next gen consoles

[Citizen Cook]

Apparently the next gen consoles (Xbox 2/PS4) will launch in 2019/2020.
My current GPU is a 1080Ti.
Do you think the next gen consoles will have GPU's better than my card?
As I understand it, the Xbox One X has the equivalent of a 1060/70 depending on who you talk to.

I know for example that I'll need to get a new motherboard and CPU because I only have an i5 4670 (3.40GHz) and the new machines will most certainly be 6-8 core beasts.

[Omega]

Absolutely nothing has been confirmed for the next-gen consoles. All we can give you are wild fantasies and speculation.

The current consoles already have "8" cores. Even the PS3 already had a 1+6 core CPU.

Your 1080 ti will most likely still be significantly faster then the APU/SoC in next-gen consoles.

To see what console tech is like currently do a Google search on the Zhongshan Subor Z+, a chinese game console using a custom AMD Ryzen APU which is about to launch.

[Rumpelcrutchskin]

Not a chance.
Current gen console graphics cards are nowhere near GTX 1070 performance, only reason they run games decent enough is because console games are heavily optimized to run on consoles and you dont need to take into account the myriad of different PC tech.

[Citizen Cook]

Rumpelcrutchskin původně napsal:

Not a chance.
Current gen console graphics cards are nowhere near GTX 1070 performance, only reason they run games decent enough is because console games are heavily optimized to run on consoles and you dont need to take into account the myriad of different PC tech.

I'm on my first console build. My original GPU was a 760. I thought that it would be fine because on paper is is more powerful than the base PS5/Xbox One.
Later to my chagrin I realised that like-for-like comparisions are hopelessly naive.

So because games are largely made for the consoles and then ported to PC's we need to make sure our rigs can handle the necessary requirements. So to get the same performance as an highly optimized console game, is there a simple equation to determine what card and CPU would be required?

[Rumpelcrutchskin]

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

So because games are largely made for the consoles and then ported to PC's we need to make sure our rigs can handle the necessary requirements. So to get the same performance as an highly optimized console game, is there a simple equation to determine what card and CPU would be required?

Not really, it depends how much work they put into the port and if the game was designed for PC as well from the start. Console games are designed to run with 30 fps, not something that most PC users will be happy with.
Good example is Monster Hunter World, runs fine on consoles but from what I heard the PC version needs pretty heavy hardware if you want 60 fps with good resolutions.

[Crac]

For me there are two questions here:
Q1. What is the console worth?

The console is highly unlikely to be sold at a loss. The hardware price, overhead from one game and a year subscription for online play should turn a profit. Console exist solely to make money for the parent company. Look into Microsoft’s Entertainment Device Division (EDD) for the finances.

The second part would be to compare vs a PC, my dig is that most people who would build aren’t going to go near a cheap power supply, crappy cooling fans, omit a SSD for the OS or use anything less than Windows.

Let’s not forget this gem:
“Microsoft Responds to 54.2% Xbox 360 Failure Rate Claim, Doesn't Dispute It”
https://gizmodo.com/5344302/microsoft-responds-to-542-xbox-360-failure-rate-claim-doesnt-dispute-it



Q2. Energy and Power?

A PC isn’t strictly better just because it costs more… Equally a PC isn’t better if it simply burns more electricity. So, are the next generation of consoles going to use similar technologies to the x86 PCs of today? I put it that the top gaming graphics card which draws more power than a console is going to have more graphics crunching goodness!!!

[Citizen Cook]

Rumpelcrutchskin původně napsal:

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

So because games are largely made for the consoles and then ported to PC's we need to make sure our rigs can handle the necessary requirements. So to get the same performance as an highly optimized console game, is there a simple equation to determine what card and CPU would be required?

Not really, it depends how much work they put into the port and if the game was designed for PC as well from the start. Console games are designed to run with 30 fps, not something that most PC users will be happy with.
Good example is Monster Hunter World, runs fine on consoles but from what I heard the PC version needs pretty heavy hardware if you want 60 fps with good resolutions.

