DEFINITELY, Valve should set limits on the U.S. culture war.

[Imon Spartan]

Edit:

A few days ago, I came here with a genuine thought I wanted to share, hoping to read the opinions of non-American users and understand if I was the only one feeling this way or if it was a widespread sentiment. Days later, I return to find a thread with over 400 comments, 300 of which are users arguing and providing a literal, perfect example of my main complaint in this topic.

The forum is completely ruined and unusable. Either Valve starts taking a firm stance and outright bans these types of discussions, or all of this will end up turning into a pit of debates monopolized by Americans and their political arguments that only concern their own country.

Original post:

I had never felt the need to use this forum, but I think the situation is starting to become very annoying for the average user. I would like to bring this issue to the attention of non-American users and hear their opinions or how they feel about it.

I've been observing for a while how this whole woke vs. anti-woke cultural war, which originates solely in the United States, is starting to flood the entire Steam platform. As a European user, I'm starting to get tired of it.

Let me give you a recent example: I'm interested in Avowed. I really like its universe ever since I played Pillars of Eternity, and I had several questions about its lore that I wanted to ask in its forum. The unpleasant surprise? When I entered, all I found was an all-out war between Americans creating threads either supporting or opposing the supposed "woke" content of the game. The atmosphere was completely toxic and unbearable, taking away any desire I had to ask my questions.

The tags we use in game descriptions have lost their useful purpose and been distorted. Game forums are becoming unusable, filled with threads of Americans spewing hate at each other, and overall, the environment feels unbearable.

I know the question I’m raising is a complex one. Valve, as a tech company, must maintain corporate neutrality, especially when it comes to social and cultural debates, to avoid polarizing its users and negatively impacting its business model.

I also understand that, from a freedom of expression perspective, setting limits on these kinds of discussions—which add no value and only worsen the platform—could create tensions regarding censorship and the boundaries of free speech.

However, from a global impact standpoint, even though this cultural war is mainly happening in the United States, it is negatively affecting the platform on a worldwide scale. If no minimum attention is paid to this issue, it could lead to worse outcomes. These might range from users in other parts of the world choosing to stop using key features of the platform to developers and companies potentially viewing the platform less favorably and opting for alternatives like GOG (though I see this last scenario as less likely).

Finally, I want to say that while Valve is a company focused on generating profit, I believe it has a social responsibility toward its users—all users on its platform. This social responsibility has been evident in many pro-consumer policies Valve has implemented on the platform over recent years.

With all this said, I would like to ask other users if they feel the same way about the current atmosphere on the platform. I am particularly interested in hearing from users in LATAM, Europe, Asia, Africa, etc.

I’d love to hear your thoughts. Maybe I’m mistaken, and the situation isn’t as serious as I perceive it to be. Perhaps it’s not such a big deal. But I felt the need to share my opinion.

That’s all. Sending you all a hug, and have a great day.

[ReBoot]

The only cultural war is between people who want to have it. So let's jsut opt out of cultural wars, problem solved.

[The Debauchery]

Originally posted by ReBoot:

The only cultural war is between people who want to have it. So let's jsut opt out of cultural wars, problem solved.

I opt out of smoking, but I'm still likely to die of lung cancer from the amount of second-hand smoke I have to walk through when I go out in public.
Similar situation here. Not participating in it doesn't mean we don't have to wade through it, nor that it doesn't stink. And apparently the only solution is to stay at home and never go anywhere.

[Pippinhot]

Originally posted by Ogami:

I dont know what can be done but i agree with you that is has become unbearable.
Its basically impossible to inform yourself over a new game release by visiting the forums.
You have to wade through pages of
"Is this game woke?"
"Does this game have DEI?"
"Has this game LGBTQ++++ characters?"
"Did Sweet Baby Inc write for this game?"
"This game is woke because XXX!!"
and so on and on and on and on.

Its just so freaking annoying at this point. It completely drowned out any standard discussion for most new major game releases and can last for weeks till the next big "target" game drops.

But i really dont know what you can realistically do about it except swinging the ban hammer with gusto in all directions till maybe some people get a clue.
But i doubt that would help in the long run, people are just too entrenched into this culture war nonsense by now.
Sigh. :lunar2019deadpanpig:

It's also increasing annoying to have threads of
"Femboy"
"How to date a LGBT"
"Looking for femboy"
"LGBT representations"
"Gay pride week"
"Games with DEI"
"Characters for gay men"
"We need more trans representation"-new thread
and so on and on and on and on.

Average users are tired to see those threads daily and at times multiple times a day. It comes to the point it is spamming as defined by steam rules. Yet steam allow it up there. It is counterproductive to average users that doesn't want these type of threads while being on steam.

