New Achievements System

[Chack]

Hello, I see some people, myself included, like getting achievements from time to time, so I thought the whole achievements system could use an overhaul since compared to other platforms it feels lacking. Here are some of my suggestions:

- Points System: Different achievement would grant you points depending on how difficuly they are to get. Ex: 1p, 5p 10p etc (Also I guess you could apply 1p to all achievements for games not supported or unavailable)
- You get a specific badge with your total achievement points, the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have, to avoid exploits.
- Maybe a better showcase for Perfected Games (Could also get a badge specific for this as well)
- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC.


That's all I can think of. If you think of something else please comment. Thanks for reading ♥

[Jaunitta 🌸]

Achievements are the property and under control of the developers of that game Steam has no connection to them.
Points are acquired by buying games or when the public awards you some cannot be used to buy anything. You can also give your points away to others.
https://store.steampowered.com/points/howitworks#Title

[Nx Machina]

SAM nullifies any suggestion for achievements.

Secondly Valve provide the framework but the developers are responsible for them.

[Start_Running]

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

Hello, I see some people, myself included, like getting achievements from time to time, so I thought the whole achievements system could use an overhaul since compared to other platforms it feels lacking. Here are some of my suggestions:

So basically you want Valve to do what everyone else is doing?

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Points System: Different achievement would grant you points depending on how difficuly they are to get. Ex: 1p, 5p 10p etc (Also I guess you could apply 1p to all achievements for games not supported or unavailable)

Define difficult.
I mean lets be fair, declaring one achievement more difficult than another requires making broad assumptions as to the player's abilities.

Is an achievement that requires you to perform 3 headshots after a rocket jump harder than beating Level 1 of a Bullet Hell Shooter or normal difficulty without dying? *shrug* Seems better to just count each CHeevo as the same point value as they do now.

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- You get a specific badge with your total achievement points, the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have, to avoid exploits.

Errr...so basically you want free xp.

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Maybe a better showcase for Perfected Games (Could also get a badge specific for this as well)

Would not be opposed to something a little snazzier.

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC.

That's up to the dev/pubs.

[BJWyler]

What Start said plus there's no real need to give more value to achievements than they have now. It really sounds like you just want free points.

If you want Achievements to have more meaning, join one of the hunting groups. Each developer controls achievements for their games, so Steam doesn't have a lot of control over them. In addition, you then have the issue of achievement spamming games, and the multitude of ways that achievements can be cheesed or cheated. Of course, let's not forget to mention broken and impossible achievements.

[Start_Running]

If you want Achievements to have more meaning. Go for the ones that have meaning to you. The ones that you see specifically as a dare or challenge.

[Garou]

"- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC."

I can get behind this part of your suggestion. Just mark any achievements that are part of a DLC so it's easier to know what you have to buy.

[Quint the Alligator Snapper]

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Points System: Different achievement would grant you points depending on how difficuly they are to get. Ex: 1p, 5p 10p etc (Also I guess you could apply 1p to all achievements for games not supported or unavailable)
- You get a specific badge with your total achievement points, the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have, to avoid exploits.
- Maybe a better showcase for Perfected Games (Could also get a badge specific for this as well)

I'm not someone who cares personally for achievements that much, but these sound like neat ideas. Would make Steam's achievement system more fun.

I appreciate how you already planned for how achievements can be cheated easily and are using a separate, achievement-specific point system. This is the proper way to handle it such that it gets around the issue of having stuff ilke Steam user XP tied to various tangible benefits.

Also,

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC.

This would be very useful, yeah.

Jaunitta 🌸 eredeti hozzászólása:

Achievements are the property and under control of the developers of that game Steam has no connection to them.

This is patently untrue, given that Steam (1) hosts the achievement system infrastructure, including integrating them into profiles, and (2) already has achievement-counting mechanisms and achievement rarity displays and much more.

Nx Machina eredeti hozzászólása:

SAM nullifies any suggestion for achievements.

Please elaborate how SAM "nullifies" (whatever this means) the OP's suggestion. Because it does not.