Would it be safe to assume that if one bought a graphics card two generations above the equivalent to what is is the consoles they would hit that sweet 6fps thoughout the lifespan of those consoles?

[Sapph]

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

Would it be safe to asumme that if one bought a graphics card two generations above the equivalent to what is is the consoles they would hit that sweet 6fps thoughout the lifespan of those consoles?

Well, the XBO X and PS4 Pro use the AMD's Polaris on the gpu. This is the same architecture as what, for example, AMD Radeon RX 580 uses.

Right now, there is no gpu that is 2 generations newer than those. Barely even 1 generation.
NVidia 10 series is technically 1 generation newer, as Polaris first came when NVidia 900 series was still the newest.


Also, the gpu that XBO X uses, is dubbed as "RX590", having 2560 Stream processors where as RX 580 has 2304. But it's underclocked, thus being close to RX 580 in performance.

[愛と愛]

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

Apparently the next gen consoles (Xbox 2/PS4) will launch in 2019/2020.
My current GPU is a 1080Ti.
Do you think the next gen consoles will have GPU's better than my card?
As I understand it, the Xbox One X has the equivalent of a 1060/70 depending on who you talk to.

I know for example that I'll need to get a new motherboard and CPU because I only have an i5 4670 (3.40GHz) and the new machines will most certainly be 6-8 core beasts.

PS4 is already released.

[Citizen Cook]

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

Rumpelcrutchskin původně napsal:

Not really, it depends how much work they put into the port and if the game was designed for PC as well from the start. Console games are designed to run with 30 fps, not something that most PC users will be happy with.
Good example is Monster Hunter World, runs fine on consoles but from what I heard the PC version needs pretty heavy hardware if you want 60 fps with good resolutions.

Would it be safe to asumme that if one bought a graphics card two generations above the equivalent to what is is the consoles they would hit that sweet 6fps thoughout the lifespan of those consoles?

• CombatCipher • původně napsal:

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

Apparently the next gen consoles (Xbox 2/PS4) will launch in 2019/2020.
My current GPU is a 1080Ti.
Do you think the next gen consoles will have GPU's better than my card?
As I understand it, the Xbox One X has the equivalent of a 1060/70 depending on who you talk to.

I know for example that I'll need to get a new motherboard and CPU because I only have an i5 4670 (3.40GHz) and the new machines will most certainly be 6-8 core beasts.

PS4 is already released.

Good catch. Sorry, and corrected.

[Citizen Cook]

Sapph původně napsal:

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

Would it be safe to asumme that if one bought a graphics card two generations above the equivalent to what is is the consoles they would hit that sweet 6fps thoughout the lifespan of those consoles?

Well, the XBO X and PS4 Pro use the AMD's Polaris on the gpu. This is the same architecture as what, for example, AMD Radeon RX 580 uses.

Right now, there is no gpu that is 2 generations newer than those. Barely even 1 generation.
NVidia 10 series is technically 1 generation newer, as Polaris first came when NVidia 900 series was still the newest.


Also, the gpu that XBO X uses, is dubbed as "RX590", having 2560 Stream processors where as RX 580 has 2304. But it's underclocked, thus being close to RX 580 in performance.

I misspoke when I said generations. I'm not sure of the technical term... erm....

ok. So I have a 1080Ti. Soon the 1100 series will launch. What is the right term for that uptick?
(I was thinking two of those) So initially I had a 760 which on paper was the same as the PS4. But because PC is less efficient I needed to by a card a lot more powerful. So in fact a 900 series card is truthfully the equivalent to the PS4. Is that correct?

[Sapph]

Citizen Cook původně napsal:

I misspoke when I said generations. I'm not sure of the technical term... erm....

ok. So I have a 1080Ti. Soon the 1100 series will launch. What is the right term for that uptick?
(I was thinking two of those) So initially I had a 760 which on paper was the same as the PS4. But because PC is less efficient I needed to by a card a lot more powerful. So in fact a 900 series card is truthfully the equivalent to the PS4. Is that correct?

