r-cane Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:19pm
no age restriction for some games
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
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Showing 1-15 of 43 comments
ReBoot Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:26pm 
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
... yeah, because a minor would TOTALLY provide their real DOB when buying a porn game. Right? RIIIIIGHHTTTTTT?????

It's not about protection of minors, first & foremost. Second, Klei got literally 0 porn games. Third, it's still up to parents to take care of their children. No-body is obliged, morally nor legally, to let their child onto the internet unsupervised. Parents doing that are the problem, not the lack of banners.
r-cane Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:40pm 
Originally posted by ReBoot:
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
... yeah, because a minor would TOTALLY provide their real DOB when buying a porn game. Right? RIIIIIGHHTTTTTT?????

It's not about protection of minors, first & foremost. Second, Klei got literally 0 porn games. Third, it's still up to parents to take care of their children. No-body is obliged, morally nor legally, to let their child onto the internet unsupervised. Parents doing that are the problem, not the lack of banners.
That`s a discussion that we have on the other forum aswell, but it`s not what this post is about. I
love to have this discussion, but I dont feel like doing it twice paralell, so here is the link if someone is interested.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1084600/discussions/0/4351121256518487173/?ctp=3

Besides, "porn games" are just a very minor part of what is unappropriate or unhealthy for minors and at least in the country I`m from it is not just the parents that can get into trouble for making products (including media) available to minors. It can lead to fines of up to 50.000€. You sell alcohol or an unappropriat game to a minor, you can get fined. You let a minor into a movie that isn`t age appropriat you can get fined. etc.etc. It`s quiet clear that society as a whole here is meant to secure the safety of minors. The problem is not just the parents, it`s people that are aware of a problem and ignoring it for either convinience or a lack of believe in self-efficacy.
Which leads me back to the question. Why isn`t steam caring more about this. Even if not for moral reasons, simply for economic ones. Because if this would be made more aware it probably would lead to a lot of critique. Same goes for publishers. (KLEI was just an example because they are on the forfront of the steamshop page right now and I would have betted they would have age ratings, but haven`t)
Last edited by r-cane; Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:43pm
Chika Ogiue Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:48pm 
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started....

Can you name a region where rating on PC for a digital product is mandatory?

Now, while I wait for that answer, I will also point another thing that will further confound matters. Depending on interpretation of related stipulations, it could be argued that in one region, Valve are setting themselves up for additional trouble by DISPLAYING certain age ratings that have not actually been received by products. You see, Valve don't actually check. They don't ensure that a rating attached to a title has been appropriately obtained.

In fact, certain ratings have been pulled from several Store pages on Steam in my region on at least one occasion when the related ratings board complained very vocally about how a publisher was "lying" to customers by displaying their age rating on a store page without the game being rated by them. (We'll ignore the fact, for now, that that rating board shouldn't be rating PC games and Valve shouldn't be using them as a rating board -- which is why things didn't go further). But if they were the correct rating board, then Valve would be breaching certain laws by allowing the purchasing of titles displaying that rating with any form of payment other than a credit card.

The point of that tangent is that rating aren't an easy subject with one answer. And when it comes to "age-gates" on a product page, they aren't there to protect children. They are there so that when a legal guardian tries to launch legal action, the store can turn around and tell them their child lied.
李某 Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:55pm 
Originally posted by r-cane:
Originally posted by ReBoot:
... yeah, because a minor would TOTALLY provide their real DOB when buying a porn game. Right? RIIIIIGHHTTTTTT?????