In regards to America, the nation is so powerful that anything happens in America is being felt worldwide. The Red wave has changed the scales. The people has voted out democrats which is known for left policies. The left needs to accept and acknowledge that the majority doesn't support DEI or any other dog whistles stuff.

[The nameless Gamer]

I'll just say that I too am VERY weary of that "culture war", which is a storm in a teacup perpetually brought up in ANY topic those individuals can invade. It's getting very tiresome and annoying. Maybe we could start by classifying posts containing "woke" and "DEI" as spam.

[ReBoot]

Originally posted by The Debauchery:

Originally posted by ReBoot:

The only cultural war is between people who want to have it. So let's jsut opt out of cultural wars, problem solved.

I opt out of smoking, but I'm still likely to die of lung cancer from the amount of second-hand smoke I have to walk through when I go out in public.
Similar situation here. Not participating in it doesn't mean we don't have to wade through it, nor that it doesn't stink. And apparently the only solution is to stay at home and never go anywhere.

Looking away from smoking doesn't make it disappear form the air you breathe. Looking (also listening) away from stupid talk does make it disappear from the stuff you read. Huge difference. You can report & block forum trolls, you can't block smoke.

[wesnef]

Originally posted by goyankees2023:

Originally posted by Ogami:

I dont know what can be done but i agree with you that is has become unbearable.
Its basically impossible to inform yourself over a new game release by visiting the forums.
You have to wade through pages of
"Is this game woke?"
"Does this game have DEI?"
"Has this game LGBTQ++++ characters?"
"Did Sweet Baby Inc write for this game?"
"This game is woke because XXX!!"
and so on and on and on and on.

Its just so freaking annoying at this point. It completely drowned out any standard discussion for most new major game releases and can last for weeks till the next big "target" game drops.

But i really dont know what you can realistically do about it except swinging the ban hammer with gusto in all directions till maybe some people get a clue.
But i doubt that would help in the long run, people are just too entrenched into this culture war nonsense by now.
Sigh.

It's also increasing annoying to have threads of
"Femboy"
"How to date a LGBT"
"Looking for femboy"
"LGBT representations"
"Gay pride week"
"Games with DEI"
"Characters for gay men"
"We need more trans representation"-new thread
and so on and on and on and on..

I'm pretty sure many of those (especially in Off Topic) are from trolls and clickbaiters, who know they'll get outrage responses. And maybe some from the anti-wokes, trying to justify their anti-woke position by amplifying the "woke" stereotype they rant against.

[ペンギン]

Originally posted by Boblin the Goblin:

Originally posted by goyankees2023:

It's also increasing annoying to have threads of
"Femboy"
"How to date a LGBT"
"Looking for femboy"
"LGBT representations"
"Gay pride week"
"Games with DEI"
"Characters for gay men"
and so on and on and on and on.

Average users are tired to see those threads daily and at times multiple times a day. It comes to the point it is spamming as defined by steam rules. Yet steam allow it up there. It is counterproductive to average users that doesn't want these type of threads while being on steam.

In regards to America, the nation is so powerful that anything happens in America is being felt worldwide. The Red wave has changed the scales. The people has voted out democrats which is known for left policies. The left needs to accept and acknowledge that the majority doesn't support DEI or any other dog whistles stuff.

Those threads aren't being constantly made.

You shouldn't speak on American politics, it reveals your location.

I would certainly say that this behavior is now consistently observable everywhere.

Many Americans have a big mouth, because of their so called Freedom of Speech and impose their views on everyone else with this mentality. Do not care about anything. If you voice an opinion or raise a complaint you are often dismissed as ignorant.

The repertoire ranges from aggressive and toxic behaviour, derogatory, mocking, discrediting, insulting, defamatory remarks against ethnic groups, violation against personal rights, false accusations, harassment and much more.

And Valve? Working on a minimal base without enforcing their own house rules. Moreover, this is not only observable on Steam because it's a general problem.

What is perhaps even more concerning is that this if one can even call it a 'culture,' (as the mentioned country historically lacks a distinct cultural identity) - influence the language and behavior of others.

To be honest - Block forum trolls? Sure, closing eyes and let it be. Is always good, because that changes? NOTHING. Whether it's a forum or world affairs, the ostrich tactic is never a good idea.

The unfortunate aspect of this situation is that the harmful online behavior now increasingly entering the political spotlight, will likely result in further restrictions that ultimately harm everyone. This is already evident from numerous examples. Both already politically implemented and in the form of surveillance and filtering mechanisms that have already been integrated into several entertainment products/services.

