Abandoned Games

[Celebrindan]

Games that have been abandoned by their developers need to have a special notification or label in the Steam Store.

Tired of getting shafted with crap code, only to find the developers have left town and will never fix the problems.

[Start_Running]

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Seems the biggest beef people have with it is that it has a third-party launcher. Not really seeing much about the game itself. Might explain why it has a positive rating.

Seems you're somewhat familiar with this particular issue.
How is that?

I read the most recent reviews...they're right there on the store page.

[Celebrindan]

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Seems you're somewhat familiar with this particular issue.
How is that?

I read the most recent reviews...they're right there on the store page.

Evelyn Wood must be so proud.

[Daggoth]

Back to the topic: Flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

Manual dev flagging won't happen because no dev wants to put a big "don't buy me" sign on their game, and those that are genuinely abandoned won't even have devs around to flag it anyway.
Manual user flagging won't happen because it'll get abused every time the dev goes away for the weekend, expresses their desire to sleep, or blinks for too long.
Automated flagging won't happen because it has far too high a chance of catching devs who are deving their game but due to circumstances aren't able to update as often as the algorithm demands (they're doing a big rework, been in an accident, live in Ukraine, etc). - Other devs would just pop out pointless updates to reset the clock - and even then the store would contain 90% 'abandoned' games simply because they're completed and the dev have moved on.

The only real way to do it would be to have an impartial third party examine each project closely to make a determination, but that's not going to happen because it costs too much, there's no benefit for steam, and if they get it wrong it could be considered defamous.

So yeah, flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

[Celebrindan]

Daggoth の投稿を引用：

Back to the topic: Flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

Manual dev flagging won't happen because no dev wants to put a big "don't buy me" sign on their game, and those that are genuinely abandoned won't even have devs around to flag it anyway.
Manual user flagging won't happen because it'll get abused every time the dev goes away for the weekend, expresses their desire to sleep, or blinks for too long.
Automated flagging won't happen because it has far too high a chance of catching devs who are deving their game but due to circumstances aren't able to update as often as the algorithm demands (they're doing a big rework, been in an accident, live in Ukraine, etc). - Other devs would just pop out pointless updates to reset the clock - and even then the store would contain 90% 'abandoned' games simply because they're completed and the dev have moved on.

The only real way to do it would be to have an impartial third party examine each project closely to make a determination, but that's not going to happen because it costs too much, there's no benefit for steam, and if they get it wrong it could be considered defamous.

So yeah, flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

[Yukki Freeman]

my new friend の投稿を引用：

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Games that have been abandoned by their developers need to have a special notification or label in the Steam Store.

Tired of getting shafted with crap code, only to find the developers have left town and will never fix the problems.

How do you know it was abandoned?
What are your criteria for "abandonment?"
Did you also know covid happened and completely screwed up everything for a lot of developers?

sometimes the developers says that they abandon the game, for exemple the game Just Survive, was a zombie survival like DayZ, but the developers just close the servers to focus on H1Z1

[feytharn]

Yukki :3 の投稿を引用：

my new friend の投稿を引用：

How do you know it was abandoned?
What are your criteria for "abandonment?"
Did you also know covid happened and completely screwed up everything for a lot of developers?

sometimes the developers says that they abandon the game, for exemple the game Just Survive, was a zombie survival like DayZ, but the developers just close the servers to focus on H1Z1

That is obviously not what the OP is talking about. Anno 1404 was published 2009. It got a DLC but was pretty much always in a finished state. Ironically the OPs problem is that UBIsoft changed the Steam Version so it need sthe UBIsoft launcher to run - which would not have happened had they simply abandoned the game.

[Pierce Dalton]

This ain't gonna happen since it would affect sales lol.

The good thing is we can do our own research before purchasing games, if you wanna avoid games like this.

[Celebrindan]

Pierce Dalton の投稿を引用：

This ain't gonna happen since it would affect sales lol.

The good thing is we can do our own research before purchasing games, if you wanna avoid games like this.

