RAM Errors - on 4th kit now

[Gray Matter Guerrilla]

Solved.

Original post quoted below.

[_I_]

timings are not the same as speeds

freq in mhz, is the tick rate
cl timing is the number of ticks between read and write cycles

lower cl can make the ram respond faster, but it not always be stable
you cant just go from stock timings and increase the freq(fsb x dram) multiplier, as the default cl and other timings are much lower than at its xmp profiles
the dimms may also need higher voltage to reach those speeds and timings, which the xmp profile will also apply

[macatak]

İlk olarak Gray Matter Guerrilla tarafından gönderildi:

I've built several PC's over the years and haven't run into this issue before: I'm on my 4th RAM kit and it too has errors like those before it. All were *new* G.Skill Trident Z DDR5 6400 (CL32) 64gb kits (2 sticks).... every single kit that I've tried comes back with errors. Ran Windows Memory Diagnostics and Memtest86.

I can understand getting 1, maybe 2, kits with errors - crap happens - but I'll be on my 5th kit once I send this one back.... absolutely ridiculous imo.

So is this common nowadays? Are these resellers on Amazon, Newegg, etc. simply trying to pass off returned RAM kits as 'new'? Pure coincidence / bad luck? Or is the chip industry spiraling downward in quality control?

I'm at a point that I might just 'suck it up' and keep this error-riddled RAM b/c I'm tired of returning these stupid things.... ugh.

Wouldn't mind some opinions/advice. Thanks in advance.

Rest of specs:
13700k @ 5.4 ghz
4090
on MSI Edge (DDR5) mobo

check for BIOS updates for your mobo

[skOsH♥]

I wonder if I can just get slightly higher frequencies on my crapped out RAM. It worked for maybe a month. Gskill is crap, I would rather trust Kingston and Corsair when it comes to RAM.

Gskill yeah, used to be pretty decent. Then they kind of started making subpar RAM. Unfortunately I have a motherboard that is in perfect working order, but it only offers a few choices for DDR5-6400 @ EXPO

[Gray Matter Guerrilla]

After reading the replies, I'll probably send the G.Skill back and get either Corsair or Kingston. I'm not sure about Kingston on the MSI compatibilty list, but I know the C.Vengeance 64 gb kit was not on the list, but the 32 gb kit was....

Any good reason for that?

I would think if the 32 gb was compatible, then surely the 64 gb would be too, but I'm no expert. Regardless, I've already tried the 64gb Vengeance kit and it worked so that seems my best bet for now since so many people have confirmed my suspicion about G.Skill's quality. :(

Anyone know how many returns it takes for Amazon to flag an account? :/

Thanks for the help everyone. ;)

[Gray Matter Guerrilla]

İlk olarak Pepe tarafından gönderildi:

Sounds like a G.Skill Issue. :trolol:

[Bad 💀 Motha]

Kingston isn't a real player anymore.
Look at offering from:
Corsair, Team Group, and Crucial.

[Peter]

Don't assume running 6400 DDR5 is an easy thing. Try 6000 or 5800 DDR5 sticks, but I've got a better idea.

GSkill is certainly a quality brand but they only give you one XMP profile. This is where you are going wrong.

Kingston Fury Renegade is another high quality brand and I think much better. I say better because they give you 3 XMP profiles, which gives you so much more flexibility. You should still get their DDR5 6400 and you'll also get the following profiles....

XMP 3 will be DDR5-4800 CL38-38-38

XMP 2 will be DDR5-6000 CL32-38-38

XMP 1 will be DDR5-6400 CL32-39-39

Of course you'll also get the basic default JEDEC spec DDR5 4800 CL40-39-39.

So you see, even though you've got DDR5 6400 ram, which, I believe, your extremely average motherboard can't handle, I'm sure you'll find success with either profiles 2 or 3 and still get good performance, while saving profile 3 for a better quality 2 DIMM slot motherboard in the future.

The 13700k is a superb cpu, and it's basically not possible for it not to handle DDR5 6400. This frequency would also be super stable with the cpu and your 4090. No doubt you game at 4k resolution so getting DDR5 8000 would make sweet duck all difference at that resolution, even when comparing it to basic JEDEC 4800!!!

If you're set on MSI, I'd recommend to get the 2 DIMM slot MSI Unify motherboard {I use a Gigabyte Tachyon board myself} and Kingston Fury Renegade DDR5 6800 or 6400, it doesn't matter. These speeds will be super stable forever, and won't compromise 4k performance at all.

