So are all Intel i5/i7/i9 13th/14th gen chips effectively defective?

[Iggy Wolf]

Based on some of the articles I'm recently reading, there's now talk of a class action lawsuit due to the instability of the Raptor Lake chips apparently being a manufacturing defect that's gonna result in most of them failing within the next 3-4 years. I mean, we're not talking about just a few gamer users here.

Entire companies and data centers probably have those chips. And I doubt they're just gonna take it lying down or let Intel off the hook that easily. It's crazy to think they could detect this issue earlier. People's PC's weren't BSODing or having the CPUs crash just because.

[kingjames488]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

so there's no bad microcode?

since they keep changing it and updating it prob not.

intel hasn't sent me any notifications about bad microcode...

[[-iD-]]

have any of you ever played persona?
i played it when i was about 12 or so i think. on playatation.
all of this hubub started from a rumor.
and rumors can easily be taken to extremes very easily.
thats all that game is about.
people panic and you get what some call FUD.
but its just that- untill you see intel or an actual firm put it out there... it aint true.

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

since they keep changing it and updating it prob not.

intel hasn't sent me any notifications about bad microcode...

why would they?
your mobo engineers would do that with a bios update.

and my specific mobo has said stability microcode updates in their drivers for the past year.
not for my cpu, but for others.

[kingjames488]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

intel hasn't sent me any notifications about bad microcode...

why would they?
your mobo engineers would do that with a bios update.

and my specific mobo has said stability microcode updates in their drivers for the past year.

that's not something the average user is expected to know about or do... so if they aren't informing people that it's something they need to do then all chips with the microcode issue are effectively defective products.

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

why would they?
your mobo engineers would do that with a bios update.

and my specific mobo has said stability microcode updates in their drivers for the past year.

that's not something the average user is expected to know about or do... so if they aren't informing people that it's something they need to do then all chips with the microcode issue are effectively defective products.

why would they tho? its not a widespread issue. and crashing isn't guaranteed to be caused by it. programs have issues too, and other hardware.

[kingjames488]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

that's not something the average user is expected to know about or do... so if they aren't informing people that it's something they need to do then all chips with the microcode issue are effectively defective products.

why would they tho? its not a widespread issue. and crashing isn't guaranteed to be caused by it. programs have issues too, and other hardware.

what isn't a widespread issue? the manufacturing defects or the microcode issue?

because I'm pretty sure every chip has the same microcode... so they shipped defective products... and if they don't then either perform a recall or an awareness campaign it's on them for shipping defective products.

they must be thanking their lucky stars we live in a world where they can just push out an update to down-clock their chips so they don't all fry themselves... allegedly.

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por kingjames488:

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

why would they tho? its not a widespread issue. and crashing isn't guaranteed to be caused by it. programs have issues too, and other hardware.

what isn't a widespread issue? the manufacturing defects or the microcode issue?

because I'm pretty sure every chip has the same microcode... so they shipped defective products... and if they don't then either perform a recall or an awareness campaign it's on them for shipping defective products.

they must be thanking their lucky stars we live in a world where they can just push out an update to down-clock their chips so they don't all fry themselves... allegedly.

lets get things straight here so you stop asking me which part.

i am talking about every inch of this issue.
they shipped faulty chips to a few companies so far.
if that guy is telling the truth

[Iggy Wolf]

Let's be honest. If this was a car company, they'd issue a recall because they can't afford to play dumb and coy when people's lives are on the line, but because this is merely a computer chip, they're playing stupid because they don't want to admit their production process made a mistake. They're willing apparently to risk companies and data centers suing them over this, once enough server farms get affected, until they have no choice but to admit fault, because a class action lawsuit would be leveled against them.

It's the same deal with Nvidia. They knew that the GTX 970 only had 3.5 GB of usable VRAM (the other was either not usable or too slow compared to the first 3.5) but didn't admit fault until they were sued, and had to settle in order to salvage their reputation. I doubt ANYONE would have been questioning the veracity of the claims at the time just because Nvidia didn't outright admit fault.

[Meatflaps]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

im not gonna go anywhere you say unless you post a link that ends in .edu .gov or is an official statement from intel.

You are more than welcome to stick your head in the sand, plug your ears, and ignore the literal mountains of evidence about what Intel is doing. If that makes you happy then have fun with that.

However attempting to argue with other people on the Steam forums about it will not get you anywhere.

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por Iggy Wolf:

Let's be honest. If this was a car company, they'd issue a recall because they can't afford to play dumb and coy when people's lives are on the line, but because this is merely a computer chip, they're playing stupid because they don't want to admit their production process made a mistake. They're willing apparently to risk companies and data centers suing them over this, once enough server farms get affected, until they have no choice but to admit fault, because a class action lawsuit would be leveled against them.

It's the same deal with Nvidia. They knew that the GTX 970 only had 3.5 GB of usable VRAM (the other was either not usable or too slow compared to the first 3.5) but didn't admit fault until they were sued, and had to settle in order to salvage their reputation. I doubt ANYONE would have been questioning the veracity of the claims at the time just because Nvidia didn't outright admit fault.

you realize these chips will be in big business right? and medical devices?
they would recall them if it were an issue.

[Meatflaps]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

it'll be dark day in heaven when i start taking people on the steam forum's word for important things like this.
especially when they are all basing what they are saying on a single post from nexus.

If you don't want to hear what people say on the steam forums then why are you here trying to communicate with people on the steam forums? 🤪

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por Meatflaps:

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

im not gonna go anywhere you say unless you post a link that ends in .edu .gov or is an official statement from intel.

You are more than welcome to stick your head in the sand, plug your ears, and ignore the literal mountains of evidence about what Intel is doing. If that makes you happy then have fun with that.

However attempting to argue with other people on the Steam forums about it will not get you anywhere.

what sand? my head only exists for sources.

[A&A]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

no one is infallible. there is a reason science has specific guidelines on how to handle tests.
so that it can be proven to be true.

if there is no proof then there is no truth.

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/Adressing-Manufacturing-Speculation-on-Intel-Core-13th-14th-Gen/m-p/1620097

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-on-Instability-Reports-on-Intel-Core-13th-and/m-p/1617113

Are there any problems? Yes, there are.
Do we have sheets with all the problems? I don't know if there is an "official" data shared for now

[[-iD-]]

Escrito originalmente por A&A:

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

no one is infallible. there is a reason science has specific guidelines on how to handle tests.
so that it can be proven to be true.

if there is no proof then there is no truth.

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/Adressing-Manufacturing-Speculation-on-Intel-Core-13th-14th-Gen/m-p/1620097

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-on-Instability-Reports-on-Intel-Core-13th-and/m-p/1617113

Are there any problems? Yes, there are.
Do we have sheets with all the problems? I don't know if there is an "official" data shared for now

"Speculation"

and those were for returned processors.
prob a bad batch, simple fact.

[Iggy Wolf]

Escrito originalmente por -iD-:

you realize these chips will be in big business right? and medical devices?
they would recall them if it were an issue.

Actually, they wouldn't, because they're apparently stupid enough to be willing to take the risk. Also, many businesses might still be using older chips. Especially medical devices. So they wouldn't have the problem until and if they ever get updated with them. Most non-tech based companies usually use much more dated hardware, so they wouldn't be running on the latest chips, nevermind the latest OS.