It's not about protection of minors, first & foremost. Second, Klei got literally 0 porn games. Third, it's still up to parents to take care of their children. No-body is obliged, morally nor legally, to let their child onto the internet unsupervised. Parents doing that are the problem, not the lack of banners.
That`s a discussion that we have on the other forum aswell, but it`s not what this post is about. I
love to have this discussion, but I dont feel like doing it twice paralell, so here is the link if someone is interested.
https://steamcommunity.com/app/1084600/discussions/0/4351121256518487173/?ctp=3

Besides, "porn games" are just a very minor part of what is unappropriate or unhealthy for minors and at least in the country I`m from it is not just the parents that can get into trouble for making products (including media) available to minors. It can lead to fines of up to 50.000€. You sell alcohol or an unappropriat game to a minor, you can get fined. You let a minor into a movie that isn`t age appropriat you can get fined. etc.etc. It`s quiet clear that society as a whole here is meant to secure the safety of minors. The problem is not just the parents, it`s people that are aware of a problem and ignoring it for either convinience or a lack of believe in self-efficacy.
Which leads me back to the question. Why isn`t steam caring more about this. Even if not for moral reasons, simply for economic ones. Because if this would be made more aware it probably would lead to a lot of critique. Same goes for publishers. (KLEI was just an example because they are on the forfront of the steamshop page right now and I would have betted they would have age ratings, but haven`t)
Ben Lubar Jun 21, 2024 @ 12:32am 
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
Are we talking about the same Klei Entertainment? The one that makes Don't Starve and Oxygen Not Included? Those aren't porn games.
r-cane Jun 21, 2024 @ 12:48am 
Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started....

Can you name a region where rating on PC for a digital product is mandatory?
The Audiovisual Media Services Directive aswell as the General Data Protection Regulation are a legal framework within the EU for protecting minors. But while they are rather strict when it comes to the distinction of 18+ material, anything below is usually left with leniency and is in the discretion of parents and individual countries, which usually haven`t adapted enforced labeling apart from stuf that is illegal to sell to minors.
The euCONSENT project is trying to find a way to create a reasonable way to deal with this, while International Age Rating Coalition tries to streamline the process of getting age ratings.


Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:
And when it comes to "age-gates" on a product page, they aren't there to protect children. They are there so that when a legal guardian tries to launch legal action, the store can turn around and tell them their child lied.
That is an argument that was had in the other forum aswell, but I disagree and so did others. Age ratings help parents to more easily decide which content is probably safe for their children, and which isn`t. So it is a tool, at least for parents who care, to protect their children.



Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:
In fact, certain ratings have been pulled from several Store pages on Steam in my region on at least one occasion when the related ratings board complained very vocally about how a publisher was "lying" to customers by displaying their age rating on a store page without the game being rated by them.
Well, that sounds pretty illegal to me, so by incorporating paragraphs into the general steam contracts with companies, valve would not only be able to not be held accountable in such circumstances, but they could also invoke legal actions against the publishers themselfs. Combines with fines in the paragraphs, it would probably be a pretty good tool to stop publishers from doing that.
r-cane Jun 21, 2024 @ 12:51am 
Originally posted by Ben Lubar:
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
Are we talking about the same Klei Entertainment? The one that makes Don't Starve and Oxygen Not Included? Those aren't porn games.
Why are some people completly focusing on "porn games"? You do realize that there is other stuff that is unhealthy for minors to consume, right?
Ben Lubar Jun 21, 2024 @ 12:57am 
Originally posted by r-cane:
Originally posted by Ben Lubar:
Are we talking about the same Klei Entertainment? The one that makes Don't Starve and Oxygen Not Included? Those aren't porn games.
Why are some people completly focusing on "porn games"? You do realize that there is other stuff that is unhealthy for minors to consume, right?
Can you give me an example of something that's "unhealthy for minors to consume" in a Klei Entertainment game?

Apparently the ESRB can't: https://www.esrb.org/ratings/10031495/dont-starve-together-console-edition/
Last edited by Ben Lubar; Jun 21, 2024 @ 12:59am
r-cane Jun 21, 2024 @ 1:04am 
Originally posted by Ben Lubar:
Originally posted by r-cane:
Why are some people completly focusing on "porn games"? You do realize that there is other stuff that is unhealthy for minors to consume, right?
Can you give me an example of something that's "unhealthy for minors to consume" in a Klei Entertainment game?