Caveat Emptor is not the pinnacle of civilization.
It is the law of the jungle written in cursive.

[xAlphaStarOmegax]

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished, now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

[davidb11]

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished, now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

That makes no sense to claim, and would break literally everything.

[Mad Scientist]

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished, now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

There's been games in Early Access that have been really fun with continued development. Even some recently released Early Access games are better than a good amount of AAA games.

There are warnings about EAG's on their pages, users may choose to buy a game as-is which is told in the warning, and otherwise ignore the warning, but that decision is theirs. We also had the recent global event which decimated a lot of studios beyond their ability to sustain development.

It's up to you to research before buying, or to have more patience. Don't ignore Early Access warnings if you believe it might not be "finished".

[Start_Running]

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Daggoth の投稿を引用：

Back to the topic: Flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

Manual dev flagging won't happen because no dev wants to put a big "don't buy me" sign on their game, and those that are genuinely abandoned won't even have devs around to flag it anyway.
Manual user flagging won't happen because it'll get abused every time the dev goes away for the weekend, expresses their desire to sleep, or blinks for too long.
Automated flagging won't happen because it has far too high a chance of catching devs who are deving their game but due to circumstances aren't able to update as often as the algorithm demands (they're doing a big rework, been in an accident, live in Ukraine, etc). - Other devs would just pop out pointless updates to reset the clock - and even then the store would contain 90% 'abandoned' games simply because they're completed and the dev have moved on.

The only real way to do it would be to have an impartial third party examine each project closely to make a determination, but that's not going to happen because it costs too much, there's no benefit for steam, and if they get it wrong it could be considered defamous.

So yeah, flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

Yeah but again. Its the definition of abandon m8. The dev decides when the game is done and what done looks like.

Yukki :3 の投稿を引用：

my new friend の投稿を引用：

How do you know it was abandoned?
What are your criteria for "abandonment?"
Did you also know covid happened and completely screwed up everything for a lot of developers?

sometimes the developers says that they abandon the game, for exemple the game Just Survive, was a zombie survival like DayZ, but the developers just close the servers to focus on H1Z1

Yeah, and? Servers get shut down eventually. Hence why I never invest money in games that require proprietary servers to be played. That's a choice you as the consumer make.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Pierce Dalton の投稿を引用：

This ain't gonna happen since it would affect sales lol.

The good thing is we can do our own research before purchasing games, if you wanna avoid games like this.

Caveat Emptor is not the pinnacle of civilization.
It is the law of the jungle written in cursive.

No It's a basical rule. Look before you leap. Be aware of what you are buying.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished,

WHen was that? Like seriously. When?

Look into the code of just about any game and you'll find a slew of unused assets ranging from textures to entire levels. No game is ever 'finished' Its just at the point that the dev feels its worth selling. That's it. And as the consumer we are the ones who have rthe power to validate or condemn their decision by purchasing their product or declining to purchase.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

Nah. People are just so in love with self-victimization that they coinstantly blame everyone else for their bad decisions but themselves.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

Nothing to be done about it. You choose what you want to buy. Don't choose to buy 'unfinished crap' and you won't have a problem.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Daggoth の投稿を引用：

Back to the topic: Flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

Manual dev flagging won't happen because no dev wants to put a big "don't buy me" sign on their game, and those that are genuinely abandoned won't even have devs around to flag it anyway.
Manual user flagging won't happen because it'll get abused every time the dev goes away for the weekend, expresses their desire to sleep, or blinks for too long.
Automated flagging won't happen because it has far too high a chance of catching devs who are deving their game but due to circumstances aren't able to update as often as the algorithm demands (they're doing a big rework, been in an accident, live in Ukraine, etc). - Other devs would just pop out pointless updates to reset the clock - and even then the store would contain 90% 'abandoned' games simply because they're completed and the dev have moved on.

The only real way to do it would be to have an impartial third party examine each project closely to make a determination, but that's not going to happen because it costs too much, there's no benefit for steam, and if they get it wrong it could be considered defamous.

