Benchmark/measurement for games/hardware Steam feature.

[emoticorpse]

I'm assuming Steam has some sort of database of what hardware is registered with each account. If that is the case it'd be cool to create a database per game and like a list of the most popular setups of people who own that game and/or maybe a voluntary only way of participating in the database record where you can choose to run some kind of benchmark so that other people can judge how each hardware setup does for each game. Just an idea. I know hardware well enough but a lot of times so many people ask about what hardware to get and in response to that will be fifty different suggestions/opinions that may just cause further confusion to those asking. Would be nice to get a nice trusted reliable answer directly from the most popular gaming platform.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Wouldn't work as hardware is not the only thing taken into account.

As for a type of spec check on the store pages, that will never happen due to indemnification. MS even tried it and failed.

[emoticorpse]

Escrito originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Wouldn't work as hardware is not the only thing taken into account.

As for a type of spec check on the store pages, that will never happen due to indemnification. MS even tried it and failed.

:qr:

What else would be taken into account?. Just asking for conversation and wondering if we're thinking of the same kind of implementation of my idea.

Hadn't heard of Microsoft trying this, but not surprised it failed if they failed the privacy factor of it.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Software, overclocking, temps...

MS tried the spec check on their PC store and it failed because it was wrong most of the time.

[emoticorpse]

Escrito originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Software, overclocking, temps...

MS tried the spec check on their PC store and it failed because it was wrong most of the time.

:qr:

Well, In what I had in mind, all that wouldn't really hurt the charts. Bottom line is that it's about what percentage of people have that hardware and the frame rates they get. That's the only thing that really matters. Too much information like temps and overclocks would lead a non-experienced person right back where they started...confusion because of too many factors and information. I say only thing they need to look at is the hardware and the resulting fps from the benchmark or whatever. I think this info would be much appreciated a bit more than the simple "minimum/recommended" specs. I mean who even decides what minimum is and what recommended is?. What fps is there, what settings, what resolution?. It's be nice if technical information like this was available for each game. Oh well, just an idea.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

With games like Final Fantasy XV, it would be impossible as that game even has issues on the best and most powerful rigs out there.

[Start_Running]

Escrito originalmente por emoticorpse:

Escrito originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Wouldn't work as hardware is not the only thing taken into account.

As for a type of spec check on the store pages, that will never happen due to indemnification. MS even tried it and failed.

:qr:

What else would be taken into account?. Just asking for conversation and wondering if we're thinking of the same kind of implementation of my idea.

Hadn't heard of Microsoft trying this, but not surprised it failed if they failed the privacy factor of it.

Software - The software you have open at the time of running the game, the processes in your system tray, the background processes that start up with your OS... and of course drivers. And that's just the legit stuff. There's also the matter of malware.

Temperature - Most hardware like CPU's and Processors work to keep themselves in an optimal savfe range. WHen they get hot they throttle back. EIther reducing their clock cycles, their voltage, or both. This means if your fans and heatsinks aren't properly dusted and maintained you'll hit those throttle points more often and that will impact performance. Not having sufficient cooling or heck just being in a place with a high ambient temp and no AC will tick your temps higher.

There are many features which make it impossible to realistically determine performance. But each person with a little effort and practice learns how their system stacks up against the presented specs.

There's also the matter that developers never say what level of settings are possible with any given level of specs. So just because it will run at minimum specs doesn't lean it will look or sound good.

[emoticorpse]

Escrito originalmente por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

With games like Final Fantasy XV, it would be impossible as that game even has issues on the best and most powerful rigs out there.

:qr:

Well, that's great then. I mean that's exactly the kind of real results that Steam could provide everybody and without opinion and bias. They could say well all two thousand people that own this game have a i9 and a 2080 ti and got 29 fps, and so people could be like well, I'm not buying an i9 and a 2080 ti and anything less would be less fps, so no way. I guess I won't buy it until one day I end up getting that hardware.

[emoticorpse]

Escrito originalmente por Start_Running:

Escrito originalmente por emoticorpse:

What else would be taken into account?. Just asking for conversation and wondering if we're thinking of the same kind of implementation of my idea.

