It's time to rewrite Steam client from scratch

[goldpanlacking]

I always hated web-based applications, HTML and CSS were meant for making web-sites (even with web-sites CSS usually requires a lot of ugly hacks to achieve desired result), not for making program interfaces. Having an embedded web-browser (usually an ugly chromium) in your application makes it very slow and consumes a ton of RAM, especially on low-end machines.

Steam doesn't need all that mess, Steam is a very simple application that simply runs your games and also allow you to chat with your friends and what not. I think it would be so much better if it was made using a more reasonable framework, Qt for example.

I'm sick and tired of Steam's ugly and slow web-based interfaces. Anyone agree?

[Zekiran]

..... Yeah you go right ahead and tell the people who've been doing this site for 17 years how to do it. I'm sure that you have way more experience in dealing with a hundred-million user service like this. No problem dealing with the mass of data, the security issues, and the like, in addition to writing all the UI and making sure that all the various services are handled properly.

It being "ugly" is in the eye of the beholder. It does use ram if you let it. If you research and actually figure out how to use the Settings menu, on the other hand, you can radically drop usage and move on with your life.

Yes, its backend could probably use some sleeking down but right now, it's using chrome and isn't going anywhere else.

[goldpanlacking]

I'm sorry if that sounded rude. I'm just sharing my thoughts as a user and i'm not judging anyone. Having 5 such applications running is like having 5 separate Chrome browsers open, I just think that web shoudn't be used for apps.

[Start_Running]

unforseen consequencer původně napsal:

I always hated web-based applications, HTML and CSS were meant for making web-sites (even with web-sites CSS usually requires a lot of ugly hacks to achieve desired result),

I dunno what you mean by 'ugly hacks' m8. I mean sure the code never looks pretty but the results are the key.

not for making program interfaces. Having an embedded web-browser (usually an ugly chromium) in your application makes it very slow and consumes a ton of RAM, especially on low-end machines.

this is a YMMV situation. On the other hand its a sacrifice of perfomance in exchange for a easy multiplatform solution. Something you don't have to rewrite for every single platform.

Steam doesn't need all that mess, Steam is a very simple application that simply runs your games and also allow you to chat with your friends and what not. I think it would be so much better if it was made using a more reasonable framework, Qt for example.

Can QT also manage a dynamic store interface as well. See the reason why web interfaces are so popular is in fact because they are universal. The people doing the coding and maintaining it have looked at many alternatives. But it boils down to what works.

I mean. You talk about it being slow yet it performs in a ruiather spritely fashion on my 12 year old potato rig. ANd how much ram it takes up seems to vary from person to person based on their settings.. Also that ram usage is likeely not what you think it is.

I'm sick and tired of Steam's ugly and slow web-based interfaces. Anyone agree?

* Ugly? Is your personal assessment. You can reskin the interface into something more preferable if you want. Tools are right there.

* Slow? Thats your PC. Others experience a fast responsive interface.

Anyone agree? Some will I don't and I doubrt most will. Since for most the client just performs well enough.

unforseen consequencer původně napsal:

I'm sorry if that sounded rude. I'm just sharing my thoughts as a user and i'm not judging anyone. Having 5 such applications running is like having 5 separate Chrome browsers open, I just think that web shoudn't be used for apps.

Why?

[goldpanlacking]

Start_Running původně napsal:

I dunno what you mean by 'ugly hacks' m8. I mean sure the code never looks pretty but the results are the key.

For example, try to center a block element vertically on the page without using flexbox. There is a lot of problems with CSS, just look at the questions at stackoverflow. HTML/CSS is not intended for interfaces. The only reason it's being used is low entry threshold and ease of learning.

Start_Running původně napsal:

this is a YMMV situation. On the other hand its a sacrifice of perfomance in exchange for a easy multiplatform solution. Something you don't have to rewrite for every single platform.

Qt is also a multi-platform solution. Programs written in Qt work under Windows, Linux, MacOS and even on mobile devices and embedded systems.

Obviously, there are some parts of Steam that should be in web, for example Steam Store and Community Hub. But making Library, Settings and Friends List as web-pages is bad.

Old library was a lot better and i don't like this "webification" of everything that's happening to Steam.

[nullable]

You're free to have your opinions. The software industry seems to disagree though. Web based applications have a lot of benefits, and despite your issues, real or imagined, those may not outweigh the benefits.

I think you'll fine that demand from users to move away from web based applications is non-existent compared tot he whole. But you're free to write your own software however you like.

[Satoru]

You do realize that literally every gaming client on the planet uses a CSS based GUI right?

You do realize that without an embedded browser you'd be unable to view any web content in the client right?

You do realize that the Discord/Twitch/Slack are all chromium based right?

[Quint the Alligator Snapper]

Didn't this previously use a Visual GUI thing?

I think that's still used in Small Mode, but Small Mode is but a pale shadow of features like List View.

It's far more responsive than browser-based rendering of stuff. Browsers are built to be able to do anything, but they do no one thing as efficiently as can dedicated UI code.

Ideally, Steam would have a text-based version that can be run solely via command line, with no UI elements that can't be rendered outside of just text and ASCII art. Though, a streamlining of the client into something more responsive would be a good step in general.

[Start_Running]

unforseen consequencer původně napsal:

Start_Running původně napsal:

I dunno what you mean by 'ugly hacks' m8. I mean sure the code never looks pretty but the results are the key.

For example, try to center a block element vertically on the page without using flexbox. There is a lot of problems with CSS, just look at the questions at stackoverflow. HTML/CSS is not intended for interfaces. The only reason it's being used is low entry threshold and ease of learning.

Ddfine a class as follows:

.vertical-center {
  margin: 0;
  position: absolute;
  top: 50%;
  -ms-transform: translateY(-50%);
  transform: translateY(-50%);
}

Apply it to the element you want vertically centered.

Any other questions? And yeah they were literally designed for interfaces actually. HTML is at its core a markup langauge,designed to instruct the iterpreting program as to how to display a collection of elements. CSS is a further enhencement that stadardized and enhanced the level of control and fidelity one has in defining and displaying elements.

What is an interface beyond a collection of elements on a screen.

I also don;'t know why you consider the fact that there are a bunch of questions on STack Overflow a bad signs. THats like, literally whart stackoverfloaw exists for. For people who are less experienced to ask questions of those with more experience.

Start_Running původně napsal:

this is a YMMV situation. On the other hand its a sacrifice of perfomance in exchange for a easy multiplatform solution. Something you don't have to rewrite for every single platform.

Qt is also a multi-platform solution. Programs written in Qt work under Windows, Linux, MacOS and even on mobile devices and embedded systems.

Obviously, there are some parts of Steam that should be in web, for example Steam Store and Community Hub. But making Library, Settings and Friends List as web-pages is bad.

Old library was a lot better and i don't like this "webification" of everything that's happening to Steam.

Ahh so basically you're just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ about the library UI. Might surprisie but the library was kinda always Web-based.

[nullable]

I thought it was funny him arguing because dumb CSS questions exist on stackoverflow that means CSS isn't intended for UI design. And my first thought was, so all the dumb C++ questions means C++ isn't intended for application development then? And in fact no bit of technology is intended for anything functional because there's endless amount of newb level questions about every sort of subject.

[CELL_BE]

I agree this update is absolute ♥♥♥♥. I’d rather have a diarrhea dog take a lava dump all over my screen. But valve will not listen to us. I don’t use Steam anymore for this reason and I’m only on here from time to time to see if anything has changed but it looks like things have gotten worse. OP I recommend you start looking for alternatives.