Windows 7 Support Ending - Refunding my Entire Library?

[InfernusMatrix]

So let me get this straight, my games that run fine on Windows 7 I can no longer access past a certain point? If this is the case I will be talking to my bank and refunding my entire games library. I have zero interest in upgrading my hardware or Operating system.

Does this not violate consumer or anti-trust laws?

When I started using Steam I never agreed for them to control what hardware and operating system I can use, especially considering all of the games I play support Windows 7.

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez TurtleShroom:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

But you and others are insisting on looking at this in the worst way possible. Steam isn't BLOCKING you, they're not taking your games, they're not stealing anything. They are simply moving forward with what they think is the best direction as a game platform. And, yeah I understand their reasoning.

Valve is not stealing any games or license keys. However, they are retroactively blocking people with old operating systems from accessing what they already own. This is VERY different from them just stop updating the W7 client and, a few years from now, their version of "Google Chrome" is so different from the W7's version that it can't load. That is how organic deprecation works, but this is forced obsolescence and nothing else.

Here's an example of organic deprecation: for years, I used "Mozilla Firefox" V29 because the update after that broke a Super Mario Theme I had on the browser. Until about 2020 AD, I could load almost eveyr conceivable website. After a while, more and more sites were inaccessible outright because of their ceritficates and what-not. Eventually, it reached where I am today, in which the browser is useless. Firefox is on, what, its fifty-ninth edition or so? If I wanted to access modern websites, I could update, but that was not forced on me by Mozilla. Technology marched on and websites organically updated their capacity.

THAT IS WHAT VALVE SHOULD BE DOING.

As a W7 ueser, I accept that eventually the Steam client's browser won't load at all, but that will hapen organically, and when it happens, it happens.

THIS IS A KILL SWITCH.

Valve is retroactively inserting a kill switch into its software to punish people who refuse to update their OS by revoking access to their games. Since very few people seem to understand the difference between dropping support and punishing users, I will reiterate: no one is expecting Steam to continue being updated and made compatible with "Windows XP", "Windows VII", or what have you. What they are expecting is to be able to continue to access their games, regardless of whether or not the Steam Community and its browser can load anything from the future.

I don't see it as being different from your website example at all. People using an older version of CEF on an operating system that effectively reached its lifecycle end 8 years ago will gradually be losing access to more and more services, and in 2024 Steam will b one of them. In fact Valve is keeping that older version of CEF 4 years after the extended retirement date, where other services have already dropped it. How is this not gradual?

They're not inserting a killswitch. A killswitch implies a device (or code) to intentionally shut off a product under certain conditions. Do you honestly think the 2024 update is being done with the intention of keeping people from being able to buy their games? NO WAY. How does Valve profit by cutting off even 1% of its user base? It's being done with the intention of continued development of their platform, which unfortunately is changing the minimum requirements to use it.

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Stiletto:

Początkowo opublikowane przez TheBasedSociety:

snip

I like how you omit what I said so you don't actually have to respond to it. Nobody who is on Windows 7 feels it is a socially superior choice. It is a personal choice we have made for a variety of reasons. You and yours who sneer at us for not upgrading to your choice of operating system are the ones insulting and degrading us for refusing to conform to YOUR standards.

I know...you're a cultist, and cultists never look in the mirror.

Not at all. Nobody is sneering at you, but you certainly seem to be sneering at the ones trying to explain how nobody is being robbed. Not to mention calling those you don't agree with cultists, as if they were fanatically devoted to Windows 10. They're not. They've simply moved on with changes.

I see you've been around a while, longer than me even which is impressive. Did you claim that the windows XP users were cultists sneering at the Win98 users? Did you upgrade then? Were you upset when Steam stopped working on XP, or did it not effect you because you were already on Win7? If so, were you in fact a Win7 cultist then? Are you now a win7 cultist? Or does it just not make sense to go flinging around blanket labels like that?

Change happens. You've seen it. Things stop working on older operating systems, including Steam, for reasons of security, DRM, and cost. Valve isn't trying to cut anyone off, but they want to move forward in what they see as the best way of doing so, whether or not we understand or agree with their reasons.

[bidulless]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Stiletto:

I like how you omit what I said so you don't actually have to respond to it. Nobody who is on Windows 7 feels it is a socially superior choice. It is a personal choice we have made for a variety of reasons. You and yours who sneer at us for not upgrading to your choice of operating system are the ones insulting and degrading us for refusing to conform to YOUR standards.