So yeah, flagging 'abandoned' games isn't happening.

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

Correct but the thing is Valve ghas long decided that they are not going to be some arbitary gatekeeper. And yeah there is goodwill lost but more good will gained by providing an abundance of choice. Giving consumers the power to decide what they want to buy as opposed to letting them choose from the things you think they should be allowed to buy.

As said. There is no such thing as abandoned. Development projects are either cancleled before release, or reach End of Life after they've been released. I mean by your logic every game released on cartidge was 'abandoned' the moment it was released.

[Celebrindan]

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

...

Yeah but again. Its the definition of abandon m8. The dev decides when the game is done and what done looks like.

A reasonable definition can be very simply included in the terms of service devs must adhere to.


...

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Caveat Emptor is not the pinnacle of civilization.
It is the law of the jungle written in cursive.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

No It's a basical rule. Look before you leap. Be aware of what you are buying.

You don't irony much do you?
What do you think the law of the jungle is, if it's not a (the) 'basical' rule?
People who inhabited caves lived by this rule.
That's why it is NOT the pinnacle of civilization.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished,

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

When was that? Like seriously. When?

Look into the code of just about any game and you'll find a slew of unused assets ranging from textures to entire levels. No game is ever 'finished' Its just at the point that the dev feels its worth selling. That's it. And as the consumer we are the ones who have rthe power to validate or condemn their decision by purchasing their product or declining to purchase.

1998.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nah. People are just so in love with self-victimization that they coinstantly blame everyone else for their bad decisions but themselves.

Glad to know you'e never been ganked by crappy code.

You must be a noob, because it's been going on ever since Devs paid-off Congress to pass the DRMA in 1998.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nothing to be done about it. You choose what you want to buy. Don't choose to buy 'unfinished crap' and you won't have a problem.

Time was when Beta Testers were people providing much needed input for developers to perfect their code, they did it for free.

Now they have to pay for the 'privilege' of 'early access'.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

Correct but the thing is Valve ghas long decided that they are not going to be some arbitary gatekeeper. And yeah there is goodwill lost but more good will gained by providing an abundance of choice. Giving consumers the power to decide what they want to buy as opposed to letting them choose from the things you think they should be allowed to buy.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

As said. There is no such thing as abandoned. Development projects are either cancleled before release, or reach End of Life after they've been released. I mean by your logic every game released on cartidge was 'abandoned' the moment it was released.

Since you mentoioned EA, you should know that Command & Conquer has been abandoned EA.

Cartridge games don't count.

The developer of a cartridge game can't come to your house and take the queens off your chessboard.

The fact that you use the word 'purchase' here shows a real lack of awareness.

You don't own anything here.

None of the games you paid money for here belong to you.

[Start_Running]

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

...

Yeah but again. Its the definition of abandon m8. The dev decides when the game is done and what done looks like.

A reasonable definition can be very simply included in the terms of service devs must adhere to.

There is a reasonable definirtion. It must be a game. That's it.
Beyond that the dev/pub as the creator is at liberty to define when they are done. If you're painting a picture You decide when you're done. No one else. If someone else wants to define when you're done, they have to contract you to paint.

In which case it's done when they say its done and we've seen countless examples of how well that doesn't work.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

...

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Caveat Emptor is not the pinnacle of civilization.
It is the law of the jungle written in cursive.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

No It's a basical rule. Look before you leap. Be aware of what you are buying.

You don't irony much do you?
What do you think the law of the jungle is, if it's not a (the) 'basical' rule?
People who inhabited caves lived by this rule.
That's why it is NOT the pinnacle of civilization.

The law of the Jungle is 'survival at all costs'.
This is more about knowing the difference between blackberry and deadly nightshade.
Again. Be aware.
DOn't buy a clearly labelled donkey and say afterwards you thought you were buying a camel.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished,

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

When was that? Like seriously. When?

Look into the code of just about any game and you'll find a slew of unused assets ranging from textures to entire levels. No game is ever 'finished' Its just at the point that the dev feels its worth selling. That's it. And as the consumer we are the ones who have rthe power to validate or condemn their decision by purchasing their product or declining to purchase.