[Imon Spartan]

Originally posted by goyankees2023:

It's also increasing annoying to have threads of
"Femboy"
"How to date a LGBT"
"Looking for femboy"
"LGBT representations"
"Gay pride week"
"Games with DEI"
"Characters for gay men"
"We need more trans representation"-new thread
and so on and on and on and on.

Average users are tired to see those threads daily and at times multiple times a day. It comes to the point it is spamming as defined by steam rules. Yet steam allow it up there. It is counterproductive to average users that doesn't want these type of threads while being on steam.

In regards to America, the nation is so powerful that anything happens in America is being felt worldwide. The Red wave has changed the scales. The people has voted out democrats which is known for left policies. The left needs to accept and acknowledge that the majority doesn't support DEI or any other dog whistles stuff.

"In regards to America, the nation is so powerful that anything happens in America is being felt worldwide."

I don’t want to sound aggressive, but you are the perfect example of the problem happening on this platform. The ego of the average American, with regard to how they view their country in the eyes of the rest of the world, makes them incapable of self-criticism or empathy toward others.

They fail to understand that their political issues don’t interest anyone outside their country. They don’t grasp that nobody should have to endure their "woke vs anti-woke" battles in forums or websites where users from all over the world coexist. They see themselves as the main characters of the world.

What’s even funnier is that if you bothered to ask anyone outside your country, the first thing they’d tell you is that the term "woke" and this entire cultural war you’re having are utterly ridiculous—a reflection of a country that has never experienced any significant cultural evolution over the centuries.

To give you an idea of what I mean, what you call the "left," your Democratic Party, and all those people you label as "communists" are considered right-wing in my country. This is because there is no real left in the United States. You’re simply experiencing decades of social and cultural progress compressed into just 10 years.

Steam should remain free of politics, and that includes U.S. politics and your "woke vs anti-woke" wars.

[Crazy Tiger]

Originally posted by Imon Spartan:

"In regards to America, the nation is so powerful that anything happens in America is being felt worldwide."

I don’t want to sound aggressive, but you are the perfect example of the problem happening on this platform. The ego of the average American, with regard to how they view their country in the eyes of the rest of the world, makes them incapable of self-criticism or empathy toward others.

They fail to understand that their political issues don’t interest anyone outside their country. They don’t grasp that nobody should have to endure their "woke vs anti-woke" battles in forums or websites where users from all over the world coexist. They see themselves as the main characters of the world.

What’s even funnier is that if you bothered to ask anyone outside your country, the first thing they’d tell you is that the term "woke" and this entire cultural war you’re having are utterly ridiculous—a reflection of a country that has never experienced any significant cultural evolution over the centuries.

To give you an idea of what I mean, what you call the "left," your Democratic Party, and all those people you label as "communists" are considered right-wing in my country. This is because there is no real left in the United States. You’re simply experiencing decades of social and cultural progress compressed into just 10 years.

Steam should remain free of politics, and that includes U.S. politics and your "woke vs anti-woke" wars.

Fully agreed.

[-OrLoK- Слава Україн]

Politics is inherent in Art and the creative process.

[xBCxRangers]

We in the US just need our own client. That would solve many issues in fact.

[xBCxRangers]

Originally posted by Crashed:

Originally posted by xBCxRangers:

We in the US just need our own client. That would solve many issues in fact.

Would its community have different rules that permit things that are technically not allowed, like discrimination?

In the coming months, there likely will be pressure for more freedom of speech protections on these platforms here, yes.

[Sir Seanicus, Esq.]

Valve can barely moderate their own forums...

[rawWwRrr]

Originally posted by Imon Spartan:

I’d love to hear your thoughts. Maybe I’m mistaken, and the situation isn’t as serious as I perceive it to be. Perhaps it’s not such a big deal. But I felt the need to share my opinion.

Speaking as an American stuck having to listen to both sides of the culture war, I'd like it to stop as well. However, just like any cultural phenomena, it will eventually die out and something else will take its place.

Until then, the best thing you and I can do is take advantage of what Steam offers which is the ability to just use it to play our games and ignore all the culture drama. Most game forums have their own culture and drama.

If you're really needing that social aspect for a particular game, consider looking elsewhere if the one on Steam is inhospitable.

I know this doesn't particularly address your desire for Valve to initiate any changes to help deter the culture talk, but they would certainly have a lot to deal with as you pointed out. Sometimes you just have to let the fires burn themselves out.

[Crashed]

Originally posted by xBCxRangers:

Originally posted by Crashed:

Would its community have different rules that permit things that are technically not allowed, like discrimination?

In the coming months, there likely will be pressure for more freedom of speech protections on these platforms here, yes.

That would be unconstitutional, because it would be considered compelled speech.