Jackal 2019 年 7 月 26 日 下午 12:15
If people play under an hour it shouldnt be called a review, it should be called a First Impression
Free to play games that are released are plagued with people playing 0.1 hours and then writing a negative review. If you prevented people from writing a full review and only allowed them to write a "first impression" i think it would be beneficial both to the devs and to the community, as reviews would be far more accurate, and people can see the diffirence between playing for 0.1 hour and the reviews of people who actually took the time to learn about and spend time on the game
引用自 Sleepy Yoshi

Achievements themselves can be unlocked without actually opening or playing the game as long as you own it. For free to play games, the owning part is also completely removed.

Weighing based on hours greatly favors positive reviews. After all it stands to reason the more hours you have in a game the more likely your review is to be positive. I don't see much value in exchanging one set of problems for another.

I don't see it that way. There are more than enough cases of someone having the bare minimum in required playtime (anywhere from 10-100 hours) and giving a negative review of a game. There's even cases of people playing a game for over a thousand hours and leaving a scathing, negative review. This is because they played it and had issues with it for the entire time. The fact that they do have so much playtime means their review is trustworthy. They actually know well what they're talking about. Buying a game, getting to the title screen then exiting just so you can leave a "review" and the refund after 0.1hrs of playtime is simply not a review that should hold much weight at all and I don't believe that switching to a system that lowers those reviews' weight towards a recommendation score is at all akin to "switching one problem for another".

The issue is that with a human element involved, there's never going to be a perfect solution. All you can do is minimize the amount the system can be manipulated for malicious purposes. When the new issues arise, they get tackled at that juncture.
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目前顯示第 121-135 則留言,共 139
Jackal 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:35 
引用自 gorba
Yes, please! I want to filter out people based on time especially on games like RPGs. Those games can easily take 30-40 hours just to get the "gist" of it.
I agree
On Vacation 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:41 
引用自 gorba
Yes, please! I want to filter out reviews based on time played. Especially on games like RPGs, it can take at least 20-40 hours just to get the "gist" of it.

I see no issue or harm in adding more filtering options so the user can further fine tune the reviews they want to see. However, that is quite different then excluding reviews from the aggregate score based on what could only be an arbitrary time played.
Legostyle03 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:42 
If the game crashes on startup, they may very well be unable to get more gameplay than 5 minutes, And the game crashing on startup is a fairly good reason to not recommend it.
Jackal 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:45 
引用自 Qμel
If the game crashes on startup, they may very well be unable to get more gameplay than 5 minutes, And the game crashing on startup is a fairly good reason to not recommend it.
This game didnt crash on startup, The game went down for less than 30 minutes, has had daily updates since release and 99% uptime
Jackal 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:48 
引用自 Qμel
If the game crashes on startup, they may very well be unable to get more gameplay than 5 minutes, And the game crashing on startup is a fairly good reason to not recommend it.
While I somewhat agree with you... take for example conquerers blade which charged 15$ to buy, gave out a free weekend that didnt work when you tried, and the launcher counts as played time. shortly after the game dropped its price tag and became free to play. Has postive reviews..... How does a dev essentially charging 15$ for their game, giving out a "free weekend" that doesnt work(in a clear attempt to cash grab on the lost time fallacy)after you download the entire game and then subsequently go f2p shortly after. That was a cash grab and it has positive reviews.
最後修改者:Jackal; 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 7:50
On Vacation 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 8:25 
It has positive reviews because the vast majority of it's player base came the last two months. During the free weekend the players peaked at 1,077, compared to a peak of 11,532 last month and 8,054 this month.

It's just the difference in numbers between the two time periods. I hear you though, it went on my 'not a chance in hell I'll play it" after the free weekend crap.
Jackal 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 8:28 
引用自 On Vacation
It has positive reviews because the vast majority of it's player base came the last two months. During the free weekend the players peaked at 1,077, compared to a peak of 11,532 last month and 8,054 this month.