That is indeed generation you're thinking of.
1100 series is a next generation after 1000 series and which was the next generation after 900 series and so on.
But of course, unlike consoles, pc hardware has different performance levels.

Standard PS4 has a gpu that is about 10% weaker than Radeon R9 270. Using same architecture as it but has fewer cores at lesser speed. GTX 760 is about 10% faster than R9 270. But GTX 950 is roughly same as R9 270.
So yes, technically the 900 series is equivalent to standard PS4.

And PS4 Pro has AMD Polaris with 2304 Stream processors. This is exact same as RX480/580 but underclocked. That makes it equal to GTX 1060 3gb, when at normal full clocks it would be equal to 1060 6gb.

So:
PS4: R9 270/GTX 950
PS4 Pro: RX 480/570/GTX 1060 3gb

XBO: R7 260/360/GTX 750Ti
XBO X: "RX 590", has no real equivalent. It's more powerful than RX580 and GTX 1060 6gb, but far weaker than GTX 1070 or RX Vega 56.

[Mossy Snake]

Sapph původně napsal:

Also, the gpu that XBO X uses, is dubbed as "RX590", having 2560 Stream processors where as RX 580 has 2304. But it's underclocked, thus being close to RX 580 in performance.

It also has less (and slower) VRAM and is tacked onto a terrible CPU. The clocks are also significantly lower to the point where it's not even comparable to a 580 last I checked

Sure on paper it may look like an RX 580, but in reality it's nowhere close

[Omega]

MossyRathalos původně napsal:

Sapph původně napsal:

Also, the gpu that XBO X uses, is dubbed as "RX590", having 2560 Stream processors where as RX 580 has 2304. But it's underclocked, thus being close to RX 580 in performance.

It also has less (and slower) VRAM and is tacked onto a terrible CPU. The clocks are also significantly lower to the point where it's not even comparable to a 580 last I checked

Sure on paper it may look like an RX 580, but in reality it's nowhere close

The Xbox One X has 12gb of shared GDDR5. So technically it has more Vram then the RX 580.

The Xbone One X's Vram has a higher bitrate but lower clockspeeds. I am unsure however how this translates over to actual performance.

[Sapph]

MossyRathalos původně napsal:

Sapph původně napsal:

Also, the gpu that XBO X uses, is dubbed as "RX590", having 2560 Stream processors where as RX 580 has 2304. But it's underclocked, thus being close to RX 580 in performance.

It also has less (and slower) VRAM and is tacked onto a terrible CPU. The clocks are also significantly lower to the point where it's not even comparable to a 580 last I checked

Sure on paper it may look like an RX 580, but in reality it's nowhere close

RX 580 has 2304 Stream processors, 144 TMU, 32 ROP
While the gpu in XBO X has 2560 Stream processors, 160 TMU, 40 ROP.

And the clockspeed difference isn't very big.
The "RX590" runs at 1172Mhz
RX 580 has a boost clock of 1340Mhz.

RX 580 is using 256-bit Bus
"RX 590" has 384-bit Bus
So the memory bandwidth is higher and faster.
256 GB/s (RX 580) vs 326GB/s (XBO X gpu)

Memory speed itself indeed has decent difference:
6800Mhz (XBO X) vs 8000Mhz (RX 580)

[InfinityJosh]

I own a RX 580 4 GB and 8 GB RAM DDR3 (same as 12GB XBOX1X shared memory) .
But my PC is faster than any console for a reason:CPU.
The console CPU is a low demanding and low consumption Jaguar, which is way worse than even a R1200/i8100.
Consoles are cheap because their components are very low end (except GPU).
I think gtx 1080ti will be faster than next gen console gpu because they still plan to go with AMD which hasn't already a competitor in that tier and won't have for awhile.