Single player games that mandate "Always Online" is super anti-consumer.

[Labyrinth2 0]

It does not benefit players at all especially if they paid to play them. Without internet, these games are unplayable.

The real reason why its a thing is that companies can present to investors that they have a large player count, when in reality, that's not entirely the case. It is also deceitful to investors because the numbers can lie and going to Steam player count or SteamDB shows more accurate results. Its no wonder why companies like Ubisoft are demanding Steam to disable the player count because its cutting into their bottom line, as well as exposing their lies to the investors.

[WreckWren]

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

[Labyrinth2 0]

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

Well achievements have always been online required, but they arent required to play the actual game.

[ReBoot]

Vote with your wallet. Boycott SP online-only games. Bad sales is pretty much the only language ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ CEOs understand.

[Chika Ogiue]

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

Valve are all about everyone having the latest game versions, that's the very core reason for Steam being what it is. So it's hardly surprisingly that they don't mind even single player games requiring a constant internet connection. Valve kind of expect everyone to have 24/7 net access.

[J4MESOX4D]

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

IValve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline

Achievements can be enabled offline but that is down to the developer to create an offline sync to the Steam API. If it's not present then it's on them and not Valve. Steam's entire data architecture has to go through the sole API.

[ペンギン]

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

In single-player games, an online connection is often a sign of telemetry, analytics, and spyware. Or unnecessary services like ads or even Valve’s Steam Datagram Relay, mandatory IPv6 checks by Valve or Captive Portal Checks by Valve.

Recently, there have also been Discovery connections added, both within the client itself and for games that are activated in the background. In that regard, we’re just lab rats for Valve.

The list goes on but that doesn’t make it any better. It’s not just "anti-consumer" — consumers are being deceived, being robbed and misled on a large scale.

Nguyên văn bởi ReBoot:

Vote with your wallet. Boycott SP online-only games. Bad sales is pretty much the only language ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ CEOs understand.

Well, sorry but that's always the dumbest argument you can make. It doesn't matter at all with over 100 million accounts, especially when only a few people opt out in the grand scheme. Plus, new customers keep joining all the time.

Otherwise, yes, you're right — when it comes to money, changes can be pushed through quickly. But it takes a bit more than that.

[videomike_Ultimate_Plushie]

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

That's....a point I didnt even think of hoenstly. It never hit me before now how wildly hypocritical it is to disable acheivements when offline on a mobile gaming device

[videomike_Ultimate_Plushie]

Nguyên văn bởi ペンギン:

Nguyên văn bởi ReBoot:

Vote with your wallet. Boycott SP online-only games. Bad sales is pretty much the only language ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ CEOs understand.

Well, sorry but that's always the dumbest argument you can make. It doesn't matter at all with over 100 million accounts, especially when only a few people opt out in the grand scheme. Plus, new customers keep joining all the time.

Otherwise, yes, you're right — when it comes to money, changes can be pushed through quickly. But it takes a bit more than that.

How cowardly, do you regularly give up on things unless you know the result well ahead of time with 100% certainty? No, you do things because they're worth doing. A market cannot change is people don't take action to not take part in portions of that market which do dishonorable or dangerous(to the industry not actually dangerous.) The only person making change impossible is your own mindset of defeatism; Please do not shame people who want to stand up for themselves or demean their devisions like this.

[Mad Scientist]

Nguyên văn bởi Labyrinth2 0:

Nguyên văn bởi WreckWren:

It should be Steam policy to not allow mandatory internet connections for single player games, however Valve themselves are extremely unfriendly to offline play, going so far as to outright disable achievements when offline - despite the existence of the Steam Deck!

Well achievements have always been online required, but they arent required to play the actual game.

That depends on if it's just tracked in the game or needs to connect to steam for steam achievements. Some games unlock and display achievements in the game regardless of an internet connection, and will sync with steam to show the steam achievements.

Nguyên văn bởi ペンギン:

Nguyên văn bởi ReBoot:

Vote with your wallet. Boycott SP online-only games. Bad sales is pretty much the only language ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ CEOs understand.

Well, sorry but that's always the dumbest argument you can make. It doesn't matter at all with over 100 million accounts, especially when only a few people opt out in the grand scheme. Plus, new customers keep joining all the time.

Otherwise, yes, you're right — when it comes to money, changes can be pushed through quickly. But it takes a bit more than that.

Voting with ones wallet has actually resulted in the killing-off of entire games and developers/studios by making gamers unhappy about something they did, so enough people voting by not spending can have a gigantic negative effect for poor choices for Devs, thus, it is actually great advice.

[ペンギン]

Nguyên văn bởi Mad Scientist:

Voting with ones wallet has actually resulted in the killing-off of entire games and developers/studios by making gamers unhappy about something they did, so enough people voting by not spending can have a gigantic negative effect for poor choices for Devs, thus, it is actually great advice.

