motherboard with 4 RAM slots and the VRM are fine.

*DDR3-2133 is important to the APU in this case for bandwidth regardless of CAS Latency. Granted those kits you recommend *might* be able to overclock as high or higher than 2133 at CAS 10 or 11 and 1.5V and might overclock better than the 2133 kit I had in there but why take the chance? Bandwidth is what the APU really needs most and I don't offhand know that either of those 2 kits is good for overclocking OR that the kit I recommended is bad for overclocking cause it might be great for it.

*Both those kits you recommended are less than DDR3-2133 bandwidth default. Since I don't know if he likes to overclock RAM I assume he needs it at 2133 preset.

*I didn't pick that board for crossfire, I picked it cause it was the cheapest with SATA 3 and 4 RAM slots so that the RAM could be upgraded to higher capacity if required later. Up to 24GB or 32GB if you throw out the original 8GB (2*4GB) RAM kit.

*The board you recommend has only 2 RAM slots meaning 8GB (the two sticks he'd get now) is the limit unless he throws away the old sticks which would be wasteful. Even if he did replace both sticks it's still a maximum of 16GB in that board.

[_I_]

your advice is poor too, but since the op wants the cheapest system give it to him

[David Wolfe]

Edit: Now that we got the poor advices out of the way...
I guess I'm convinced that I should just use an APU for now.
If this is going to be my first PC build then I want less "legos" to deal with as possible.
To answer the overclocking question, at this time...I plan to NEVER overclock anything. The last thing I want is my house to be on fire (dead joke)
I just see overclocking as a risk and I really don';t take risk as much.
Besides...I'll be running Linux...so....
I think the build Rove has provided me is good for the money £220 (and if I cant add that HDDs...£260)
So...ummm...guess now that we got the build done...ummmm....

any advice for 14 year old building a pc?

[Rove]

Watch Newegg 3 part tutorial on Youtube.

[David Wolfe]

引用自 Rove：

Watch Newegg 3 part tutorial on Youtube.

One last question, the graphic that the A8-7600 contains.
What exactly is it?
I know it's an R7 2XXX
But is it an R7 7500
or R7 7600?

[Rove]

No such thing as R7 7500 or R7 7600?

What it is is basically a HD 8650D with architecture improvements. That's the GPU found in the A10-6700T jsut FYI. It's the same core config and clockspeed. It has the new Kaveri architecture and HSA support and stuff though so it's a improved version in some ways but not in brute power. More in ease of use and in communication with the CPU portion of the APU.

Compare stats on wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_accelerated_processing_unit_microprocessors#.22Kaveri.22_.282014.2C_28_nm.29

It does like 550~ GFLOPS or whatever.

In comparison to a dedicated GPU it's about similar to the R7 240. It can do "dual graphics crossfire" with that card as well to provide up to double perforamcne but this is not recommended as a single R7 250X or higher would provide much higher performance at only a slightly higher price.

If you want better graphics pop the A10-7800 into the same build. It's like a R7 250 and can crossfire with it but again a R7 260X would be a better investment to add.

[David Wolfe]

引用自 Rove：

No such thing as R7 7500 or R7 7600?

What it is is basically a HD 8650D with architecture improvements. That's the GPU found in the A10-6700T jsut FYI. It's the same core config and clockspeed. It has the new Kaveri architecture and HSA support and stuff though so it's a improved version in some ways but not in brute power. More in ease of use and in communication with the CPU portion of the APU.

Compare stats on wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_accelerated_processing_unit_microprocessors#.22Kaveri.22_.282014.2C_28_nm.29

It does like 550~ GFLOPS or whatever.

In comparison to a dedicated GPU it's about similar to the R7 240. It can do "dual graphics crossfire" with that card as well to provide up to double perforamcne but this is not recommended as a single R7 250X or higher would provide much higher performance at only a slightly higher price.

If you want better graphics pop the A10-7800 into the same build. It's like a R7 250 and can crossfire with it but again a R7 260X would be a better investment to add.

i did research and found that the A8 uses a graphic called R7, when using game-debate.com
I go to CPU, I tell it I have an A8-7600 (which I didnt order yet) and when I I go to graphics, I select.

ATI/AMD -> APU FAMILY -> R7 7600

Note; I'm more likely to get an Nvidia card like a GTX 660 or above because I want to stream games to my cheap...small...android....budget....phone.............

[David Wolfe]

Right, so I don't know how this happened.
But I went from APU to Intel CPU and AMD cards.

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/QBpLf7

Friends from Reddit recommended me although I don't know if this is good enough.
I have to add the video card later because this is way over my budget.

I really liked the motherboard though...

[Rove]

The Pentium G is sporty now but it's not going to keep up in the long run. You need at least a i5 for that in a gaming rig.

I'd still just advise go for the build I linked you originally and then add in a R9 270 to it later.

That will be as good or better as that new build you just linked.

[David Wolfe]

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/wJLcmG

Don't even know when my budget stretched.

Question, does the CPU come with thermal paste pre applied?

question 2: I seen videos and the builders just put pre-applied CPU fan on top of the cpu...like do you really just put it on the CPU? no peeling stickers off?

[Rove]

If there is a sticker you better peel it off. Yes most CPU coolers come with thermal paste, pre-applied or in a tube. If it's pre-applied you make sure there is no sticker then put it on top.

1 application of thermal paste is only good for one installation, clean it and re-apply if you re-install. You may need your own tube for this.

引用自 Katzen：

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/p/wJLcmG

Also that motherboard is not meant for overclocking and the A10-6800K is a overclocking CPU.

The A8-7600 would probably still be a better idea for you since it supports fully all the socket FM2+ features you will get in a FM2+ motherboard and it's cheaper. Integrated graphics are pretty similar and also it has a new feature called HSA.

Overall not much difference either way but it'd save you like 20 GBP and also cost less electricity to run.