Will Steam Refunds be Good or Bad for PC Gaming?

[Mikarri]

Steam Refunds are a great idea - for us. I know I'm not alone in my instant use of it in regards to Arkham Knight.

But I was thinking... what effect will this have on PC gaming as a whole? Will it make devs and publishers release unbroken, functioning games? Or will they leave PC altogether and only release on consoles?

[Start_Running]

Unbroken games don't exist. Honestly the arkham thing is a little too convenient. Me thinks thge pc port was delibverately sabotaged to give the console version and the console version retailers a leg up so to speak.

The effect. Well one effect is that it's making cards take 2 hours longer to drop.

[Lapom]

I am sure that it will at least reduce the amount of developers hoping to make a quick buck on Steam by releasing rubbish, especially from greenlight.

[86TMH]

I was questioning the same thing a few weeks ago. Would you release a game that people may purchase just to try it, only to ask for a refund later.

The problem comes when there's nothing technically wrong with the game but it just may not be for some people, so they ask for a refund, say the game has issues and get their money back.

[Start_Running]

Yup.. but of course that's why there's a 2 hour/ 2 week time limit. And whgere bundles are concerned the total plytime for all bundled items combined may not exceed 2 hours, and refunding refunds the entire bundle.

You'll probably see more newer releases coming in bundle packs.

[Mikarri]

My hope is that they take some more time and release games we won't want to return.

The Batman fiasco was Rocksteady prioritizing the console version, and then giving the game to a different dev team for the PC port. This is why it's so damned broken.

If any dev/pub thought it wasn't worth the money to port it correctly, I'll direct you to the overwhelming success of GTAV. They spent millions and millions making it perfect on all platforms. The result? BILLIONS in sales and breaking multiple records.

[Start_Running]

Originally posted by Lunarri:

My hope is that they take some more time and release games we won't want to return.

The Batman fiasco was Rocksteady prioritizing the console version, and then giving the game to a different dev team for the PC port. This is why it's so damned broken.

If any dev/pub thought it wasn't worth the money to port it correctly, I'll direct you to the overwhelming success of GTAV. They spent millions and millions making it perfect on all platforms. The result? BILLIONS in sales and breaking multiple records.

Actually GATV Wasn't ported from Console to PC as much as it was ported from PC to console.

As for Batman Arkham... it's a moot point. Once the bugs get ironed out. Those that refunded it will be queing up to buy it a second time. due to the mentality of the avg consumer.

[Mikarri]

Yes, but it doesn't change the fact that R* made sure it was working properly on all platforms. More money spent, yes, but a hell of a lot more earned.

[Start_Running]

Originally posted by Lunarri:

Yes, but it doesn't change the fact that R* made sure it was working properly on all platforms. More money spent, yes, but a hell of a lot more earned.

Mmm-Hmmm. That's subjective. You'd have to b able to prove there was the same market size for arkham as there is for GTAl. And it's not liek GTAV didn't have it's own launch day issues.

Will the refund policy change anything. Nope. . Not in any big way. It wil;l probably lead to more front loading in design. I.e. put all the interesting stuff in the first 2 hours and then have the remaining 80 hours basically be a repetive cludgey grind.

So in the end it may be a netr negative for us. We'll see fewer story driven, well paced narrative driven games and more well. Sandboxes, that they can sploodge early. After all.. there's lots of ways to make folks spend 2 hours without them realizing it.

[RedLightning]

Originally posted by Start_Running:

Originally posted by Lunarri:

Yes, but it doesn't change the fact that R* made sure it was working properly on all platforms. More money spent, yes, but a hell of a lot more earned.

Mmm-Hmmm. That's subjective. You'd have to b able to prove there was the same market size for arkham as there is for GTAl. And it's not liek GTAV didn't have it's own launch day issues.

Will the refund policy change anything. Nope. . Not in any big way. It wil;l probably lead to more front loading in design. I.e. put all the interesting stuff in the first 2 hours and then have the remaining 80 hours basically be a repetive cludgey grind.

So in the end it may be a netr negative for us. We'll see fewer story driven, well paced narrative driven games and more well. Sandboxes, that they can sploodge early. After all.. there's lots of ways to make folks spend 2 hours without them realizing it.

Yes.. like a 2 hour long "tutorial".

Perhaps if these developers were so worried about it in the past.. they all would have started to release DEMOS for the software..

However only a few "smart" developers do that these days.

This *wll* have negative implications.. cause no matter what the developers are going to find a way around the "limits" imposed upon them .. they always do... and then theres just leaving Steam alltogether..