Nx Machina eredeti hozzászólása:

Secondly Valve provide the framework but the developers are responsible for them.

And this is a proposal for Valve to alter the framework.

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

Hello, I see some people, myself included, like getting achievements from time to time, so I thought the whole achievements system could use an overhaul since compared to other platforms it feels lacking. Here are some of my suggestions:

So basically you want Valve to do what everyone else is doing?

Is there something inherently wrong with that?

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Points System: Different achievement would grant you points depending on how difficuly they are to get. Ex: 1p, 5p 10p etc (Also I guess you could apply 1p to all achievements for games not supported or unavailable)

Define difficult.
I mean lets be fair, declaring one achievement more difficult than another requires making broad assumptions as to the player's abilities.

Is an achievement that requires you to perform 3 headshots after a rocket jump harder than beating Level 1 of a Bullet Hell Shooter or normal difficulty without dying? *shrug* Seems better to just count each CHeevo as the same point value as they do now.

There are actually more feasible ways to do things that don't end up just reverting to the status quo.

1. Have game devs set different values for different achievements. They all default to the same point value though.
2. Have Steam auto-adjust achievement value based on achievement rarity. Example of a very simple calculation: Each achievement is worth a number of points equal to the reciprocal of its rarity at the time the achievement is unlocked.

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- You get a specific badge with your total achievement points, the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have, to avoid exploits.

Errr...so basically you want free xp.

The quote you quoted literally says "the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have", sir.

Steam can literally do this with a 0 xp badge that just shows the achievement point value instead.

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC.

That's up to the dev/pubs.

Actually, Valve could provide a dedicated space for this info. Right now, if game devs want to implement such information they have to include it in the achievement name or description; there's no dedicated indicator for it.

[Tito Shivan]

The answer over the question of why Steam doesn't grant trading cards over achievements is pretty much translatable to this suggestion in regards tying achievements to achievements

Do I get Trading Cards for completing achievements in game?

Trading Card drops are currently just tied to playtime within a game, independent of which achievements you are getting. We will definitely look into adding more rules for how cards are dropped in the future, but there are a few problems with in-game achievements that prevented us from using them right now. Many games have achievements that are grindy or un-fun to get, and we want the act of getting game cards to be fun for all users in games. We also don't want to push users to cheat or use achievement-unlockers in games in order to get cards, since that devalues achievements and isn't that fun either. Achievements are still valuable, and having the Achievement Showcase on your community profile is a great way to show off those rare achievements.

Assigning points to achievements for the sake of assigining them a score brings the golden question:

“Who decides how much are achievements worth?“

Which has its own inconveniences and caveats.

[Start_Running]

Quint the Alligator Snapper eredeti hozzászólása:

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

So basically you want Valve to do what everyone else is doing?

Is there something inherently wrong with that?

In this context...it kinda is. WHat others have done kinda ruined the whoile idea of achievements IMO. It's created the mind set that you needed to be rewardxed for getting an achievement as opposed to the achievement being the reward.

Quint the Alligator Snapper eredeti hozzászólása:

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Define difficult.
I mean lets be fair, declaring one achievement more difficult than another requires making broad assumptions as to the player's abilities.

Is an achievement that requires you to perform 3 headshots after a rocket jump harder than beating Level 1 of a Bullet Hell Shooter or normal difficulty without dying? *shrug* Seems better to just count each CHeevo as the same point value as they do now.

There are actually more feasible ways to do things that don't end up just reverting to the status quo.

1. Have game devs set different values for different achievements. They all default to the same point value though.
2. Have Steam auto-adjust achievement value based on achievement rarity. Example of a very simple calculation: Each achievement is worth a number of points equal to the reciprocal of its rarity at the time the achievement is unlocked.

1. And I'm sure that devs won't abuse that by making the DLC base cheevos the high value ones. I'm sure sham devs won't just give a bunch of high points to their cheevos.