[udidwht]

Have the following 2nd system and it has been rock solid for 13 years now....nothing cheap about Gigabyte or G-Skill

Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.4474
Core i7 3770K
GA-Z68XP-UD3 rev 1.0 (BIOS F-10)
32GB G-Skill Trident X DDR3 F3-1600C7-8GTX
Asus RTX 2070 OC 8GB
Crucial 1TB MX-500 SSD
PNY 2 TB CS900
(x3) 1TB Mushkin RAW SSDs
LG Blue Ray Burner DL
Corsair RM-750w PSU
Rosewill Mid Tower Challenger Black
X-56 HOTAS
TrackIR 5 Pro
Inateck KU5211 USB 3.2 adapter
Oculus Quest 2
LG 34in Ultra Wide Screen (2560x1080p)
T Mobile 5G Home internet (KDV21)
Alura-tek Powered USB Hub 2.0 AUH1207F
Steam Link (Build 861)
Steam Controller
Samsung 51in LED 3D TV (1920x1080p)

[Crashed]

İlk olarak Gray Matter Guerrilla tarafından gönderildi:

I've built several PC's over the years and haven't run into this issue before: I'm on my 4th RAM kit and it too has errors like those before it. All were *new* G.Skill Trident Z DDR5 6400 (CL32) 64gb kits (2 sticks).... every single kit that I've tried comes back with errors. Ran Windows Memory Diagnostics and Memtest86.

I can understand getting 1, maybe 2, kits with errors - crap happens - but I'll be on my 5th kit once I send this one back.... absolutely ridiculous imo.

So is this common nowadays? Are these resellers on Amazon, Newegg, etc. simply trying to pass off returned RAM kits as 'new'? Pure coincidence / bad luck? Or is the chip industry spiraling downward in quality control?

I'm at a point that I might just 'suck it up' and keep this error-riddled RAM b/c I'm tired of returning these stupid things.... ugh.

Wouldn't mind some opinions/advice. Thanks in advance.

Rest of specs:
13700k @ 5.4 ghz
4090
on MSI Edge (DDR5) mobo

6400MT/sec is overclocking for the Raptor Lake processors. Did you make sure you have the latest BIOS update with Microcode 0x129 to reduce CPU instability?

Raptor Lake is rated only to 5600MT/sec, and it turns out that is only if you have a board with one memory slot per channel; two slot per channel (4 slot) motherboards are now considered good to 4400MT/sec guaranteed.

Your processor might not have an "ideal" memory controller and may not tolerate overclocking as much as one that might be less degraded.

[Bad 💀 Motha]

İlk olarak udidwht tarafından gönderildi:

Have the following 2nd system and it has been rock solid for 13 years now....nothing cheap about Gigabyte or G-Skill

Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.4474
Core i7 3770K
GA-Z68XP-UD3 rev 1.0 (BIOS F-10)
32GB G-Skill Trident X DDR3 F3-1600C7-8GTX
Asus RTX 2070 OC 8GB
Crucial 1TB MX-500 SSD
PNY 2 TB CS900
(x3) 1TB Mushkin RAW SSDs
LG Blue Ray Burner DL
Corsair RM-750w PSU
Rosewill Mid Tower Challenger Black
X-56 HOTAS
TrackIR 5 Pro
Inateck KU5211 USB 3.2 adapter
Oculus Quest 2
LG 34in Ultra Wide Screen (2560x1080p)
T Mobile 5G Home internet (KDV21)
Alura-tek Powered USB Hub 2.0 AUH1207F
Steam Link (Build 861)
Steam Controller
Samsung 51in LED 3D TV (1920x1080p)

Again, I've had plenty of Gigabyte boards for Intel 2nd/3rd/4th Gen and tons of GSkill DDR2 and DDR3. After these gens of stuff both brands went way down hill.

[Mad Scientist]

İlk olarak Gray Matter Guerrilla tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Mad Scientist tarafından gönderildi:

Probably best to use the BIOS defaulted speeds, ensure the voltage & timings are correct then test them all individually in the primary slot. If they all pass, then 2 sticks swapping which is in the main slot, if they pass again then repeat until you have a full kit. Sounds like possibly either bad settings or an actually bad DIMM slot.

Can happen sometimes as well if someone has something behind the motherboard that is contacting and shorting the board, like an extra standoff that is where it shouldn't be.

I don't think it's a bad DIMM slot. I had a 32 gb kit that tested w/ zero errors. Even tried a Corsair Vengeance 64 gb kit (6400 cl32) w/ no errors too, but I passed up on that since it was not on the motherboards compatibility list (although, the 32 gb version of same kit was on the list...which is odd).

Most compatibility lists are "we tested this ourselves and it works". Corsair memory tends to run with almost everything. Another thing you could do is use software to ensure the sticks use the same chips, mismatching chips can sometimes cause stability issues when you begin setting it to non-motherboard default speeds. They can work with different chips, but it's more likely to cause problems.

For example if half the kit is Samsung and the other half is Hynix, I have seen that cause issues before when setting it to anything other than motherboard-default ram speeds.