Hadn't heard of Microsoft trying this, but not surprised it failed if they failed the privacy factor of it.

Software - The software you have open at the time of running the game, the processes in your system tray, the background processes that start up with your OS... and of course drivers. And that's just the legit stuff. There's also the matter of malware.

Temperature - Most hardware like CPU's and Processors work to keep themselves in an optimal savfe range. WHen they get hot they throttle back. EIther reducing their clock cycles, their voltage, or both. This means if your fans and heatsinks aren't properly dusted and maintained you'll hit those throttle points more often and that will impact performance. Not having sufficient cooling or heck just being in a place with a high ambient temp and no AC will tick your temps higher.

There are many features which make it impossible to realistically determine performance. But each person with a little effort and practice learns how their system stacks up against the presented specs.

There's also the matter that developers never say what level of settings are possible with any given level of specs. So just because it will run at minimum specs doesn't lean it will look or sound good.

And all that is complicated. Every single pc has so many different types of stuff running but the beauty of this system is that it takes the ratio of the population and makes sense out of things by simplifying it by just hardware. If Steam did a benchmark on 5,000 pc's for the game Tomb Raider most of them should get relatively similar good benchmarks. I mean sure there's probably the 5% that have severe malware infections and hardware issues, but they really shouldn't be representing the majority of the population of gaming pcs.

[Brian9824]

Escrito originalmente por emoticorpse:

I'm assuming Steam has some sort of database of what hardware is registered with each account. If that is the case it'd be cool to create a database per game and like a list of the most popular setups of people who own that game and/or maybe a voluntary only way of participating in the database record where you can choose to run some kind of benchmark so that other people can judge how each hardware setup does for each game. Just an idea. I know hardware well enough but a lot of times so many people ask about what hardware to get and in response to that will be fifty different suggestions/opinions that may just cause further confusion to those asking. Would be nice to get a nice trusted reliable answer directly from the most popular gaming platform.

WIll never happen.

1. Steam does not have a database of what hardware you have.
2. Even with the best hardware your drivers are a MASSIVE factor
3. Even the exact same graphic card can vary in performance based on manufactuer
4. Steam isn't going to be liable for saying xxx hardware can run a game well and then finding out it can't.

There is already a 3rd party site that spends a lot of time working on nothing but that, and requires a scan of your PC - https://www.systemrequirementslab.com/cyri

[Brian9824]

Escrito originalmente por emoticorpse:

Escrito originalmente por Start_Running:

Software - The software you have open at the time of running the game, the processes in your system tray, the background processes that start up with your OS... and of course drivers. And that's just the legit stuff. There's also the matter of malware.

Temperature - Most hardware like CPU's and Processors work to keep themselves in an optimal savfe range. WHen they get hot they throttle back. EIther reducing their clock cycles, their voltage, or both. This means if your fans and heatsinks aren't properly dusted and maintained you'll hit those throttle points more often and that will impact performance. Not having sufficient cooling or heck just being in a place with a high ambient temp and no AC will tick your temps higher.

There are many features which make it impossible to realistically determine performance. But each person with a little effort and practice learns how their system stacks up against the presented specs.

There's also the matter that developers never say what level of settings are possible with any given level of specs. So just because it will run at minimum specs doesn't lean it will look or sound good.

And all that is complicated. Every single pc has so many different types of stuff running but the beauty of this system is that it takes the ratio of the population and makes sense out of things by simplifying it by just hardware. If Steam did a benchmark on 5,000 pc's for the game Tomb Raider most of them should get relatively similar good benchmarks. I mean sure there's probably the 5% that have severe malware infections and hardware issues, but they really shouldn't be representing the majority of the population of gaming pcs.

That would provide no benefit at all, you can't just look at hardware and ignore software. Doing so would just result in people being told their PC could run it but finding out they can't.

That's not to mention there are variability in parts. A PC with 32gb of ram for instance has lots of variability in how it performs based on the manufacturer of the RAM, its speed, etc. Someone running a GTX 1070 has variability based on what VERSION of the 1070 they run, and even the manufacturer build date of the 1070 can effect performance.

