Daikatan 30. juli 2021 kl. 23.59
Please optimize Steam more for old/weak devices that ran Steam better before updates
Starting with huge library update, when Steam moved to chromium web interface, perfomance became worse for devices that ran Steam with no problems for years before that.

E.g. my old laptop is from 2011-2012, has 4 gb ram, and only ever Steam started performing much worse after abeforementioned grand update. I can no longer launch Steam and browser (like chrome or firefox) at same time anymore there since that happen. And with each new update (like recent Downloads section in beta) it becomes worse. What's next, you'll be not able to launch any game on it soon?..

Sure, i have my main gaming desktop which is much more powerful. But i still also have use for old laptop, and there is no reason why over years it should perform worse on whatever it did excellent (e.g. running OLD and/or 2d games through Steam). And i'm sure people from some countries and/or with certain life situations are stuck with such hardware and they don't deserve, e.g. not being able to play smth despite it being totally playable some years ago just because that core platform (Steam) increases memory usage with interface revamps.

So, please consider adding super light compact option as an available alternative for best optimization.
Sist redigert av Daikatan; 31. juli 2021 kl. 0.00
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76561198407601200 31. juli 2021 kl. 0.13 
Use small mode.
Sazzouu 31. juli 2021 kl. 0.37 
You always have to ask the question the other way around...

If your machine is unable to run a launcher what games could you possibly play on it?
The answer mostly is "None" as a machine THAT weak will either be entirely unsupported by any developer / publisher.

Yes I am well aware of the existance of very old games here on Steam. But so should you be aware of the fact that it doesn't take quite more than $100 to build something better than a Laptop from 2011 with 4GBs of RAM. And even if you want something mobile... eBay and other plattforms always bring up old Laptops which you can buy in that price range that are totally fine running modern applications.

Technology evolves. You should consider following the stream rather than staying with hardware that was outdated even back in 2011 since 4GBs of RAM was an outdated standard even for Laptops in 2011 so I assume that this one was not bought off the shelves or if it was it was with big considerations in pricing.
Daikatan 31. juli 2021 kl. 1.15 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
Technology evolves. You should consider following the stream rather than staying with hardware that was outdated even back in 2011 since 4GBs of RAM was an outdated standard even for Laptops in 2011 so I assume that this one was not bought off the shelves or if it was it was with big considerations in pricing.

You are wrong in this, though. My laptop was in medium-high or low-premium price range (at least by my country's situation back then). From Dell Latitude series with Quadra gpu.

Before getting powerful desktop pc several years later, i was playing plenty of "new releases" on it just fine, including Skyrim, Life is Strange, Dead or Alive 5, RE4 HD and others.

Though nowodays if i play something on it, it's more likely would be Doom 1-2 mods or pixelart 2d.

If your machine is unable to run a launcher what games could you possibly play on it?
The answer mostly is "None" as a machine THAT weak will either be entirely unsupported by any developer / publisher.

You're missing the point. Your argument is irrevelant as you speak about new games/releases ("developer / publisher" ). While i speak about "NOT MAKING WORSE what already worked good enough for what it is."

I mean, that's still a device that runs, Crysis: Warhead without much problems (and every other <2010 aaa game, and most 2010s indie games) even if it was struggling with, e.g. Witcher 2 (which was itself more demanding than 2012-2015 releases after it i mentioned as example).

But now (after steam moving to chromium), it has 500-800 mb ram less available than it had.

something better than a Laptop from 2011 with 4GBs of RAM.

yes i *mostly* play now on my more recent desktop. But that's now what this is all about.

*I just ask steam not to worsen what already was working good enough.*

I dont expect new releases or something to be playable on my old notebook. but please dont take away what it was doing good before your interface updates...

Sist redigert av Daikatan; 31. juli 2021 kl. 1.36
Crazy Tiger 31. juli 2021 kl. 3.04 
While it would be nice, there is little point for a company to keep entertaining obsolete and outdated devices. And I say that while using a potato laptop that is just above that due to having 8GB RAM.