1998.
[/quote]
Good choice m8. Pretty much every PC game released that year was chockful of unused content...including even Half-Life :P

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nah. People are just so in love with self-victimization that they coinstantly blame everyone else for their bad decisions but themselves.

Glad to know you'e never been ganked by crappy code.

You must be a noob, because it's been going on ever since Devs paid-off Congress to pass the DRMA in 1998.

You're going to have to clarify that m8 because I could find nothing relating to such thing. CItation needed.
And bad code has been a thing since code was a thing...especially in games.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nothing to be done about it. You choose what you want to buy. Don't choose to buy 'unfinished crap' and you won't have a problem.

Time was when Beta Testers were people providing much needed input for developers to perfect their code, they did it for free.

Lol no m8. WHat you're thinking about is not 'real Beta testing. Real Beta Testing is a paying job. Has been for a good few decades now. WHy because it is mind numbingly tedious work.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Now they have to pay for the 'privilege' of 'early access'.

And?
If a person decides that's what they want to spend their money on, what you think matters not.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

Correct but the thing is Valve ghas long decided that they are not going to be some arbitary gatekeeper. And yeah there is goodwill lost but more good will gained by providing an abundance of choice. Giving consumers the power to decide what they want to buy as opposed to letting them choose from the things you think they should be allowed to buy.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

As said. There is no such thing as abandoned. Development projects are either cancleled before release, or reach End of Life after they've been released. I mean by your logic every game released on cartidge was 'abandoned' the moment it was released.

Since you mentoioned EA, you should know that Command & Conquer has been abandoned EA.

WHich one?

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Cartridge games don't count.

The developer of a cartridge game can't come to your house and take the queens off your chessboard.

The fact that you use the word 'purchase' here shows a real lack of awareness.

You don't own anything here.

None of the games you paid money for here belong to you.

This has nothing about what can be done by the developer. The point is by your definition, every cartidge game would count as Abandoned, because There is literally zero support., and zero fixing the bugs and glitches.

And this is where being aware comes into play m8.
I know what I'm paying for, purchasing if you will, is not rthe game, but rather the luicense to play the game. WHich is all you've ever really been purchasing for decades anyway. The only difference was back then you couldn't really separate the game from its storage medium. NO the data and the medium are complete abstracted.


M8.
I know it's hard to grasp, but chances are if tyou keep finding yourself stuck with bad games, the faults on you for not doing a better job of researching.

[Celebrindan]

Looks like someone thinks 'Fatuous' is a virtue.
The number of self-contradicting and self-defeating statements here boggles the mind.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

A reasonable definition can be very simply included in the terms of service devs must adhere to.

There is a reasonable definirtion. It must be a game. That's it.
Beyond that the dev/pub as the creator is at liberty to define when they are done. If you're painting a picture You decide when you're done. No one else. If someone else wants to define when you're done, they have to contract you to paint.

In which case it's done when they say its done and we've seen countless examples of how well that doesn't work.

My four year old niece's answer to everything, 'I can't!'
Seems you can't come up with a single example, from your 'countless' number of them.
Why is that?

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

...


You don't irony much do you?
What do you think the law of the jungle is, if it's not a (the) 'basical' rule?
People who inhabited caves lived by this rule.
That's why it is NOT the pinnacle of civilization.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

The law of the Jungle is 'survival at all costs'.
This is more about knowing the difference between blackberry and deadly nightshade.
Again. Be aware.
DOn't buy a clearly labelled donkey and say afterwards you thought you were buying a camel.

Wrong again.
Survival of the fittest, is the law of the jungle.
The 'cost' to you is of no consequence.

So, please point to a single 'clearly labeled' 'This code is garbage!' post from a game dev.

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I honestly think the main culprit is early access, it needs to be outright removed. We need to go back to the days of when you bought a game you knew it was finished,

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

When was that? Like seriously. When?