It's just the difference in numbers between the two time periods. I hear you though, it went on my 'not a chance in hell I'll play it" after the free weekend crap.
Yeah I bought the game, and then subsequently tried to refund it because it wasnt for me... but according to steam the 2 hours I spent trying to launch the game for the f2p weekend counted as 2 hours played time so I couldnt refund, they refused to give me a refund but agreed to credit my steam wallet with the amount, and then sent it back to my card instead lol
Crazy Tiger 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 8:50 
引用自 Jackal
引用自 Crazy Tiger

Just because they have VAC bans, doesn't mean it's for using SAM. You keep on making assumptions, but that's all you've got.

But hey, let's go with it. You surely have concrete, verifiable cases of where SAM lead to a VAC ban, right?
You dont use SAM though tiger. Why are you defending it?

I don't care whether people use it and I also don't care about achievements. They hold no value, in my opinion. Therefore I disagree that a review should be weighted simply because someone has achievements. That's not just about SAM, but as a concept of a whole.

I don't see people using SAM as a bad thing. It doesn't influence me in any way, when others use it. Valve also doesn't care about it.

I also don't see myself as defending SAM, but more as trying to make sure that no misinformation gets spread. Therefore I said that it's all assumptions.

In my opinion, you're getting at it from the wrong angle. You want Steam reviews to be something they are not. They are not actual, professional reviews. Playtime hours mean very little, as do achievements. You don't need 20-40 hours to get the gist of an RPG. You don't need more than 10-15 minutes to know whether you want to keep on playing or not, and thusly whether you recommend or don't recommend the game.
Steam reviews are opinions, nothing more, nothing less. It's perfectly valid to have an opinion about a game after 10 minutes of play. I always form the major part of my opinion in the first 10-30 minutes, because that's when I decide whether I keep on playing or not. If I keep playing longer, my opinion may be expanded, but that's all.

What you, in my opinion, actually need, is something my friend Quint has mentioned before. Better filters, with sliders for minimum and maximum playtime. That way you can filter things the way you like it. It won't stop one-liners, but some things you just have to scroll past, eh.
Garou 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 8:55 
引用自 Jackal
You can bypass the initial ban by not being in a vac secured server, however a single report will lead to you being banned, vac banned if you used SAM in any VAC secured game. So many idiots out there...... When I see someone with all their achievements unlocked on the same day, they get a report. :) you can be retroactively banned for using SAM at any time as its against the steam subscriber agreement

Aren't you a great guy.
Except there is a problem with CS:GO. In 2015 (and apparently several other times) there has been an update / glitch / bug that ruined achievement data for some users by overwriting the date on all of them to the date of an update. It is also impossible to revert according to people who contacted support. So you'll be reporting someone who already is a victim and make them a double victim because of your self-righteousness.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/730/discussions/0/1741106440029599902/
https://www.reddit.com/r/GlobalOffensive/comments/5lo4uk/all_my_csgo_achievements_have_the_same_date_and/dbx7udt/

And of course there are cheap anime games that give you all achievements at the same time or when you open/close the game.

Also, threatening to report someone for having just 2000 achievements unlocked over years of gaming shows how low you are willing to go to defend your already self-derailed thread. Achievements don't even have anything to do with low playtime reviews. You just want to antagonize those who disagree with you at this point.
最後修改者:Garou; 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 9:17
Aachen 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 9:36 
引用自 Aachen
引用自 Jackal
A real legitimate review would include why they THINK its bad, not just a statement. while a review is about 50% opinion, as the gameplay experience and lots of other aspects are subjective, there are objective viewpoints about games as well.

There is quite a bit of objective information already existing on the store page for most titles. What else do you consider more appropriate to be in the user reviews instead?

This is where the “objective viewpoints” came up in the first place.

引用自 Jackal
引用自 Start_Running
.... BTW: Still waiting for those 'objective viewpoints' you mentioned.
Examples: This game has bugs. thats not subjective it either is or isnt true

This game requires you to invest a lot of time. Also not subjective etc

Software has bugs. So the statement itself, as an appropriate review topic, is banal and worthless. I won’t say that, categorically, it’s worthless to discuss bugginess relative to other titles, but that’s getting far from being “objective” at that point.

What’s more, that effort would be better invested, generally, in reporting the problems to the developer.

“The game requires you to invest a lot of time” doesn’t exactly sound objective. What’s our reference game for this?