As always, there comes a moment to move on and if you want to keep using the service, you have to move along with it. You can't really expect a company to stagnate their plans for you.
rusty_dragon 31. juli 2021 kl. 3.53 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
You always have to ask the question the other way around...

If your machine is unable to run a launcher what games could you possibly play on it?
The answer mostly is "None" as a machine THAT weak will either be entirely unsupported by any developer / publisher.

Lots of games, old and new. You'd be surprised how much good games are there.

I'm afraid, it's you, who should ask the question other way around: Why launcher cause problems on a machine that can run Crysis? What is technology-wrong with a launcher, that it eats so much?

Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
Yes I am well aware of the existance of very old games here on Steam. But so should you be aware of the fact that it doesn't take quite more than $100 to build something better than a Laptop from 2011 with 4GBs of RAM. And even if you want something mobile... eBay and other plattforms always bring up old Laptops which you can buy in that price range that are totally fine running modern applications.

So, we just throw away perfectly capable hardware, just because of unnecessary perf requirements of a launcher software? I'd understand such say from a Uplay/Origin community. Because they are constantly mistreated by publishers, and bend under anything. But Steam client and steam service was always about caring and enabling customers. Why of a sudden you think that's a good idea to leave customers behind?

Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
Technology evolves. You should consider following the stream rather than staying with hardware that was outdated even back in 2011 since 4GBs of RAM was an outdated standard even for Laptops in 2011 so I assume that this one was not bought off the shelves or if it was it was with big considerations in pricing.
If the hardware is perfectly capable of running games, why should we throw it away? I never understood this attitude among gaming community. In the business space it's absolutely normal to use capable tech for decades. In gaming community I regularly listen this "technology evolves" thing.

I just wonder. How would you explain to a normal person, that he should stop gaming his favorite games on his absolutely capable laptop just because of a launcher update? Update that does nothing useful for him.
Sist redigert av rusty_dragon; 31. juli 2021 kl. 4.20
Daikatan 31. juli 2021 kl. 4.00 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
While it would be nice, there is little point for a company to keep entertaining obsolete and outdated devices.

Like, i understand your position, but it feels a bit like having "suicide batteries" (there is a term like that, yes) in some electronics. Aka, it suddenly becoming non- or less- functional in the future when invisible hand decides that "the time has come".

***

Also i just wanted to continue using "outdated stuff" (older game that ran fine) on "outdated harware that is perfectly fitted to it". It's just steam increasing perfomance load 4-8 times more than it was before "grand update" that is getting in a way.

***

...perhaps which is why some people prefer independence that you had with retail games not tied to servives or drm-free releases. As you can still use what you have regardless of how many years passed. Same when certain software have all available releases from 1.0 to 5.2 in repository (more often than note open source from github, but commercial and closed-source do that as well at times), so for example people continue use it on their win7 setup and others use latest version on win11. (This is also something often brought up here on Steam due to forced updates of games that sometimes break away from initial sys reqs)
Sist redigert av Daikatan; 31. juli 2021 kl. 4.13
Gwarsbane 31. juli 2021 kl. 7.17 
Use small mode
Turn off chat (don't just close it, but actually sign out of it and close it)
Go into settings > Library
Make sure Low Bandwidth Mode and Low Performance Mode are checked.

My Steam uses around 320 megs of ram and I have it running for days at a time. My CPU is from around 10 years old. Most of my PC is that old. I have a couple of newer parts that I just got last year before all the crazy price increases (500 gig SSD for main drive and RX580 (had a 5770 HD before that))

And I would suggest upgrading if all you have is 4 gigs of ram. Personally I wouldn't use anything less than 16 gigs of ram today in a machine that I game on.

If you can't upgrade right now, then you will just have to live with gaming on a potato, which is very limiting.
Start_Running 31. juli 2021 kl. 7.21 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
You always have to ask the question the other way around...