I know...you're a cultist, and cultists never look in the mirror.

Not at all. Nobody is sneering at you, but you certainly seem to be sneering at the ones trying to explain how nobody is being robbed. Not to mention calling those you don't agree with cultists, as if they were fanatically devoted to Windows 10. They're not. They've simply moved on with changes.

I see you've been around a while, longer than me even which is impressive. Did you claim that the windows XP users were cultists sneering at the Win98 users? Did you upgrade then? Were you upset when Steam stopped working on XP, or did it not effect you because you were already on Win7? If so, then are you in fact a Win7 cultist? Are you now a win7 cultist? Or does it just not make sense to go flinging around blanket labels like that?

Change happens. You've seen it. Things stop working on older operating systems, including Steam, for reasons of security, DRM, and cost. Valve isn't trying to cut anyone off, they want to move forward in what they see as the best way of doing so, whether or not we understand or agree with their reasons.

Hello
Agree with most points but sincerly, do you honnestly think it's normal or a good situation and attitude ?

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Not at all. Nobody is sneering at you, but you certainly seem to be sneering at the ones trying to explain how nobody is being robbed. Not to mention calling those you don't agree with cultists, as if they were fanatically devoted to Windows 10. They're not. They've simply moved on with changes.

I see you've been around a while, longer than me even which is impressive. Did you claim that the windows XP users were cultists sneering at the Win98 users? Did you upgrade then? Were you upset when Steam stopped working on XP, or did it not effect you because you were already on Win7? If so, then are you in fact a Win7 cultist? Are you now a win7 cultist? Or does it just not make sense to go flinging around blanket labels like that?

Change happens. You've seen it. Things stop working on older operating systems, including Steam, for reasons of security, DRM, and cost. Valve isn't trying to cut anyone off, they want to move forward in what they see as the best way of doing so, whether or not we understand or agree with their reasons.

Hello
Agree with most points but sincerly, do you honnestly think it's normal or a good situation and attitude ?

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking if change is a good or normal situation or attitude? I think it's inevitable, and can be good or bad depending on different situations. But without change we would still be using MSDOS, or versions of WIndows that were based on it.

[bidulless]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Hello
Agree with most points but sincerly, do you honnestly think it's normal or a good situation and attitude ?

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking if change is a good or normal situation or attitude? I think it's inevitable, and can be good or bad depending on different situations. But without change we would still be using MSDOS, or versions of WIndows that were based on it.

Hello
That was exactly my question.Is this good or bad in our case ? So change are done for the best ? What's can you qualify of good or best for you and your interrest in this change ?

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Sorry I'm not sure what you mean. Are you asking if change is a good or normal situation or attitude? I think it's inevitable, and can be good or bad depending on different situations. But without change we would still be using MSDOS, or versions of WIndows that were based on it.

Hello
That was exactly my question.Is this good or bad in our case ? So change are done for the best ? What's can you qualify of good or best for you and your interrest in this change ?

That's very subjective, it could be different for each of us and is hard to answer without knowing what future changes will be... It's not good for the people who don't want to change. I personally don't think Windows as an operating system is going in a good direction. I'm happy enough with Steam as it is right now but I get that they want to continue evolving it, and Valve seems to think that will require features of newer Chromium versions. I don't believe they would drop windows 7 if they didn't think it was necessary for future updates.

[bidulless]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Hello
That was exactly my question.Is this good or bad in our case ? So change are done for the best ? What's can you qualify of good or best for you and your interrest in this change ?

That's very subjective, it could be different for each of us and is hard to answer without knowing what future changes will be... It's not good for the people who don't want to change. I personally don't think Windows as an operating system is going in a good direction. I'm happy enough with Steam as it is right now but I get that they want to continue evolving it, and Valve seems to think that will require features of newer Chromium versions. I don't believe they would drop windows 7 if they didn't think it was necessary for future updates.

Hello
Sorry may be my question was poorly worded.
For you, do you think the situation of been forced to upgrade to a new os in order to get access to the good you had purchased is normal and something you desire ?
And may be you can point me what feature of chromium steam will be so pleased to used ?

