New Library = Skewed Reviews
Adding the review button to the new library system has ridiculously skewed the positive review rating of old games.

Fanboys playing bad games 5 years past their expiration date are offsetting the legitimate review scores by like 30%

Reviews should be weighted by the number of reviews you've posted or something.

Also, written reviews should be a separate/optional system. A simple Yes/No vote is sufficient for most "reviewers". Especially with this new system, I've seen a ton of people just writing "Yes" in the box.
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 14h33
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Start_Running a écrit :
And how do you acalculate game progress hmm?

Achievements, maybe.

Start_Running a écrit :
Its not that the laws are slow, its that they have to be applied intelligently. Remember how well prohibition and the temperence movement turned out?

I can't see gamers forming a Mafia to get loot boxes back, lol
The only reason these laws are failing is because mega-corporations are paying off corrupt governments. Kinda like how ActiBlizzard is defending the Chinese government, but in reverse.

Start_Running a écrit :
Or just having a good game. And no. The majority of games released in the last decade have in fact been more towards single-player and couch-co-op. You are once again using your own bias, and emotional wording to make up for the weak argument. This only highligghts the weakness of your argument.

This is utter delusion on your part. In fact, I can't even believe you could actually believe what you're saying there. You have to be going out of your way to argue just for the sake of arguing at this point. But go ahead and compile a list of games released in the last year (you could go full decade, if you really want) and what % of them have multiplayer.

Start_Running a écrit :
So by that logic, solitair, and freecel are also gambling simulators. As is tetris.

Generally, card games are considered gambling, why is that surprising? They even have solitaire in casinos... Tetris isn't, because you're guaranteed to lose at that.

Start_Running a écrit :
MMR isn't something you wager. It is simply a ranking system...you know something that you use to track your general skill ranking in a game as compared to other players.

A. That's not true
B. That's not relevant
C. Even if !A and/or !B, that doesn't disprove the analogy

Start_Running a écrit :
WOW. I mean, just wow. I mean when that seems like a more plausible exoplanation than 'people just like games that I don't' you have a serious ego problem.

You're about on par with that crazy lady arguing in favor of loot boxes. SURPRISE GAMBLING

Start_Running a écrit :
Actually they did not.They disabled "off-topic review bombing". A patche that affects gameplay, and alters game mechanics , and balance, especially in a multiplayer game is considered to be on-topic. Keep trying.

They can PR it however they want, but that's not what they did. They also didn't do the anything when ACU got a positive off topic review bomb. Because money.

Start_Running a écrit :
Well someone like that wouldn't be trying to tell you the best airline... you have to have experience with at leasrt two . But this is a case of someopne saying they had a good/bad experience on their first flight and recommend others try it or avoid it. 'Best' isn't in the picture here.

Airline Noob: You should try airline A, it was great!

Airline Pro: Yea, but airline B costs half as much, every seat is first class, they include a 3course meal, and they even finish the flight with a happy ending! Also, airline A murders kittens to fuel its planes.

See the problem?

Start_Running a écrit :
But we have seen that your arguments are based entuirely on a combination of

Based on objective fact? Indeed

Start_Running a écrit :
ALl that has happened is people arfe being reminded about recommenduing games they've spent time in and some are deciding to

Except its only being applied to people who are still playing games 1,000 years past their release date, which is long past when mass feedback is given, and is hyper skewing the reviews towards positive fanboyism, compounded by Steam featuring recent reviews.
Dernière modification de Strai; 7 nov. 2019 à 11h57
(Strai) a écrit :
Tito Shivan a écrit :
Thankfully one can downvote not helpful reviews and report the ones that don't belong or violate the rules.

Too bad the downvote system was nerfed so hard that, especially when paired with time gated reviews, it now does literally nothing.
It was not. The number of downvotes is just hidden.
The only thing that was nerfed was the weight of the votes for accounts that massively spam them.
Tito Shivan a écrit :
It was not. The number of downvotes is just hidden.
The only thing that was nerfed was the weight of the votes for accounts that massively spam them.

Look at the top 5 reviews on PUBG right now.
Their helpful ratings are 152, 44, 117, 72, 391.

Ranking reviews based on those numbers makes no sense. Either the system is completely broken, or the system is based on nonsensically hidden data that it considers a priority, which I would still consider broken.

Even if that wasn't the case, the removal of visible feedback made it impossible to track engagement, or value the legitimacy of review claims.
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 14h50
(Strai) a écrit :

Look at the top 5 reviews on PUBG right now.
Their helpful ratings are 152, 44, 117, 72, 391.
Those are the review upvotes, not ratings. Since the system shows reviews made in the last 30 days by default it's normal for them to have a reduced number of votes.
Dernière modification de Tito Shivan; 3 nov. 2019 à 14h36
Tito Shivan a écrit :
Those are the review up votes, not ratings. Since the system shows reviews made in the last 30 days by default it's normal for them to have a reduced number of votes.

