Dual Boot Help (solved!)

[=CrimsoN=]

So Im having some trouble creating a dual boot system. Im relatively famillar with all the steps involved and everything and I built the computer myself, but I can't seem to get Windows 10 to work correctly with Windows 7, both of which are on seperate SSDs.

I originally had Windows 10 on a single SSD with another HDD for additional space, but its irritating me with older games (even with compatbility mode) so I bought a seperate SSD for the sole purpose of having Windows 7 on it.

With Windows 10 installed already, I hooked up the new SSD and installed Windows 7 on it no problem. At first I was having problems with USB devices on Windows 7, but I messed around in the BIOS and fixed that, but the biggest problem was that the Windows Boot Manager wasnt showing up and Windows 7 kept launching by default and the only way I could get into Windows 10 on the seperate SSD was forcing it in the BIOs boot menu (pressing F11) , but I really wanted the Windows Boot Manager to show up so I downloaded some third party software to fix the Windows Boot Manager. Make a long story short, the third party software made it worse and my USB devices seemed corrupted on Windows 7, so I said screw it and just wiped Windows 10 and Windows 7 on both my SSDs with secure erase software that came with them (but not before restoring some stuff from my original Windows 10 setup).

After starting over (also cleared the CMOS, just in case), I installed Windows 10 first on an SSD and then Windows 7 on an SSD. I unplugged each one when I installed the other to see if that may help. They installed fine adn everything, but the Windows Boot Manager still wouldnt show up allowing me to select which version of Windows I wanted to run and Windows 7 launched by default. I then read somewhere that I needed to manually rebuild the number of OS detected through the Windows 10 command prompt. I did this through the Windows 10 installation software...that really made things worse...windows 7 would launch but my USB devices wouldnt work at all and Windows 10 wouldnt launch and kept doing the "Windows is setting up files" thing as if I was installing it again...

So now Ive wiped the SSDs again for a third and final try (after which if I cant get it to work then Ill just use the BIOs menu to select which drives to launch)




tl'dr So I have 2 questions:

1. Is there a guide for the proper way to install Windows 10 and Windows 7 together or if there is no guide, can anyone teach me the correct way?

2. I'm starting to think that its because I installed Windows 10 AND THEN Windows 7 which may have screwed up the boot order or something, but I didnt think it would make a difference which one I installed first.

Edit:
Mobo is an MSI z97 Gaming 5 if it matters.

[Alexalmighty502 Sup Acc]

what games do not run on windows 10? i never had a game that ran on windows 7 that did not run on windows 10

[=CrimsoN=]

Автор сообщения: Alexalmighty502 Sup Acc

what games do not run on windows 10? i never had a game that ran on windows 7 that did not run on windows 10

Skyrim for one. It has a VRAM issue on Windows 10 that I have been encountering where it can only access 4GB of VRAM (although it only really reached 3.5 on my mine). Im using a GTX 980ti which has 6GB of VRAM. This issue doesnt occur in Windows 7. The limit seems to apply to all Dx9 games, although the fault might be Nvidia:

You can read more about it here: https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/863242/geforce-drivers/-request-remove-4gb-limit-of-vram-for-dx9-games/

Im not just going off the thread either, as I have experienced the issue in game and its entirely true.

I also just like Windows 7. Always seems like a faster OS and I find it easier to navigate.

[rotNdude]

When dual booting Windows you want to install the oldest OS first and then the newest OS.

[𝕙.𝕓𝕒𝕣𝕜𝕒𝕤]

2. I'm starting to think that its because I installed Windows 10 AND THEN Windows 7 which may have screwed up the boot order or something, but I didnt think it would make a difference which one I installed first.

You should always install the oldest version of Windows first. At least this rule applies for '98,2000,XP,Vista,7,8 and 8.1

[=CrimsoN=]

Okay thanks guys. I'll try that and see if it works better.

I always just thought that it wouldn't make a difference. First time doing a dual boot system and all.

[Bad 💀 Motha]

Just install OS on it's own; to it's own drive. That way all u need is your Motherboard Boot Options Hotkey to switch driver upon boot; no need for Windows Boot Manager. Cause if one OS screwed up; it will screw up all the OS you have relying on that.

[chiefputsilao✖️ping]

trouble free dual boot system:

install one OS on an SSD. after windows activation, disconnect sata cable/power cable.
install another OS on separate SSD. after windows activation, turn off computer. reconnect first SSD.

to select OS to boot to, press your boot selector. based on the bios, it can be F2 or something.

[=CrimsoN=]

^Thats what I didnt want to have to do. I dont want to have to spam F11 every time I boot to select which OS I wanted to use. I wanted the Windows Boot Manager to work properly.