Look into the code of just about any game and you'll find a slew of unused assets ranging from textures to entire levels. No game is ever 'finished' Its just at the point that the dev feels its worth selling. That's it. And as the consumer we are the ones who have rthe power to validate or condemn their decision by purchasing their product or declining to purchase.

1998.
[/quote]

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Good choice m8. Pretty much every PC game released that year was chockful of unused content...including even Half-Life :P

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

now devs can pump out ea games and abandon them leaving you with nothing but junk with no recourse.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nah. People are just so in love with self-victimization that they coinstantly blame everyone else for their bad decisions but themselves.

Glad to know you'e never been ganked by crappy code.

You must be a noob, because it's been going on ever since Devs paid-off Congress to pass the DRMA in 1998.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

You're going to have to clarify that m8 because I could find nothing relating to such thing. CItation needed.
And bad code has been a thing since code was a thing...especially in games.

The Digital Rights Management Act, 1998.
Made selling bad code profitable, and left the customer with no recourse once the package was opened.
Opening the package was required to use the disc to install the game.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

xAlphaStarOmegax の投稿を引用：

I dont think Steam will do anything about it though.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

Nothing to be done about it. You choose what you want to buy. Don't choose to buy 'unfinished crap' and you won't have a problem.

Your point seems to hinge on the idea that all of this is related to being an early-access participant.

This is only in your mind. I do not participate in any beta or early-access programs.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Time was when Beta Testers were people providing much needed input for developers to perfect their code, they did it for free.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

no m8. WHat you're thinking about is not 'real Beta testing. Real Beta Testing is a paying job. Has been for a good few decades now. WHy because it is mind numbingly tedious work.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

So, you're also not aware of the vast number of configurations and components personal computers come in?
And that Devs would open up Beta testing in order to see how their code would react under these different configurations?
And that it would be almost physically and financially impossible for them to do this 'inhouse'.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Now they have to pay for the 'privilege' of 'early access'.

And?
If a person decides that's what they want to spend their money on, what you think matters not.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

EULAs write both ways.
There is no 'right' to have your products available on Steam.
There is far more goodwill lost by customers than would be negated by a dev's hard feelings.
There are also far more devs who openly admit to abandoning games than some of the insisters here are willing to concede.

Correct but the thing is Valve ghas long decided that they are not going to be some arbitary gatekeeper. And yeah there is goodwill lost but more good will gained by providing an abundance of choice. Giving consumers the power to decide what they want to buy as opposed to letting them choose from the things you think they should be allowed to buy.

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

As said. There is no such thing as abandoned. Development projects are either cancleled before release, or reach End of Life after they've been released. I mean by your logic every game released on cartidge was 'abandoned' the moment it was released.

Since you mentoioned EA, you should know that Command & Conquer has been abandoned EA.

WHich one?

Yeah.
That's what I thought.

Celebrindan の投稿を引用：

Cartridge games don't count.

The developer of a cartridge game can't come to your house and take the queens off your chessboard.

The fact that you use the word 'purchase' here shows a real lack of awareness.

You don't own anything here.

None of the games you paid money for here belong to you.

This has nothing about what can be done by the developer. The point is by your definition, every cartidge game would count as Abandoned, because There is literally zero support., and zero fixing the bugs and glitches.

And this is where being aware comes into play m8.
I know what I'm paying for, purchasing if you will, is not rthe game, but rather the luicense to play the game. WHich is all you've ever really been purchasing for decades anyway. The only difference was back then you couldn't really separate the game from its storage medium. NO the data and the medium are complete abstracted.

Let me try to be clear and concise here.

STEAM DOES NOT SELL CARTRIDGE GAMES.
See how that works?

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

M8.
I know it's hard to grasp, but chances are if tyou keep finding yourself stuck with bad games, the faults on you for not doing a better job of researching.

What on Earth makes you think you're qualified to argue this position?
You demonstrate and admit to having so little knowledge of important issues that I am amazed that you think your opinion is of any value here, whatsoever.

As such this will be my last response to your misdirection, nonsense and avarice.

Have a nice day.