The issue isn't the reduced number of votes, it's that the number of votes is all out of order. Based on that "sorting", there could theoretically be a hyper helpful review with 10,000 upvotes that isn't being shown. And, with the time gated reviews, which you also just mentioned, that's basically guaranteed to happen, on top of the bad sorting. Broken.
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 14h38
(Strai) a écrit :
The issue isn't the reduced number of votes, it's that the number of votes is all out of order. Based on that "sorting", there could theoretically be a hyper helpful review with 10,000 upvotes that isn't being shown. And, with the time gated reviews, which you also just mentioned, that's basically guaranteed to happen, on top of the bad sorting. Broken.
Because reviews are sorted by helpfulness ratio, not number of upvotes.

You can sort reviews as you like. You can find your 10.000 upvotes review if you choose to watch all time reviews and not just 30 days.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/578080/reviews/?browsefilter=toprated&snr=1_5_100010_

The very first of the list. And it took it two years to get more than 10.000 upvotes. That's 400 upvotes a month for two years. It really puts the number of the 30 day old into perspective.
If the most helpful review ever got +400 upvotes a month for two years straight on average, a two week old review with +100 upvotes show a pretty good level of engagement for a review.

You might be overestimating the engagement levels with reviews given those numbers and your assumptions about them.
Dernière modification de Tito Shivan; 3 nov. 2019 à 14h53
Tito Shivan a écrit :
You can sort reviews as you like. You can find your 10.000 upvotes review if you choose to watch all time reviews and not just 30 days.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/578080/reviews/?browsefilter=toprated&snr=1_5_100010_

That page just further proves my points (quite literally proved the hidden 10k review hyperbole).
- The numbers are way out of whack, because they're sorted based on imaginary hidden data.
- The most helpful review is hidden from the main page.
- Based on that page, it completely changes the review appeal of the game. The top positive review has 10,000 votes while the top negative only has 400 (yet there are a few under it with 6,000), meaning the general consensus is positive even if the review score isn't. (Which also supports being able to simply thumbs up/down a game, without having to write a review)
- The current system is just broken and objectively worse than the old one. They should have just fixed the bots and memes and left the rest be.
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 19h10
(Strai) a écrit :
They should have just fixed the bots and memes and left the rest be.
And that's what they did.
literally havent played since they did this...each time i go to my library im jus discouraged lol

i cant even view all my games...i click n click and nothing fkn happens...can only see recent

its so bad i literally just say oh well n move on lol yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
Dernière modification de 8mob8; 3 nov. 2019 à 15h15
Tito Shivan a écrit :
(Strai) a écrit :
They should have just fixed the bots and memes and left the rest be.
And that's what they did.

I'm just gonna take that as an admission of defeat, because that is certainly not what they did.
(Strai) a écrit :
Tito Shivan a écrit :
And that's what they did.

I'm just gonna take that as an admission of defeat, because that is certainly not what they did.
It is. Meme reviews got the funny vote so people didn't need to upvote them instead.
Bots got their vote weight nerfed and or negated. Removing the number of downvotes was a necesity so bots couldn't know if their votes were 'working' or not.

This is not a competition to see who's right. I'm replying to your posts with more data so other thread readers have the most info to form their own opinion when reading it.
Tito Shivan a écrit :
It is. Meme reviews got the funny vote so people didn't need to upvote them instead.

That was a change long before this other lump of changes hit. If I'm not mistaken. And meme reviews are still a problem.

Tito Shivan a écrit :
Bots got their vote weight nerfed and or negated. Removing the number of downvotes was a necesity so bots couldn't know if their votes were 'working' or not.

Security through obscurity is bad and ineffective, and in this case irrelevant to boot.

Tito Shivan a écrit :
This is not a competition to see who's right. I'm replying to your posts with more data so other thread readers have the most info to form their own opinion when reading it.

"that's what they did". Yes, thanks for that super insightful insider knowledge.