[Pepe]

İlk olarak Gray Matter Guerrilla tarafından gönderildi:

After reading the replies, I'll probably send the G.Skill back and get either Corsair or Kingston. I'm not sure about Kingston on the MSI compatibilty list, but I know the C.Vengeance 64 gb kit was not on the list, but the 32 gb kit was....

Any good reason for that?

I would think if the 32 gb was compatible, then surely the 64 gb would be too, but I'm no expert. Regardless, I've already tried the 64gb Vengeance kit and it worked so that seems my best bet for now since so many people have confirmed my suspicion about G.Skill's quality. :(

Yes, 100% it should work. You have intel. The other side has a lot of nice bed time stories with RAM compatibility issues.

[Gray Matter Guerrilla]

Finally got the time to run a full memtest @ standard (JEDEC) speeds and came back w/ 0 errors.
So the overclock / XMP settings are definitely causing the issue, yes? (With XMP enabled, errors did occur w/ the same sticks)
I assume this means my motherboard dislikes the higher frequency (6400) and timings.

İlk olarak Peter tarafından gönderildi:

Don't assume running 6400 DDR5 is an easy thing. Try 6000 or 5800 DDR5 sticks, but I've got a better idea.

GSkill is certainly a quality brand but they only give you one XMP profile. This is where you are going wrong.

Kingston Fury Renegade is another high quality brand and I think much better. I say better because they give you 3 XMP profiles, which gives you so much more flexibility. You should still get their DDR5 6400 and you'll also get the following profiles....

XMP 3 will be DDR5-4800 CL38-38-38

XMP 2 will be DDR5-6000 CL32-38-38

XMP 1 will be DDR5-6400 CL32-39-39

Of course you'll also get the basic default JEDEC spec DDR5 4800 CL40-39-39.

So you see, even though you've got DDR5 6400 ram, which, I believe, your extremely average motherboard can't handle, I'm sure you'll find success with either profiles 2 or 3 and still get good performance, while saving profile 3 for a better quality 2 DIMM slot motherboard in the future.

The 13700k is a superb cpu, and it's basically not possible for it not to handle DDR5 6400. This frequency would also be super stable with the cpu and your 4090. No doubt you game at 4k resolution so getting DDR5 8000 would make sweet duck all difference at that resolution, even when comparing it to basic JEDEC 4800!!!

If you're set on MSI, I'd recommend to get the 2 DIMM slot MSI Unify motherboard {I use a Gigabyte Tachyon board myself} and Kingston Fury Renegade DDR5 6800 or 6400, it doesn't matter. These speeds will be super stable forever, and won't compromise 4k performance at all.

I like that approach w/ the XMP profiles.
However, I don't see any Kingston Renegade 64gb kits at 6400mhz, only 6000mhz. Granted, that's not a huge difference in frequency so real world impact would be negligible. I am set on 64gb (2 sticks) though due to my needs.

Hmmm...decisions...decisions...

İlk olarak Crashed tarafından gönderildi:

6400MT/sec is overclocking for the Raptor Lake processors. Did you make sure you have the latest BIOS update with Microcode 0x129 to reduce CPU instability?

Raptor Lake is rated only to 5600MT/sec, and it turns out that is only if you have a board with one memory slot per channel; two slot per channel (4 slot) motherboards are now considered good to 4400MT/sec guaranteed.

Your processor might not have an "ideal" memory controller and may not tolerate overclocking as much as one that might be less degraded.

Not sure which BIOS version I have, but it's certainly not the latest; a few months old at least.
Ugh, I need to update that and be done with it... thanks for the reminder.

[Philco7a]

CPU is not fully seated in the slot. When it is crooked you get memory errors.
I used a Thermal Grizzly CPU plate to hold my 14900k perfectly flat. That factory cpu hold down bends the high end Intel CPU's. Think Gamers Nexus did a video on those CPU's bending and not fully contacting coolers.

[Peter]

Actually good news for you because Kingston Fury Renegade certainly DO come in DDR5 6400 in 64gb capacity, both rgb and non rgb, with the profiles I described. It's just that Kingston's product page is done in a counter intuitive way. Since you don't want to get a new motherboard, I think these 2 kits are undoubtedly the best for your board, because the 3 profiles will give you flexibility.

Here are the details for the rgb version. The first line is the part number

KF564C32RSAK2-64
64GB (32GB 4G x 64-Bit x 2 pcs.)
DDR5-6400 CL32 288-Pin DIMM Kit


Non rgb version.

KF564C32RSK2-64
64GB (32GB 4G x 64-Bit x 2 pcs.)
DDR5-6400 CL32 288-Pin DIMM Kit

Good luck, pricey ram though which may be hard to come by.