Apparently the ESRB can't: https://www.esrb.org/ratings/10031495/dont-starve-together-console-edition/
? You serious? You just put a link there that leads to a page saying it is meant for Teenagers and above (which not all minors are :steamfacepalm:) because of Fantasy Violence and Crude Humor. You basicly claimed that the link you posted that answered your own question, actually isn`t.
Ben Lubar Jun 21, 2024 @ 1:20am 
Originally posted by r-cane:
Originally posted by Ben Lubar:
Can you give me an example of something that's "unhealthy for minors to consume" in a Klei Entertainment game?

Apparently the ESRB can't: https://www.esrb.org/ratings/10031495/dont-starve-together-console-edition/
? You serious? You just put a link there that leads to a page saying it is meant for Teenagers and above (which not all minors are :steamfacepalm:) because of Fantasy Violence and Crude Humor. You basicly claimed that the link you posted that answered your own question, actually isn`t.

It's against the rules to sign up for a Steam account if you aren't at least thirteen years old. Everyone on Steam is at least a teenager.

If games on Steam needed age gates if they were rated as safe for teenagers, every game on Steam would have an age gate, thus defeating the point of age gating.
Last edited by Ben Lubar; Jun 21, 2024 @ 1:23am
Googled this...

13
You may not become a Subscriber if you are under the age of 13. Steam is not intended for children under 13 and Valve will not knowingly collect personal information from children under the age of 13. Additional age restrictions may apply in your country.


is this about parents and guardians being irresponsible and thinking steam
have to care about parenting other peoples children...
Crazy Tiger Jun 21, 2024 @ 4:38am 
Age ratings mainly exist to protect the companies. Parents decide what their kids can or cannot play, not some "rating".

None of the games made or published by Klei are unhealthy for minors. My 13 year old plays a few of them.
Kargor Jun 21, 2024 @ 5:27am 
Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started....

Can you name a region where rating on PC for a digital product is mandatory?

Around here, it's almost mandatory. They didn't outright say so, but if it's "not rated" then it's treated like FSK-18, and there are a lot of annoying obstacles around FSK-18 stuff.
veracsthane Jun 21, 2024 @ 5:40am 
Originally posted by ReBoot:
Originally posted by r-cane:
We had the discussion started by some outlandish claim in another part of the forum, but after some digging and the discussion making a turn we realised that some games on steam have no age restriction banners. What`s up with that? I dont think thats a good look on neither steam for being okay with that, not certain publishers like KLEI to not let their games get rated. I dont think it`s illegal per se, because in the country I live in it seems to be voluntary to put content ratings on a digital product, but still I think it is showing a lack of care for the protection of minors.
... yeah, because a minor would TOTALLY provide their real DOB when buying a porn game. Right? RIIIIIGHHTTTTTT?????

It's not about protection of minors, first & foremost. Second, Klei got literally 0 porn games. Third, it's still up to parents to take care of their children. No-body is obliged, morally nor legally, to let their child onto the internet unsupervised. Parents doing that are the problem, not the lack of banners.
and anyone telling you anything but this is lying to your face the esrb rating exists for a reason and companies always rat themselves out.


blizzard is the poster child for how companies actually behave. 80% of their player base is white stright males according to blizzard. trans are less then 1% and lgbt are like 1% agian according to blizzards own self published bs. women where 17ish% and most of those are either wow players or e thots streamers.

do not let people gas light you especially when these companies out themselves eventually 100% of the time about their own lies.
Ogami Jun 21, 2024 @ 6:34am 
Originally posted by Kargor:
Around here, it's almost mandatory. They didn't outright say so, but if it's "not rated" then it's treated like FSK-18, and there are a lot of annoying obstacles around FSK-18 stuff.


I think you mean USK. FSK is only for movies/shows, USK is for games.
Last edited by Ogami; Jun 21, 2024 @ 6:34am
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Date Posted: Jun 20, 2024 @ 11:19pm
Posts: 43