Choosing thermal pad

[Spy Boy]

Hey

I heard that thermal pads are superior than paste. But I am struggling with choosing one for my PC. My CPU is i5 8400. I tried to Google but couldn't find the answer...

[Spy Boy]

OMG this talk about thermal paste and it's damaging issues kinda blew up my mind. But I never heard about thermal paste killind PC components before !

[Jamebonds1]

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

So, talk me through, how paste built up enough of a charge to fry the chip but it definetly wasn't that the conductive paste leaked out causing a short, you know, the most likely event unless you tried to build up a charge.

Killing electronics with static us remarkably hard to do, heck my dad ran a business for 30 years dealing with electronics/circuit boards with 10 engineers repairing stuff with zero esd protection beyond not being a loon and it was maybe 1 dead item every few years at worst. Since then, stuff has become wayyyy better shielded from static, I'm yet to frag anything in 20 years pretty much.

Yet you, putting conductive paste on a gpu dragged it just by being there and not because it caused a short...

I didn't put a conductive paste on my GPU with no IHS, it was silicone paste. Silicone used in anti-ESD mat, but it need not have a board slided. So, when silicone paste move, it built a little static but not enough to kill a non-sensitive chip.

As I said, there is no such as sensitive-free chip in the PC. It doesn't matter if the PC is grounded properly, ESD could still find a way to kill a PC. That is what happened to a really good $7000 PC where SATA ports card got damaged at my work.

[Monk]

NordicSpirit26님이 먼저 게시:

OMG this talk about thermal paste and it's damaging issues kinda blew up my mind. But I never heard about thermal paste killind PC components before !

In normal proper use it can't.

He was using a conductive paste of some kind and very likely screwed up causing a short.

What he did was directly on the cpu chip, not the protective heat spreader of a normal cpu.

You have pretty much zero risk even if you use a conductive paste on top of the ihs.

What he essentially had was his gpu in this position
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2498647222
so just the bare die with the cooler removed and he very likely didn't protect the components around said die and they most likely shorted (which is why I coated the pcb in nail polish to prevent this from happening should any of the liquid metal I used slip out (as it is VERY conductive) same process with my gpu but I didn't get the photos of it.

[Monk]

Jamebonds1님이 먼저 게시:

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

So, talk me through, how paste built up enough of a charge to fry the chip but it definetly wasn't that the conductive paste leaked out causing a short, you know, the most likely event unless you tried to build up a charge.

Killing electronics with static us remarkably hard to do, heck my dad ran a business for 30 years dealing with electronics/circuit boards with 10 engineers repairing stuff with zero esd protection beyond not being a loon and it was maybe 1 dead item every few years at worst. Since then, stuff has become wayyyy better shielded from static, I'm yet to frag anything in 20 years pretty much.

Yet you, putting conductive paste on a gpu dragged it just by being there and not because it caused a short...

I didn't put a conductive paste on my GPU with no IHS, it was silicone paste. Silicone used in anti-ESD mat, but it need not have a board slided. So, when silicone paste move, it built a little static but not enough to kill a non-sensitive chip.

As I said, there is no such as sensitive-free chip in the PC. It doesn't matter if the PC is grounded properly, ESD could still find a way to kill a PC. That is what happened to a really good $7000 PC where SATA ports card got damaged at my work.

Silicon paste IS conductive... And cannot build up a charge from a tiny movement to fry a chip, as in, it is impossible, you can practically zap an exposed chip with a spark abd there's a good chance it will survive.

[Jamebonds1]

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Jamebonds1님이 먼저 게시:

I didn't put a conductive paste on my GPU with no IHS, it was silicone paste. Silicone used in anti-ESD mat, but it need not have a board slided. So, when silicone paste move, it built a little static but not enough to kill a non-sensitive chip.

As I said, there is no such as sensitive-free chip in the PC. It doesn't matter if the PC is grounded properly, ESD could still find a way to kill a PC. That is what happened to a really good $7000 PC where SATA ports card got damaged at my work.

Silicon paste IS conductive... And cannot build up a charge from a tiny movement to fry a chip, as in, it is impossible, you can practically zap an exposed chip with a spark abd there's a good chance it will survive.