That's the point where it gets interesting. How much is “enough” - And do consumers endure it long enough to achieve something or are they just being deceived, as is the case with many developers and publishers? On top of that, while many things are intentional, their effectiveness on Steam is quite limited... mainly due to the platform's structure.

Otherwise, "vote with your wallet" is just an empty phrase and a deadly argument. It starts with the fact that many people who complain about something don't even delete their product from the library

Nguyên văn bởi videomike_Ultimate_Plushie:

How cowardly, do you regularly give up on things unless you know the result well ahead of time with 100% certainty? No, you do things because they're worth doing. A market cannot change is people don't take action to not take part in portions of that market which do dishonorable or dangerous(to the industry not actually dangerous.) The only person making change impossible is your own mindset of defeatism; Please do not shame people who want to stand up for themselves or demean their devisions like this.

Shame people? Certainly not. Take a look around the forums and reconsider your statement on how effective and consistent "vote with your wallet" is here or how quickly it fades away.

I take a realistic approach to this. I don’t view it as an entertainment platform or source of personal amusement, nor do I see things through rose-colored glasses like many others do. I also do enough to make an impact on this platform and across platforms and fight on multiple fronts (wind mills).

Topic related, I have already ensured with several products that developers had to retroactively integrate data protection agreements and opt-in/out mechanisms. Additionally, telemetry servers were shut down, services were changed because of my involvement and a lot of other stuff that benefits everyone. Here on Steam and IoT.

What, in turn, are you doing?

[Illasera]

I think someone just woke up... where were you in the last 10 years when we had an autistic meltdown about it, OP?

[AmsterdamHeavy]

Dont like it, dont buy it. If its added after the sale, thats crooked.

[Ben Lubar]

What kinds of games are people playing that are strictly singleplayer but still require a constant internet connection? None of my games do both of those things in the same game.

[ペンギン]

Nguyên văn bởi Ben Lubar:

What kinds of games are people playing that are strictly singleplayer but still require a constant internet connection? None of my games do both of those things in the same game.

Hmm? A few of your titles, some may not 100% singleplayer products. You can't completely exclude yourself either.

oxygen not included = Tracker by Klei Entertainment
factorio = auth/api
elder scrolls skyrim = bethesda collector
drg = several tracker (stathat, google analytics)
prison architecht = trackjs, google crashpad
stardew valley = some unnecessary stuff doing callbacks
two point hospital = extensive sega tracker
infraspace = unity cloud reports and own tracker
hydroneer = valve ip checks, google ads, amplitude, google tagmanager and more
risk of rain 1 = Ipv6 Checks, Google TagManager, Facebook
risk of rain 2 = epic telemetry pipoeline, unity cloud reports
borderlands 2 = 2k discovery, telemetry and a lot of unnecessary stuff
slime rancher = unnecessary online stuff
goat simulator = google analytics
Capcom Arcade Stadium = Tracker
shadowrun returns = google analytics
warhammer 40k relics of war = logging with extensive data

Some more singleplayer games which were tested by various genres last time

metro exodus = dlss callbacks, google cloud, telemetry
deponia = ingame ads
garden life = tracker, steam datagram relay, google cloud
the aether = forced callbacks, cloudflare
aquarist = unity analytics, cloud reports
100 Funny Cats (and franchise) = unity analytics, stam datagram relay, cloud reports
subnautica = unity analytics, steam datagram relay, advertising

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Nguyên văn bởi ペンギン:

Nguyên văn bởi Ben Lubar:

What kinds of games are people playing that are strictly singleplayer but still require a constant internet connection? None of my games do both of those things in the same game.

Hmm? A few of your titles, some may not 100% singleplayer products

oxygen not included = Tracker by Klei Entertainment
elter scrolls skyrim = bethesda collector
drg = several tracker (stathat, google analytics)
prison architecht = trackjs, google crashpad
stardew valley = some unnecessary stuff doing callbacks
two point hospital = extensive sega tracker
infraspace = unity cloud reports and own tracker
hydroneer = valve ip checks, google ads, amplitude, google tagmanager and more
risk of rain 1 = Ipv6 Checks, Google TagManager, Facebook
risk of rain 2 = epic telemetry pipoeline, unity cloud reports
borderlands 2 = 2k discovery, telemetry and a lot of unnecessary stuff
slime rancher = unnecessary online stuff
goat simulator = google analytics
Capcom Arcade Stadium = Tracker
shadowrun returns = google analytics
warhammer 40k relics of war = logging with extensive data

Some more singleplayer games which were tested by various genres

metro exodus = dlss callbacks, google cloud, telemetry
deponia = ingame ads
garden life = tracker, steam datagram relay, google cloud
the aether = forced callbacks, cloudflare
aquarist = unity analytics, cloud reports
100 Funny Cats (and franchise) = unity analytics, stam datagram relay, cloud reports
subnautica = unity analytics, steam datagram relay, advertising

Since when did Skyrim require an online connection?