Unsigned Drivers for New Hardware

[Polonius Ulf]

I bought two programmable gaming mice that both had unsigned driver software. No way. Hardware drivers get hooks in the OS, and even without any malicious intent very bad things can happen.

Getting drivers signed has gotten more difficult and expensive for recent versions of Windows because the vendor is paying for Microsoft or approved 3rd-party engineers to vet their software.

(Maybe Windows just has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ hardware abstraction layer. A good HAL should insulate the OS while allowing the device to implement new functions, right? And it should insulate the device from changes in the OS. I've never understood why new versions of Windows would break drivers.)

Would you override Windows Defender warnings and install unsigned drivers for new hardware?

[emoticorpse]

What mice are they?

[CursedPanther]

I mean you bought those mice becuz you trust them right? So why would you doubt the official software that accompanies them?

[mtono]

Originally posted by commerce:

I bought two programmable gaming mice that both had unsigned driver software. No way. Hardware drivers get hooks in the OS, and even without any malicious intent very bad things can happen.

Getting drivers signed has gotten more difficult and expensive for recent versions of Windows because the vendor is paying for Microsoft or approved 3rd-party engineers to vet their software.

(Maybe Windows just has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ hardware abstraction layer. A good HAL should insulate the OS while allowing the device to implement new functions, right? And it should insulate the device from changes in the OS. I've never understood why new versions of Windows would break drivers.)

Would you override Windows Defender warnings and install unsigned drivers for new hardware?

no. a virus is a bad thing and defender told you so. you can check the driver installation file with "virus total" and maybe try the driver, if it is told, that there is no virus. i wouldnt do it, but i dont have your hardware/mouse.

https://www.virustotal.com/gui/home/upload

as far as i know, "virus total" is a gooogle thing. just have a look in order to check the installer.exe.

[_I_]

if china can get the ch340 driver signed why cant the company that made your mouse?

you can use unsigned drivers, but it may have spyware/hackware built in it
it really depends on how much you would trust the company that made the software

as for the os needing different versions of drivers
yes under the hood win 7-8-10 are nearly identical, 10 has more features that win 7-8 dont, but you can install most 10 drivers on 7-8 by editing the ini/inf files and adding the lines from 10 hardware ids to 7-8 catagories

if you install the driver and notice large ammounts of internet usage while the pc is idle its dong something it shouldnt and uninstall the driver asap

1. install unsigned driver
2. reboot
3. let it set for 1+ hours
4. check nic hardware properties/statistics
if upload > download remove the driver
*make sure steam and other game clients are not set to run at boot

[Polonius Ulf]

Thanks for your help, I appreciate the effort you went to.

Why the companies that made my mice can't sign their software is a good question. I have zero intention of installing an unsigned driver and both of them went back due to false advertising: Without drivers, they are not programmable as claimed.

The thing is, I don't actually want programmable buttons. What I want is for each button to cause a distinct click event which can then be mapped to the game's controls in the usual way, but there is no such thing, apparently. That should be simple simple, and the only thing the driver should have to do is tell Windows how many buttons there are and the bit pattern that indicates each click.

Maybe the overwhelming demand is for programmable mice, or maybe Windows won't implement an abstract mouse that can have n buttons on its side of the HAL.

Linux can handle mice with eleventy-seven buttons and all you have to do is edit a text file that X reads at startup. If you want macros, you can send the clicks through xdokey.

And I just found out my favorite game is native Linux.

Again, thanks for your help. My quest for a good Windows mouse continues. I know Linux will take whatever I throw at it.

[Polonius Ulf]

Originally posted by emoticorpse:

What mice are they?

Red Dragon M913 and UtechSmart Venus gaming mouse. The latter was a nice piece of hardware and the side buttons on both map to the keyboard numbers keys, which select weapons in any shooter. But you can't change the light show, and you can't change the stupid remapping of what would be the back button to multi-click button 1.

[Polonius Ulf]

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

I mean you bought those mice becuz you trust them right? So why would you doubt the official software that accompanies them?

Good question. I wouldn't say that I trusted them. I trusted the claims and reviews on Amazon.

Signing provides insurance that a device driver at least contains no malware or bugs that will brick Windows. I trust Microsoft: I have no doubt they have made the process unnecessarily complicated and expensive to milk it for revenue.

I look forward to the day when enough people realize they don't have to put up with a grasping spyware OS adding hidden expenses to everything we use. i

[Polonius Ulf]

Originally posted by owl rly?:

Originally posted by commerce:

I bought two programmable gaming mice that both had unsigned driver software. No way. Hardware drivers get hooks in the OS, and even without any malicious intent very bad things can happen.

Getting drivers signed has gotten more difficult and expensive for recent versions of Windows because the vendor is paying for Microsoft or approved 3rd-party engineers to vet their software.

(Maybe Windows just has a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ hardware abstraction layer. A good HAL should insulate the OS while allowing the device to implement new functions, right? And it should insulate the device from changes in the OS. I've never understood why new versions of Windows would break drivers.)

Would you override Windows Defender warnings and install unsigned drivers for new hardware?

no. a virus is a bad thing and defender told you so. you can check the driver installation file with "virus total" and maybe try the driver, if it is told, that there is no virus. i wouldnt do it, but i dont have your hardware/mouse.

https://www.virustotal.com/gui/home/upload

as far as i know, "virus total" is a gooogle thing. just have a look in order to check the installer.exe.

Thanks for your help. Virus total sounds handy. I did not install the drivers and the mice are going back.

[Jessie]

If the drivers are open source, sure - check the source and build yourself.
If not, probably check it out as thoroughly as possible before deciding.

[mtono]

i am a bit too tired to read the whole thread, but i would want to mention, that whql (Windows Hardware Quality Labs) is a good thing to let windows work with the driver that is installed(campatibility). if this has been mentioned before: forgive me! a driver makes the hardware work. so the vendor has to communicate with microsoft via whql and microsoft ensures, that the driver is "whql". thats it mainly, isnt it?