Also, even though I would argue they didn't fix the problem (there's probably still bots, there's definitely still memes), the more important part was "leave the rest be".
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 19h11
cac420 a écrit :
i cant even view all my games...i click n click and nothing fkn happens...can only see recent

Is it bugged? My library list still functions mostly the same, aside from having a homepage and a fancier per game page.
Dernière modification de Strai; 3 nov. 2019 à 15h30
Start_Running a écrit :
Current Peak Name
300,640 667,826 Counter-Strike: Global Offensive
261,828 604,088 Dota 2
143,221 196,352 Destiny 2
130,567 545,720 PLAYERUNKNOWN'S BATTLEGROUNDS
64,072 118,937 Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six Siege
60,796 69,869 Team Fortress 2
53,343 85,878 Warframe
52,804 120,489 Grand Theft Auto V
41,635 63,082 Rust
41,140 56,399 ARK: Survival Evolved
40,961 56,330 Rocket League
30,800 52,981 Dead by Daylight
28,525 35,579 7 Days to Die
27,480 36,474 Sid Meier's Civilization VI
24,312 40,367 Source SDK Base 2013 Multiplayer
23,599 30,181 Sid Meier's Civilization V
23,547 28,238 PAYDAY 2
23,448 40,426 Garry's Mod
23,413 31,997 Terraria
21,391 38,466 Football Manager 2019
21,173 59,648 MONSTER HUNTER: WORLD
18,531 26,192 Unturned
18,063 26,306 Total War: WARHAMMER II
17,749 18,914 FINAL FANTASY XIV Online
16,846 26,533 Hearts of Iron IV
16,676 33,066 Dota Underlords
15,981 20,960 Fallout 4
13,144 16,896 Stellaris
13,076 21,493 War Thunder
12,971 24,116 Football Manager 2020
12,923 15,736 The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Special Edition

Not seeing many 'gambling simulators'

As stated by the other user, many of these top games are in-fact "gambling simulators". That being that they offer a simulated form of the thrill of gambling. I'm going to go off on a bit of a tangent here, more directed at this subject as a whole than yourself.

A lot of people are misinformed as to what gambling is and does. (possibly including yourself, it seems) If gambling is really such an optional choice, why is it illegal for even 18~20 year olds? You can choose to die for your country or be in a porno, but not gamble. There's a reason for that. Perhaps you should pull yourself up a documentary on gambling addiction and give it a nice watch! I'm not trying to be condescending or anything either, if you don't have a compulsive personality, it's hard to understand! No one is a bad person for not fully grasping the risk of a problem that can't personally hurt them. Nor is anyone a bad / dumb person for falling to gambling addiction.

Gambling is highly addictive. It is in no way, shape, or form "optional." It's like saying people who are force fed pain pills by their doctors have the "option" of getting addicted to them when their prescription ends. Yes, it's possible to resist, it's possible to be naturally resistant and get off them without breaking a sweat. But the people who fall into it are victims, who are being manipulated. Not "fools" making a "bad choice" to be abused and taken advantage of. Genetic and behavioral predisposition makes addictive things much harder for some people to resists than others.

Even as a 27 year old adult, I refuse to play games with lootboxes as I have problems with gambling addiction in real life, and video games simulate the exact same experience in their randomized reward mechanisms. Every single game with them is designed to force you into the gambling system in one way or another. Giving you "freebies" before snatching them away harshly, limiting key aspects of the game behind it, or adding in massive grinds / time sinks to circumvent it.

There is a giant gap between a game that is itself addicting, and a game that abuses addiction to create an impulsive spending habit around a randomized mechanism. It's true, most games are addicting, and this creates a false sense of safety around gambling games. The key difference is, typical addicting games have the "addiction hit" within the core gameplay loop, where as "gambling" games have that addiction hit hidden behind a randomized mechanism that can't be easily / consistently access from within the gameplay loop. You are not rewarded for playing the game, you are rewarding for "gambling". Many of these games actually try their hardest to deny you any consistent satisfying reward within the gameplay elements, so you feel frustrated and resort to gambling for a feeling of reward instead. This creates a payoff-reward link with the gambling mechanism, not the gameplay. This is what makes a game a "gambling simulator".

I love addicting games. Check my playtime on Steam, I have hundreds, and even thousands of hours in some very addicting games. I have a very compulsive personality. But I can't play "gambling" games. I just can't. Even if I don't ever spend money, It's SO frustrating having to resist it pushing you to do something you struggle to resists constantly. It's like trying to quit smoking, and these games are blowing smoke in your face every few minutes, waving around a fresh pack. It's not really so much about "making a choice" as it is sustaining self-imposed impulse control.

Everyone has the right to make their decision on where they spend their time and money, I'm not saying these games are bad, or you have to defend your right to like or play them. But one should not minimize the potential risks of these systems within games. A number of countries have already classified these systems as gambling, and many others are considering it. There's a reason for that, and it's always best to be as informed as possible as a consumer!
(Strai) a écrit :
...snip...

People like games you don't. ANd People also dislike games you like. Also people like older games, some of us actually prefer them and that means there's always a market for good older games. That's what GoG initially built themselves on. So no. Ratings aren't being skewed. they are simply changing to reflect how players feel about it. That's reality. Deal with it.

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Posté le 2 nov. 2019 à 17h12
Messages : 48