It could still building up static on almost any material, even conductive material while ungrounded. That is why there is a ground path or bleeder cable. It doesn't have to be zap or spark for ESD to transfering material to material.

This is what IEC talked about.
https://webstore.iec.ch/publication/4189

As I said, this doesn't mean ESD won't damaged a PC's sensitive 5V chip. I have been there when ESD damaged a grounded PC's few board.

[Monk]

Again, more unrelated stuff, and it won't and cannot build up a charge by itself.

If it could it would be perpetual energy which is not possible.

Again there is no chance to fry a cpu or mobo correctly or even incorrectly applying non conductive thermal paste to an ihs unless you go out of your way to create a charge.

Frankly, nothing you have said suggests you dudnt shirt your gpu because you weren't careful / dudnt protect the pcb using conductive paste as that makes sense, while your description is all but impossible.

That you claim to of killed multiple components with static just backs up the idea that you do not know what you are doing.

However, you have derailed the hell out of this thread and confused the op by spreading random unrelated stuff.

Admittedly it's been a long time since I studied electrical engineering but I just don't remember any case where using any kind of silicon could fry a chip on its own.

[Jamebonds1]

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Again, more unrelated stuff, and it won't and cannot build up a charge by itself.

If it could it would be perpetual energy which is not possible.

Yes, conductive material like silicone could building up a little static. That is why there is ground path and bleeder. I have more prove for you.

https://esdsystems.descoindustries.com/whitepapers/wp_introesd.html

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Again there is no chance to fry a cpu or mobo correctly or even incorrectly applying non conductive thermal paste to an ihs unless you go out of your way to create a charge.

CPU and MOBO has a sensitive chip that they could still be damaged by ESD if not grounded properly.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

That you claim to of killed multiple components with static just backs up the idea that you do not know what you are doing.

That is not what I did, I know what I'm doing. I followed a description from the product manual and somehow it damaged my GPU for no reason until I found out it was ESD that damaged it. Also, I never said I damaged multiple components, and I can't changed what I saw at my work. That would be telling OP a lie.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

However, you have derailed the hell out of this thread and confused the op by spreading random unrelated stuff.

I'm not the one that started argument, I just posted my feedback and nothing more. Your replying post is actually derailed.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Admittedly it's been a long time since I studied electrical engineering but I just don't remember any case where using any kind of silicon could fry a chip on its own.

Anyone can just called themselves as an electrical engineering, and it would not mean anything. Expert person in compliance product know more. I read IEC 61000-4-2, and it does said what I stated.

[Prof. Insanity]

I have no idea how this thread exploded like that with this pad vs sillicone vs charge stuff.
I use pads only for hardware to conduct heat in several parts, the CPU was never one of it.
During all my years I never damaged any parts with my pads or thermal paste, the only time I damaged parts was with liquid metal but this is a entirely different story compared to this two solutions which are very safe to use.
The entire point of this conduct pads is exactly that, what you talk about; Not conduct electricity but conduct heat. In what universe is it relevant if it could charge up, because there is no way it can charge up in a way it can damage parts, otherwise no one would use them in computers.

[Jamebonds1]

Prof. Insanity님이 먼저 게시:

I have no idea how this thread exploded like that with this pad vs sillicone vs charge stuff.
I use pads only for hardware to conduct heat in several parts, the CPU was never one of it.
During all my years I never damaged any parts with my pads or thermal paste, the only time I damaged parts was with liquid metal but this is a entirely different story compared to this two solutions which are very safe to use.
The entire point of this conduct pads is exactly that, what you talk about; Not conduct electricity but conduct heat. In what universe is it relevant if it could charge up, because there is no way it can charge up in a way it can damage parts, otherwise no one would use them in computers.

All I can say is I can't find any source that PC has zero sensitive chip. I have been searching for a while.

[Prof. Insanity]

Jamebonds1님이 먼저 게시:

Prof. Insanity님이 먼저 게시:

I have no idea how this thread exploded like that with this pad vs sillicone vs charge stuff.
I use pads only for hardware to conduct heat in several parts, the CPU was never one of it.
During all my years I never damaged any parts with my pads or thermal paste, the only time I damaged parts was with liquid metal but this is a entirely different story compared to this two solutions which are very safe to use.
The entire point of this conduct pads is exactly that, what you talk about; Not conduct electricity but conduct heat. In what universe is it relevant if it could charge up, because there is no way it can charge up in a way it can damage parts, otherwise no one would use them in computers.