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

That's very subjective, it could be different for each of us and is hard to answer without knowing what future changes will be... It's not good for the people who don't want to change. I personally don't think Windows as an operating system is going in a good direction. I'm happy enough with Steam as it is right now but I get that they want to continue evolving it, and Valve seems to think that will require features of newer Chromium versions. I don't believe they would drop windows 7 if they didn't think it was necessary for future updates.

Hello
Sorry may be my question was poorly worded.
For you, do you think the situation of been forced to upgrade to a new os in order to get access to the good you had purchased is normal and something you desire ?

That's still hard to answer. I didn't want to upgrade to Windows 7 from XP, that was an excellent operating system but I did because that's where the software was. And again with Windows 10, I heard the stories about it and it sounded bad, but video games are one of my main hobbies and upgrading was the path of least resistance to continue. (and I found the stories of how bad it is to be greatly exaggerated.)

So I won't say I "desire" these changes, but I understand and accept them, and I am able to continue with my hobby as it evolves which I do think is good.

[bidulless]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Hello
Sorry may be my question was poorly worded.
For you, do you think the situation of been forced to upgrade to a new os in order to get access to the good you had purchased is normal and something you desire ?

That's still hard to answer. I didn't want to upgrade to Windows 7 from XP, that was an excellent operating system but I did because that's where the software was. And again with Windows 10, I heard the stories about it and it sounded bad, but video games are one of my main hobbies and upgrading was the path of least resistance to continue. (and I found the stories of how bad it is to be greatly exaggerated.)

So I won't say I "desire" these changes, but I understand and accept them, and I am able to continue with my hobby as it evolves which I do think is good.

Hello
Honnest answer. i am on the same boat as you but with the difference that i find all this mess completly stupid and unreasonnable and if you take 2 minutes will realise that this mess will start again in 2 years for what ? progress ? lol it's not really serious.

[Dr. Dro ඞ]

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

That's still hard to answer. I didn't want to upgrade to Windows 7 from XP, that was an excellent operating system but I did because that's where the software was. And again with Windows 10, I heard the stories about it and it sounded bad, but video games are one of my main hobbies and upgrading was the path of least resistance to continue. (and I found the stories of how bad it is to be greatly exaggerated.)

So I won't say I "desire" these changes, but I understand and accept them, and I am able to continue with my hobby as it evolves which I do think is good.

Hello
Honnest answer. i am on the same boat as you but with the difference that i find all this mess completly stupid and unreasonnable and if you take 2 minutes will realise that this mess will start again in 2 years for what ? progress ? lol it's not really serious.

What you're conveniently ignoring is that Windows 10 released eight years ago. It's not brand new, it's actually quite old and due its replacement at its point. Which already arrived two years ago.

[bidulless]

Początkowo opublikowane przez TheBasedSociety:

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Hello
Honnest answer. i am on the same boat as you but with the difference that i find all this mess completly stupid and unreasonnable and if you take 2 minutes will realise that this mess will start again in 2 years for what ? progress ? lol it's not really serious.

What you're conveniently ignoring is that Windows 10 released eight years ago. It's not brand new, it's actually quite old and due its replacement at its point. Which already arrived two years ago.

Hello
I do not conveniently ignore that it's the same ... and will be the same with every incomming os from microcrot.

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

That's still hard to answer. I didn't want to upgrade to Windows 7 from XP, that was an excellent operating system but I did because that's where the software was. And again with Windows 10, I heard the stories about it and it sounded bad, but video games are one of my main hobbies and upgrading was the path of least resistance to continue. (and I found the stories of how bad it is to be greatly exaggerated.)

So I won't say I "desire" these changes, but I understand and accept them, and I am able to continue with my hobby as it evolves which I do think is good.

Hello
Honnest answer. i am on the same boat as you but with the difference that i find all this mess completly stupid and unreasonnable and if you take 2 minutes will realise that this mess will start again in 2 years for what ? progress ? lol it's not really serious.

If past patterns are any indication, we get 10 or more years out of any given operating system. That doesn't seem so unreasonable considering how quickly hardware and software changes over time.
Windows XP lifecycle was 2001-2014, and worked with Steam for 5 more years.
Windows 7 came out in 2009, and ended about 10 years later and will work on Steam til 2024.
Windows 10 came out in 2015, is ending in 2025, and will most likely work on Steam for 4-5 more years. I'm expecting to skip windows 11 and will probably upgrade to 12 in 5 years.

