Why is steam boltware?

[__++__==]

Why does steam rely on google chrome exactly?

Can't valve write their own code?

[Chompman]

It's not google chrome but something called "Chromium Embedded Framework".

[[N]ebsun]

They use it because it makes it "easier to maintain the codebase" - though, I doubt that it really does in the end...

(single common language for the client and the frontend website, cross-platform functionality)

In reality it is probably a giant mess of code that is getting more and more complex with each new functionality added - to the point that it doesn't matter that the same developers code on the client or website, or whether it has few common languages... but at this point, it is more difficult to change that.

[Crazy Tiger]

It doesn't. It works on CEF, which is a framework that is open source and highly customisable. In the past before the switch to CEF Valve used an Internet Explorer based framework.

Why create something of your own when an existing, supported framework exists. Most gaming clients and browsers are based on CEF, mind.

[__++__==]

Originally posted by Crazy Tiger:

It doesn't. It works on CEF, which is a framework that is open source and highly customisable. In the past before the switch to CEF Valve used an Internet Explorer based framework.

Why create something of your own when an existing, supported framework exists. Most gaming clients and browsers are based on CEF, mind.

There is also Chromium Content API.
It's not clear what they are ACTUALLY USING. Because steam is not open source

Therefore semantics. Chrome garbage is chrome garbage

[FFL2and3rocks]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Originally posted by Crazy Tiger:

It doesn't. It works on CEF, which is a framework that is open source and highly customisable. In the past before the switch to CEF Valve used an Internet Explorer based framework.

Why create something of your own when an existing, supported framework exists. Most gaming clients and browsers are based on CEF, mind.

There is also Chromium Content API.
It's not clear what they are ACTUALLY USING. Because steam is not open source

Therefore semantics. Chrome garbage is chrome garbage

Okay.

[Nx Machina]

Originally posted by __++__==:

There is also Chromium Content API.
It's not clear what they are ACTUALLY USING. Because steam is not open source

Therefore semantics. Chrome garbage is chrome garbage

https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Chromium_Embedded_Framework

The Steam client on Windows, Linux, and macOS previously a customized version of CEF to render web content like the Store and Community.

As of June 15, 2023, the entire UI was remade with web technologies and is now rendered using CEF, replacing the old VGUI interface.

VGUI was not completely removed, and was kept just in case CEF stops working correctly, telling users to restart Steam, or to warn users that Windows compatibility mode is enabled.

[metamec]

Originally posted by Crazy Tiger:

Why create something of your own when an existing, supported framework exists. Most gaming clients and browsers are based on CEF, mind.

This.

Why reinvent the wheel? Particularly when the wheel users want took 15 years of innovation to reach this stage.

Any in-house browser which does not incorporate reusable components is going to be incompatible with the vast majority of websites that users visit. Or at least those websites are not going to render or execute scripts as expected. Never mind that the increased development costs associated with such an endeavour would likely be passed onto the end user.

Edit: I quoted the wrong person. Sorry Tiger. 🙃

[[N]ebsun]

Originally posted by metamec:

Why reinvent the wheel?

Do you drive around on stone balls ? (one of the earliest forms of "wheel")...
The wheel has been "re-invented", many times.

The issue is the use of an embedded browser / framework in a desktop application in the first place..
Native application design is a better end user experience

[metamec]

Originally posted by Nebsun:

Originally posted by metamec:

Why reinvent the wheel?

Do you drive around on stone balls ?

No. I am fond of idiomatic metaphors though. And avoiding getting too side-tracked by those who insist on taking them literally.

Originally posted by Nebsun:

The issue is the use of a browser in a desktop application in the first place..

There is no good reason to reinvent the wheel—in this case, build a browser from scratch for use within the Steam overlay—given the costs and complexity involved.

[Mountain Months]

valve's revenue is in the billions and gabe newell has "an armada of yachts" but apparently a lightweight, stable, non-google codebase is just way too much to ask

[Nx Machina]

Originally posted by Mountain Months:

valve's revenue is in the billions and gabe newell has "an armada of yachts" but apparently a lightweight, stable, non-google codebase is just way too much to ask

:winterbunny2023:

You are aware the other PC clients such as Battle net, Epic Games Launcher, GOG Galaxy, Ubisoft Connect all use CEF.

[Cathulhu]

But of course it's only bad when big Valve does it, which is a smaller company than either Ubisoft, Epic, CD Project or Activision.

[Wolfpig]

Originally posted by Nx Machina:

Originally posted by Mountain Months:

valve's revenue is in the billions and gabe newell has "an armada of yachts" but apparently a lightweight, stable, non-google codebase is just way too much to ask

:winterbunny2023:

You are aware the other PC clients such as Battle net, Epic Games Launcher, GOG Galaxy, Ubisoft Connect all use CEF.

You have worded it wrong.

It should be:
No software has ever used a custom webengine to display their webcontent.
They always relied on existing ones, which either where the ones already distributed with the OS or later the custom frameworks.


And yes, we all know that when we try to explain that to some people we could also tell that the wall in the room, as they do not want to hear that.....as they just troll either way and ignore useful answers.

[☎need4naiim☎]

Independence beats any advantage coming from CEF. In my humble opinion, Valve should make a Client COMPLETELY independent of any other software owned by other companies.

I hope they will learn "something something" from CEF and then will stop using it in the future and then update Steam's VGUI with that "knowledge" later on.

This kinda resembles what the War General Skanderberg did after spending years in Ottoman's highest grade schools (Enderun) during his youth. Then he returned to Albania and defended every attack at his homelands until his death.

[Cray]

Originally posted by Crazy Tiger:

Why create something of your own when an existing, supported framework exists. Most gaming clients and browsers are based on CEF, mind.

I mean, they originally did, and steam was snappy back then. Now .. not so much.