Finally trailing off with an et cetera gives an impression you have more “objective viewpoints” you simply cannot be bothered to enumerate. Why so coy? :lunar2019piginablanket:
最後修改者:Aachen; 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 9:37
76561198407601200 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 10:42 
引用自 Jackal
引用自 The Living Tribunal

"Everyone here knows" is never a good argument point. Moving away from that, I do not rely on typed reviews personally when purchasing, I watch gameplay footage, hence my previous statement of at the end of the day a review is just someone's opinion on a game that in no way affects the game itself. A person typing up a scientific report of a review doesn't make the game itself any better or worse nor does them playing 1 hr or 100 hrs affect that outcome. You then migrated from "games played for 1 hr shouldn't be reviewed" to "a NEW game that's been out for an hr can be affected by negative reviews" are two different matters, but yet again reviews do not affect the game itself. If others were to actually educate themselves on a game as I do, then no amount of negative reviews are going to affect them purchasing the game if they themselves feel it is worth getting.

Take skyrim as an example, overwhelmingly positive reviews according to the store page. I've played about an hour of the game and did not care for it, where as edler scrolls Oblivion I've played through the entire game and expansions. Reviews had no affect on my choices for which one I played more, the gameplay itself did (among other technicalities). I can't find a game I have which has gotten mainly negative reviews, but I would again watch footage, see if it is something that I would want (not someone else) and proceed to buy and play it and determine for myself if the game is any good.
*sigh* I specifically stated FREE games. A paid game has a pay wall in the way of making alternate accounts and review bombing. free games do not

Which again if you read through my post makes no difference, free or not, reviews do not change a game.
The End 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 11:13 
引用自 Crazy Tiger
Still trying to make excuses to justify your own crappy review.

People have the right to give their personal opinion. They're not less valid than other personal opinions.
Exactly, the part he not really understand is "personal opinion" and that can be as short as "Don't like this game + thumb down.

引用自 Jackal
Sorry but Im reporting every one of you defending SAM and I hope you enjoy your ban lol
Good luck with that, a little advice, don't hold your breath.
最後修改者:The End; 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 11:38
Jackal 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 11:36 
引用自 Aachen
引用自 Aachen

There is quite a bit of objective information already existing on the store page for most titles. What else do you consider more appropriate to be in the user reviews instead?

This is where the “objective viewpoints” came up in the first place.

引用自 Jackal
Examples: This game has bugs. thats not subjective it either is or isnt true

This game requires you to invest a lot of time. Also not subjective etc

Software has bugs. So the statement itself, as an appropriate review topic, is banal and worthless. I won’t say that, categorically, it’s worthless to discuss bugginess relative to other titles, but that’s getting far from being “objective” at that point.

What’s more, that effort would be better invested, generally, in reporting the problems to the developer.

“The game requires you to invest a lot of time” doesn’t exactly sound objective. What’s our reference game for this?

Finally trailing off with an et cetera gives an impression you have more “objective viewpoints” you simply cannot be bothered to enumerate. Why so coy? :lunar2019piginablanket:
Any MMORPG for the games that take time if you would like a reference.
if you want more objective points about games you could talk about the setting, you could talk about the sounds, you could talk about the graphics, even though some people do not care about graphics, im pretty sure we can all agree objectively when graphics are good or bad.
Performance is objective, AKA this game is not optimized.
Pointing out Hardware that doesnt work with the game is also objective.
Discussing whether it is CPU or GPU intensive is objective.
Discussing how many players are playing it is objective
downtime/uptime of the server is objective.
How often it recieves updates is objective.
How many developers are working on it is objective
最後修改者:Jackal; 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 11:38
Garou 2019 年 7 月 27 日 上午 11:59 
引用自 Jackal
Enjoy your report mr hidden profile

Good luck with that. And you're now blocked, troll.
uanime5 2019 年 7 月 27 日 下午 12:57 
引用自 Jackal
Free to play games that are released are plagued with people playing 0.1 hours and then writing a negative review.

>Play free game.
>Poor controls make it impossible to play.
>Leave bad review warning others that this game is terrible.

I don't see why I should have to play a bad game for hours just so I can leave a review telling people what is obvious after 5 mins of playing this game.
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張貼日期: 2019 年 7 月 26 日 下午 12:15
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