It's been like this with every other version of windows to come along, win98, 2000, ME, Vista (with Win98 being the shortest, it was already nearing its end when Steam released.) I have been using Steam since windows 98, and yes I honestly do believe things are better now, with Steam as a platform as well as for gaming in general.

[( ( < < <🤖> > > ) )]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Początkowo opublikowane przez bidulless:

Hello
Honnest answer. i am on the same boat as you but with the difference that i find all this mess completly stupid and unreasonnable and if you take 2 minutes will realise that this mess will start again in 2 years for what ? progress ? lol it's not really serious.

If past patterns are any indication, we get 10 or more years out of any given operating system. That doesn't seem so unreasonable considering how quickly hardware and software changes over time.
Windows XP lifecycle was 2001-2014, and worked with Steam for 5 more years.
Windows 7 came out in 2009, and ended about 10 years later and will work on Steam til 2024.
Windows 10 came out in 2015, is ending in 2025, and will most likely work on Steam for 4-5 more years. I'm expecting to skip windows 11 and will probably upgrade to 12 in 5 years.

It's been like this with every other version of windows to come along, win98, 2000, ME, Vista (with Win98 being the shortest, it was already nearing its end when Steam released.) I have been using Steam since windows 98, and yes I honestly do believe things are better now, with Steam as a platform as well as for gaming in general.

excellent work RasaNova.....

People... if you dont know your pc history and how upgrades work...
your doomed to be hanging on and complaining for nothing... as at minimum
being prepared for the changes is far better than thinking change wont happen
to you.... we are all on a games website.... this is luxury stuff... wasting time playing games..

complaining is a luxury.... but are you playing steam games in 2024
or are you going to neglect your steam games til something else forces
you to change to get a "supported" operating system....

i do agree we should have something better than a OS and or parts upgrade
but we dont... praise the baby cheeses for letting us use win 7/8 for this long...

[Stiletto]

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Not at all. Nobody is sneering at you...

Please don't make claims like this in threads where there are literally over 100 pages with plenty of sneering people judging Windows 7 users without even caring to hear why those people are still using Windows 7. Shall I go back through the pages, or other threads, and give you examples? This is either dishonest or oblivious. I'm not sure which.

but you certainly seem to be sneering

Ah. Dishonest.

I just went back to the first page of this thread. Here's some excerpts from the third reply. The THIRD reply, in a thread of nearly 2,000:

Some of us don't need to hide our profile to get our points across.

Then you're a fool.

Do you even read the licenses you agree to?

Come on... wise up already.

Going down the first page, there's more like this. I can post those, too. If you don't think these responses are sneering, and you think calling out such behavior as cultish is itself "sneering", then you have a warped view. If you think the post in question is an anomaly in a sea of polite exchanges, or worse - a sea of "sneering" Windows 7 users not responding well to a bunch of people(for whom the problem doesn't exist) "politely" mocking any reason they come up with for not wanting to upgrade, then I don't know what to tell you.

[RasaNova]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Stiletto:

Początkowo opublikowane przez RasaNova:

Not at all. Nobody is sneering at you...

Please don't make claims like this in threads where there are literally over 100 pages with plenty of sneering people judging Windows 7 users without even caring to hear why those people are still using Windows 7. Shall I go back through the pages, or other threads, and give you examples? This is either dishonest or oblivious. I'm not sure which.

but you certainly seem to be sneering

Ah. Dishonest.

I just went back to the first page of this thread. Here's some excerpts from the third reply. The THIRD reply, in a thread of nearly 2,000:

Some of us don't need to hide our profile to get our points across.

Then you're a fool.

Do you even read the licenses you agree to?

Come on... wise up already.

Going down the first page, there's more like this. I can post those, too. If you don't think these responses are sneering, and you think calling out such behavior as cultish is itself "sneering", then you have a warped view. If you think the post in question is an anomaly in a sea of polite exchanges, or worse - a sea of "sneering" Windows 7 users not responding well to a bunch of people(for whom the problem doesn't exist) "politely" mocking any reason they come up with for not wanting to upgrade, then I don't know what to tell you.

Fine, I'll agree with you as far as there are people "sneering" or otherwise being stubborn and judgmental on both sides. But that didn't appear to be the case with the people you were replying to when you said it. What you were actually doing was attacking the people more than their arguments, attempting to belittle their statements by brushing them into broad categories to more easily dismiss them.