[Mikarri]

It's so sad that it's like a competition for them. "How little work can we possibly do while still being able to call it a game?" We give you our hard earned cash, and in return you give us a broken mess and a promiss it'll be fixed "at a later date."
Is it too much to ask that we get what we were promissed and not what you gave us?

[supertrooper225]

Originally posted by ;537402115081122951:

It's so sad that it's like a competition for them. "How little work can we possibly do while still being able to call it a game?" We give you our hard earned cash, and in return you give us a broken mess and a promiss it'll be fixed "at a later date."
Is it too much to ask that we get what we were promissed and not what you gave us?

Game development is not like pressing a button and generating a game. They put their hard earned cash into making and marketing the thing too. There is nothing about game development that is easy.

Does a fast food joint give you the exact burger you see in the commercial?...No. That burger is shiny plastic. Stop putting so much faith in commercials and marketing. The truth is never what they have strived for, they are selling something.

[Mikarri]

I know it's hard to make games. I never said it was easy. Am I expecting the perfection that a CGI trailer showed me? No. Am I expecting a functional game with all the stuff they promised was in the game? Yes.

[supertrooper225]

Originally posted by Lunarri:

I know it's hard to make games. I never said it was easy. Am I expecting the perfection that a CGI trailer showed me? No. Am I expecting a functional game with all the stuff they promised was in the game? Yes.

You kinda implied it was easy when you said they ask themselves "how little work can we do". I just think gamers are hypersensitive these days. Batman was screwed up sure. But ports that bad aren't that common. If a game has a hitch in the frame rate gamers try to claim it is 'broken'. It is laughable. But this is off-topic.

Refunds will have repurcussions, good and bad ones. Companies will avoid taking as many chances now...but they will likely make sure performance is tested well now. We may very well see an increase in quality...or a slide in variation in games. It is too early to tell. But I think games are on an upswing.

[RedLightning]

Originally posted by supertrooper225:

Originally posted by ;537402115081122951:

It's so sad that it's like a competition for them. "How little work can we possibly do while still being able to call it a game?" We give you our hard earned cash, and in return you give us a broken mess and a promiss it'll be fixed "at a later date."
Is it too much to ask that we get what we were promissed and not what you gave us?

Game development is not like pressing a button and generating a game. They put their hard earned cash into making and marketing the thing too. There is nothing about game development that is easy.

Does a fast food joint give you the exact burger you see in the commercial?...No. That burger is shiny plastic. Stop putting so much faith in commercials and marketing. The truth is never what they have strived for, they are selling something.

Making the burger out of plasic.. while legal.. is a very deceptive practice. They do it anyway though. and even when laws are made to stop these deceptive ads and commercials, the market seems to find a way around it.

Should people do this... no.. however they do.. speaks a book in-itself.

Also.. loading truck trailers all day is hard, grueling manual labor, does that mean it shouldn't be done right? Not to mention, loading trucks does not really net a good return, but if not done right... well.

I guess if you break everything you are loading on the trailer.. you'd get fired, however in the gaming industry.. they just abandon the project.. and start the process all over again.

I hope that refunds do good for the industry.. however, just like always.. they will always find a way around it.

In my humble opinion.

[supertrooper225]

Originally posted by RedLightning:

Originally posted by supertrooper225:

Game development is not like pressing a button and generating a game. They put their hard earned cash into making and marketing the thing too. There is nothing about game development that is easy.

Does a fast food joint give you the exact burger you see in the commercial?...No. That burger is shiny plastic. Stop putting so much faith in commercials and marketing. The truth is never what they have strived for, they are selling something.

Making the burger out of plasic.. while legal.. is a very deceptive practice. They do it anyway though. and even when laws are made to stop these deceptive ads and commercials, the market seems to find a way around it.

Should people do this... no.. however they do.. speaks a book in-itself.

Also.. loading truck trailers all day is hard, grueling manual labor, does that mean it shouldn't be done right? Not to mention, loading trucks does not really net a good return, but if not done right... well.

I guess if you break everything you are loading on the trailer.. you'd get fired, however in the gaming industry.. they just abandon the project.. and start the process all over again.

I hope that refunds do good for the industry.. however, just like always.. they will always find a way around it.

In my humble opinion.

I think gamers are constantly blowing things out of proportion. 90% of the games they claim are broken function perfectly. It just has a feature here or there they don't like or their frame rate counter isn't quite as high as they want it to be. Most developers do their jobs right.

Gamers need to think first...then buy. Their problem is they buy first...then complain.