I can't find any source that PC has zero sensitive chip, that is all I can say. I have been searching for a while.

Even so. This entire stuff you both talk about not only confuses most people, many don't even understand what is going on here anymore. The easy question turned into electric engineering science or what ever you call it, far away from the original question.
The question is solved, thermal paste is better in every aspect.

[Jamebonds1]

Prof. Insanity님이 먼저 게시:

Jamebonds1님이 먼저 게시:

I can't find any source that PC has zero sensitive chip, that is all I can say. I have been searching for a while.

Even so. This entire stuff you both talk about not only confuses most people, many don't even understand what is going on here anymore. The easy question turned into electric engineering science or what ever you call it, far away from the original question.
The question is solved, thermal paste is better in every aspect.

I did said thermal pad should only be used for silicone sensitive or where paste is not possible, and thermal paste is the better.

[WarBucks]

Im not trying to be funny, and its only tangentially relevent, but JameBond was refering to the Corona Discharge effect. Its actually pretty interesting to fry someones prototype without a zap and no path to ground

[Jamebonds1]

WarBucks님이 먼저 게시:

Im not trying to be funny, and its only tangentially relevent, but JameBond was refering to the Corona Discharge effect. Its actually pretty interesting to fry someones prototype without a zap and no path to ground

There is no corona discharge effect, it is invisible when contact discharging. I have to replaced a few computer part in work caused by ESD damage.

[A&A]

Bruh guys
We are using Liquite metals for thermal paste and you are saying that thermal pads are terrible

[Monk]

Jamebonds1님이 먼저 게시:

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Again, more unrelated stuff, and it won't and cannot build up a charge by itself.

If it could it would be perpetual energy which is not possible.

Yes, conductive material like silicone could building up a little static. That is why there is ground path and bleeder. I have more prove for you.

https://esdsystems.descoindustries.com/whitepapers/wp_introesd.html

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Again there is no chance to fry a cpu or mobo correctly or even incorrectly applying non conductive thermal paste to an ihs unless you go out of your way to create a charge.

CPU and MOBO has a sensitive chip that they could still be damaged by ESD if not grounded properly.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

That you claim to of killed multiple components with static just backs up the idea that you do not know what you are doing.

That is not what I did, I know what I'm doing. I followed a description from the product manual and somehow it damaged my GPU for no reason until I found out it was ESD that damaged it. Also, I never said I damaged multiple components, and I can't changed what I saw at my work. That would be telling OP a lie.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

However, you have derailed the hell out of this thread and confused the op by spreading random unrelated stuff.

I'm not the one that started argument, I just posted my feedback and nothing more. Your replying post is actually derailed.

Monk님이 먼저 게시:

Admittedly it's been a long time since I studied electrical engineering but I just don't remember any case where using any kind of silicon could fry a chip on its own.

Anyone can just called themselves as an electrical engineering, and it would not mean anything. Expert person in compliance product know more. I read IEC 61000-4-2, and it does said what I stated.

OK, I never said I'm an electrical engineer I said I studied it, big difference, but, again, none of what you linked is in anyway connected to the op or your issue, what did you use exactly on your gpu as simply placing thermal paste on a chip CANNOT build up a charge alone let alone enough to frag something this rubbish will freak people out who don't know, that is why I am replying.

You also mentioned having multiple dead components, I presumed you meant stuff you worked on.

Yes a mobo and cpu have chips that could be damaged by static, it's just incredibly unlikely these days unless you are actively trying to do so.

https://youtu.be/nXkgbmr3dRA

Regardless of what you say, a gpu dieing from static build up from a silicon paste being placed on the bare gpu die is all but impossible, the chance of the same electrically conductive paste squirming over the edge of the gpu due abd touching the surrounding components causing a short leading to a dead gpu makes, well, alot of sense.

Of course in this scenario, option 1 is an incredibly rare act of God, while option 2 is a reasonably common result, resulting from user error.

Heck, I'd bet you put a pea sized blob on the die abd dudnt actively spread it thinly too.

Beyond all of this, the op isn't touching a chip just the ihs.