There are literally MILLIONS of combinations of hardware/software that come into play.

[Start_Running]

Escrito originalmente por emoticorpse:

And all that is complicated. Every single pc has so many different types of stuff running but the beauty of this system is that it takes the ratio of the population and makes sense out of things by simplifying it by just hardware.

And thusly it would be potentially misleading. With the liability on hand Valve would be an idiot to try. There is a reason literally no store does this. Because if they say a consumer can run a game when they can't then they get in trouble. If they say a customer can't run a game when they in fact can then they get into even bigger trouble.

If Steam did a benchmark on 5,000 pc's for the game Tomb Raider most of them should get relatively similar good benchmarks.

And again whuch 5000 is going to be key.

I mean sure there's probably the 5% that have severe malware infections and hardware issues, but they really shouldn't be representing the majority of the population of gaming pcs.

Oh it doesn't even take anything severe. It can be just a lot of minor little things. Misconfigured ram, here, an undested fan there. Hence why the simplest solution is to simply learn your PC. Take a little time to get to know the quirks of your machine and you'll find out just what you can run and where you can cheat the specsa.

[Gwarsbane]

Look up something called the silicon lottery. Basically it means 2 identical chips can run differently. And this is not limited to just CPUs, GPUs, RAM, Chipsets on motherboards.

Seriously if you could put 2 computers together, both with the exact same hardware and exact same software, they would actually score differently in bench marking.

This would open up Valve to lawsuits by the game developers because if they are wrong, and they say "your system can't run this game" but it actually can, that is lost money for the developer.

Oh and no you don't even have to have malware on your system for it to be slowed down. anti-virus programs will do it and so will other programs that require DRM to run where the DRM is actually active even when the game is not. This doesn't include all the little programs that people have running like cpu-z, speedfan, gpu-z, drivers for your keyboard, drivers for your video card, drivers for your sound card (either built in or stand alone).

There are just too many things for Valve to take into consideration, that keep changing and interact with each other in different ways that they might not if other software is running or not running.

So know your own computers specs, look at the specs that are on every single games page at the bottom. and if your specs are close to the minimum, I suggest don't bother, and maybe wait till you get a computer upgrade.


Course you could have found all this out had you used the search feature cause its been asked for many times.

[emoticorpse]

I see what everybody is saying and still respectfully disagree and I'll explain why. I mean, I wouldn't see a feature like this as Steam answering people's question about hardware anymore than the minimum/recommended system is already there to answer it. People themselves advise on what hardware to get. Not sure exactly why Steam should get sued or be reliable for telling someone what hardware to get when other people are already doing it and hot held accountable. Also, I mean I wouldn't really see it as Steam telling somewhere what hardware to get. It's just a chart of what everybody else has and how it performs so that others can analyze it and take it into consideration. It's just more information to help the decision making process. I know some people have the attitude "information hurts" but are they really better off with less information?. In my opinion no. I mean if somebody actually looks at the chart and says "ok, this Steam is promising me that this hardware will work if I buy it" then the issue is them. Also the important thing about this is it analyzes hardware before you purchase it and then find out your hardware is too weak to run the games you want.

Escrito originalmente por Gwarsbane:

So know your own computers specs, look at the specs that are on every single games page at the bottom. and if your specs are close to the minimum, I suggest don't bother, and maybe wait till you get a computer upgrade.


Course you could have found all this out had you used the search feature cause its been asked for many times.

My computer is fine and I know what hardware I need to run the games I want. Reason I'm talking about this system is for people that don't know hardware good enough.

[curley60]

Anything would be better than "Can You Run It". It disqualified my processor for almost all games and recommended I buy an AMD 8350. I'm running a Core i7 990Extreme which beats any non Ryzen CPU at stock speeds. So if steam were to have a benchmark database it should include all cpus, not just the ones you can still buy. It should measure the actual running speed of the cpu, overclocked or not. The real benchmark is just running the game and measuring the FPS, CPU, and GPU.