Using my BIOS boot menu is going to be my last resort if I can't get the Windows Boot Manager to work properly. At the moment, Im trying the previous suggestions of installing the older OS first (Windows 7) and then Windows 10 on the seperate SSD.

[Bad 💀 Motha]

Why would u want and/or need to hang on to Win7?
Just use one or the other and be done with it. It really is alot of trouble for nothing; especially if u you are to use the OS boot manager method.

You won't have to press F11 or whatever the boot options hotkey is for your motherboard every bootup; you set the boot order based on what drive (and ultimately OS) you wish to have boot up by default; the F hotkey boot option would just be for switching OS. Like if u were to set Win10 drive as your default, then use F key on bootup to boot into Win7 for whatever reasons.

[Hatman]

There's really no good reason to use Windows 10 at the moment other than pure curiosity or upgrading from a preinstalled Win 8.

All you get by upgrading from Win 7 are compatibility issues and a lot of advertisements in your menus ... thanks for that MS. Yeah sure it boots up faster, but how often do we reboot our computers these days.

Win10 will be there eventually but it needs more time still.

[Bad 💀 Motha]

Win10 is fine as-is; especially after the Nov2015 update.
Who uses the Menus or Tiles?
You don't even need the start menu, period. And all those ads you can disable; along with Cortana (go back to classic Windows Search) and XboxDVR, etc.

[=CrimsoN=]

Автор сообщения: Bad-Motha

Why would u want and/or need to hang on to Win7?

I already stated why in the first reply. Windows 10 has problems with allocating VRAM in DX9 based games (which is a majority of what I play). I have a 6Gb GTX 980ti and 16 GB of DDR3. Windows 10 locks my VRAM usage to 4Gb (actually about 3.5GB). This problem was not evident in previous versions of Windows. Nvidia is probably to blame, but they dont seem to be in any hurry to fix it, so instead of waiting for them, I'd like to have a seperate SSD on my computer dedicated soley to Windows 7. So that i can use my GTX 980ti to its full capacity as opposed to being limited. In general, Windows 7 is a lot more stable for older games as well even without the whole VRAM limited problem, and I also just like Windows 7 in general. Personal perference.

read more about it here: https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/863242/geforce-drivers/-request-remove-4gb-limit-of-vram-for-dx9-games/

The OP in the thread is Boris Vorontsov, the author for the popular ENB series of graphic overlays. I can confirm his claim as well.



I tried the suggested methods above by installing Windows 7 first and then Windows 10 and I still can't get the Windows Boot Menu to show up. Anyone else have some suggestions?

I don't want to use my BIOS boot menu.

[=CrimsoN=]

Alright so I think I fixed it. I followed the advice mentioned here:
http://www.tenforums.com/general-support/25744-no-windows-boot-manager-dual-boot-system-7-10-a.html

I also installed Windows 7 first and left the SSD in and then installed Windows 10. That alone didn't bring up the Windows Boot Manager, but the advice in the link in the very last reply seemed to fix it.

For reference:
Step 1
Assuming that you have already Win7 installed on your primary disk, install Win10 on your secondary disk.

Step 2
When install is done, enter your BIOS and go to the Boot section. There you should see "Windows Boot Manager" as your default boot option. Change it so that your primary disk (where you have Win7 installed) becomes your default boot option (it should be something like "P0:" followed by your disk model number, mine is "P0: ST9750423AS"). Save and restart.

Step 3
Now Win7 should start automatically (no boot manager showing up). Enter Win7, open an elevated command prompt and run
bcdboot X:\windows
where X is the Win10 system partition as seen from Win7, typically E, F, G or H.

Step 4
Restart. You should now see the Windows Boot Manager (probably the Windows 10 GUI boot manager). Select Windows 10, install your audio drivers (if you already have, I suggest you uninstall them and restart before doing this), restart and you're done.




Only problem now is that my USB devices (mouse and keyboard) wont work when I boot into Windows 7, but I think that might be because Windows 7 doesnt natively support USB 3.0, so I have to test some workarounds in the BIOS...but its weird because I was able to get into Windows 7 and use the elevated command prompt before I made the changes with bcdboot...so like wtf...

Its like a neverending train of problems. You fix one thing and another thing pops up. No wonder so many people are switching to Linux because this is absolutely ridiculous.

[=CrimsoN=]

Im starting to wonder if all this happened because Windows 7 is on an MBR disk, while Windows 10 is on a GPT disk? Does anyone know if that could cause problems?

[Bad 💀 Motha]

Like I was saying... the Win Boot Loader/Manager is a joke.
Better off having each OS on it's own drive without any one of the OS having control over the other. It just creates all sorts of issues. And if the OS that is in control of the boot loader for the other OS' has a major problem or won't boot; good luck.