2. So basically you will have your points always dropping as time goes on? It's wiorth 10 points today and whoops some more people did it. Now you're point total is 5 points less.. What. Someone figured out an in game exploit that makes the challenge easier now everyone has it? Now it's only worth 1 point. The same people who want points would be the ones pissed off and complaining the most. And if you do it so it stays fixed to the time you achieved it.. then that basically means the first person to unlock is gonna get super points for doing even the most trivial of tasks, And I'm sure that game devs won't find some scummy way to abuse that.

Quint the Alligator Snapper eredeti hozzászólása:

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

Errr...so basically you want free xp.

The quote you quoted literally says "the xp you get doesn't change depending on how many points you have", sir.

Steam can literally do this with a 0 xp badge that just shows the achievement point value instead.

Yes and they're talking about getting XOP for something you don't get XP for last I checked. Hence Free XP.

Quint the Alligator Snapper eredeti hozzászólása:

Start_Running eredeti hozzászólása:

That's up to the dev/pubs.

Actually, Valve could provide a dedicated space for this info. Right now, if game devs want to implement such information they have to include it in the achievement name or description; there's no dedicated indicator for it.

Yeah. That'll go over well. especially when you take a look at the game library and the dlc for those games... yeah. Joke is. Lots of devs already make it quite clear what cheevos require a DLC... if you actually read them.

[Sazzouu]

Nx Machina eredeti hozzászólása:

SAM nullifies any suggestion for achievements.

Cheating nullifies suggestions for CS:GO (or literally any other Multiplayer)

Social Engineering nullifies any suggestions for Steam in general

Criminal activities nullify any suggestions for humanity

Literally we all should just die rather than discussion things, am I right?

*Sarcasm off*

@Chack I would not enjoy all of your suggestions here. While shiny points are nice and all that they are some sort of evaluation in a sense that they might bring up competition about achievements. Showing rarity is enough

The rest seems acceptible to some degree

[FOXDUDE69]

I support the idea of a new achievement ecosystem. And if Valve were to remove all achievement related features from SAM users, that'd be nothing but deserved.

[Yasahi]

Quint the Alligator Snapper eredeti hozzászólása:

Chack eredeti hozzászólása:

- Something I'd personally like is to clarify in someway when an achievement is locked behind a specific DLC.

This would be very useful, yeah.

This is already possible and some developers do it. Most don't seem to care though, which is quite common with achievements in general.

FOX6NINE eredeti hozzászólása:

I support the idea of a new achievement ecosystem. And if Valve were to remove all achievement related features from SAM users, that'd be nothing but deserved.

It's impossible to accurately detect the use of SAM unless Valve adds spyware that goes around sniffing at running processes and code being executed. SAM uses the same API as the games do, the calls are identical.

[Nx Machina]

Sazzouu eredeti hozzászólása:

Cheating nullifies suggestions for CS:GO (or literally any other Multiplayer)

Blame those who create cheats and those who use them.

Sazzouu eredeti hozzászólása:

Social Engineering nullifies any suggestions for Steam in general

Social engineering has zero to do whether a suggestion will get implemented or not.

Sazzouu eredeti hozzászólása:

Criminal activities nullify any suggestions for humanity

Blame the criminals for not wanting to be part of humanity.

Sazzouu eredeti hozzászólása:

Literally we all should just die rather than discussion things, am I right?

Discussion? or affirmation only for suggestions regarding achievements which are literally dead ended by SAM.

[Nx Machina]

Eiswolfin eredeti hozzászólása:

Yup. Epic Games Store already has this kind of function that is a good example of what Valve can do with Steam.

As always you miss, each platform can have it's own system.

[Nx Machina]

FOX6NINE eredeti hozzászólása:

And if Valve were to remove all achievement related features from SAM users, that'd be nothing but deserved.

And yet you stated.

FOXDUDE69 eredeti hozzászólása:

In other words, It doesn't "negate" anything because what cheaters do with their achievements is not the concern of real gamers who unlock their achievements legitimately.

The highlights:

1) "It doesn't negate anything" in reference to SAM.

2) "because what cheaters do with their achievements is not the concern of real gamers".

And yet the irony is YOU have made it YOUR concern.