If your machine is unable to run a launcher what games could you possibly play on it?
The answer mostly is "None" as a machine THAT weak will either be entirely unsupported by any developer / publisher.
While I disagree with the OP this statement is rather false. There are PLENTY of games that can run on old and low spec hardware. Heck My system is proof of that. Its even older than the OP's I'd wager the only thing My syystem has more of is ram.


As to you OP. Small mode will work for you, as will turning low perfromance and low band width mode on.
Otherwise. Try to up your system memry to 8gigs. I mean unless your memorry is soldered on to the board you shjould be able to manage that.

Do that and you'll be good to go.
Crazy Tiger 31. juli 2021 kl. 7.22 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Daikatan:
Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
While it would be nice, there is little point for a company to keep entertaining obsolete and outdated devices.

Like, i understand your position, but it feels a bit like having "suicide batteries" (there is a term like that, yes) in some electronics. Aka, it suddenly becoming non- or less- functional in the future when invisible hand decides that "the time has come".

***

Also i just wanted to continue using "outdated stuff" (older game that ran fine) on "outdated harware that is perfectly fitted to it". It's just steam increasing perfomance load 4-8 times more than it was before "grand update" that is getting in a way.

***

...perhaps which is why some people prefer independence that you had with retail games not tied to servives or drm-free releases. As you can still use what you have regardless of how many years passed. Same when certain software have all available releases from 1.0 to 5.2 in repository (more often than note open source from github, but commercial and closed-source do that as well at times), so for example people continue use it on their win7 setup and others use latest version on win11. (This is also something often brought up here on Steam due to forced updates of games that sometimes break away from initial sys reqs)
Again, there is no reason for a company to stop development of their service just because some people decide to be stragglers. Those people make a conscious choice and due to that also make the choice to not be able to use the service anymore in the way they used to.

Such responsibility lies with the consumer, not the service provider. And when you use a service provider, you do so on their terms, not your own.
rusty_dragon 31. juli 2021 kl. 7.29 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
Again, there is no reason for a company to stop development of their service just because some people decide to be stragglers. Those people make a conscious choice and due to that also make the choice to not be able to use the service anymore in the way they used to.

Such responsibility lies with the consumer, not the service provider. And when you use a service provider, you do so on their terms, not your own.
I've thought that service is for the customer.. :lunar2020thinkingtiger:
Nx Machina 31. juli 2021 kl. 7.36 
Opprinnelig skrevet av rusty_dragon:
I've thought that service is for the customer.. :lunar2020thinkingtiger:

That "service" is part of the SSA you agree to which includes automatic updating of the client and associated services.
rusty_dragon 31. juli 2021 kl. 8.02 
Opprinnelig skrevet av Nx Machina:
Opprinnelig skrevet av rusty_dragon:
I've thought that service is for the customer.. :lunar2020thinkingtiger:

That "service" is part of the SSA you agree to which includes automatic updating of the client and associated services.
So, you say it's not really a service?
Steam doesn't need to be browser-rendered in the first place, but for whatever silly reason, Valve decided to go this route, and now we're stuck with this substandard client.

I've suggested these before and I'll say them again:

* Steam Lite Edition. Cuts out everything except for a minimal UI for launching games including the DRM check.
* Steam with modular components. Don't need browser? Don't run browser. Don't need community integrations? Don't run community integrations.
* Command-line Steam for launching games including the DRM check.

In the absence of that, there's -no-browser. If you're not sure how to add launch parameters to Steam, just ask and I can tell you how it works and what it does. FYI, it cuts out the Chromium-based nonsense.



Opprinnelig skrevet av The Living Tribunal:
Use small mode.
Better to suggest -no-browser with Small Mode, than just Small Mode by itself, which doesn't turn off the bloat.



Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
You always have to ask the question the other way around...

If your machine is unable to run a launcher what games could you possibly play on it?
The answer mostly is "None" as a machine THAT weak will either be entirely unsupported by any developer / publisher.

Yes I am well aware of the existance of very old games here on Steam.
I doubt OP cares to play the latest AAA games, but Steam's catalogue is actually quite extensive, with a number of gems dating back over a decade, including such games as Recettear and Aquaria.

In fact, some of those games (such as Recettear) were basically made for those older machines in the first place.

Like I said to you in the other thread (that just got locked), this situation highlights the problem where the games can run fine but the launcher is the problem. Quite the opposite result compared to the intention, for a DRM layer that's supposed to be lightweight and nonintrusive.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Sazzouu:
But so should you be aware of the fact that it doesn't take quite more than $100 to build something better than a Laptop from 2011 with 4GBs of RAM. And even if you want something mobile... eBay and other plattforms always bring up old Laptops which you can buy in that price range that are totally fine running modern applications.

Technology evolves. You should consider following the stream rather than staying with hardware that was outdated even back in 2011 since 4GBs of RAM was an outdated standard even for Laptops in 2011 so I assume that this one was not bought off the shelves or if it was it was with big considerations in pricing.
OP already mentioned that OP has a more recent machine.

But if there's old hardware capable of running stuff, why are you arguing for obsolescence for the sake of it...just for a DRM launcher?



Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
Again, there is no reason for a company to stop development of their service just because some people decide to be stragglers. Those people make a conscious choice and due to that also make the choice to not be able to use the service anymore in the way they used to.
But the problem is that this is making games that did actually work on the computer just fine (and don't require compatibility with a server or other external hardware/software) inaccessible.

Put another way, it's DRM being DRM.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
Such responsibility lies with the consumer, not the service provider.
Yeah, which is why as a practical matter it's probably better for the consumer to just tweak the games to work without Steam on the old machine, rather than expect Valve to make magic happen.

But, doesn't hurt to ask.
Sist redigert av Quint the Alligator Snapper; 31. juli 2021 kl. 8.46
Nx Machina 31. juli 2021 kl. 8.48 
Opprinnelig skrevet av rusty_dragon:
So, you say it's not really a service?

It runs as a "service" on your PC whenever you boot Steam.

2. LICENSES ⏶

A. General Content and Services License

Steam and your Subscription(s) require the download and installation of Content and Services onto your computer. Valve hereby grants, and you accept, a non-exclusive license and right, to use the Content and Services for your personal, non-commercial use (except where commercial use is expressly allowed herein or in the applicable Subscription Terms). This license ends upon termination of (a) this Agreement or (b) a Subscription that includes the license. The Content and Services are licensed, not sold. Your license confers no title or ownership in the Content and Services. To make use of the Content and Services, you must have a Steam Account and you may be required to be running the Steam client and maintaining a connection to the Internet.

For reasons that include, without limitation, system security, stability, and multiplayer interoperability, Steam may need to automatically update, pre-load, create new versions of or otherwise enhance the Content and Services and accordingly, the system requirements to use the Content and Services may change over time. You consent to such automatic updating. You understand that this Agreement (including applicable Subscription Terms) does not entitle you to future updates, new versions or other enhancements of the Content and Services associated with a particular Subscription, although Valve may choose to provide such updates, etc. in its sole discretion.
Sist redigert av Nx Machina; 31. juli 2021 kl. 8.51
Crazy Tiger 31. juli 2021 kl. 8.49 
Opprinnelig skrevet av rusty_dragon:
Opprinnelig skrevet av Crazy Tiger:
Again, there is no reason for a company to stop development of their service just because some people decide to be stragglers. Those people make a conscious choice and due to that also make the choice to not be able to use the service anymore in the way they used to.

Such responsibility lies with the consumer, not the service provider. And when you use a service provider, you do so on their terms, not your own.
I've thought that service is for the customer.. :lunar2020thinkingtiger:
People use the word service for "aftercare" and often only think of that, but that's not the only meaning the word has.
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