"JUST UPGRADE" - except Windows 8 and beyond do not support firewire.

[__++__==]

Imagine you bought an expensive device that runs on firewire - for example a high end audio interface. If you "just upgrade" to windows 8 or beyond, you will come into problems with firewire....hell Windows 11 does not even support firewire........ because Microsoft has basically become the laziest most contemptful software company under the sun. Too lazy and pathetic to kick out a basic hardware driver

Because its all too hard for steam to just greenlight the DRM checks to let people play the games on the software and hardware they originally bought it on, you're now FORCED to run multiple operating systems and or buy new hardware ....

[__++__==]

Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:

Originally posted by __++__==:

Has nothing to do with Windows abandoning firewire. Ad-hominems are the resort of a lost argument or position

It has everything to do with your behaviour on this forum, and any one who's been around here the past few months knows it. What's next on your list? The fact win 11 doesn't support punch cards? cassette tapes? Zip drives?

Besides that, Valve are not stopping you from using an older PC to support any firewire based technology you might have (which I highly doubt you have any of). If you want to play Steam games in the future when Steam no longer works on windows 7/8, then get more modern hardware specifically for that task and keep the older hardware for older peripherals.

I still have a Win XP machine specifically to support an old scanner that's still in use, and for that matter another machine with a built-in firewire port. But I also know when to get newer hardware and operating systems for modern uses, too. This is not a hard concept, anyone who seriously relies on older outdated peripherals is already using working solutions that have no connection to Steam.

Buy more stuff to use the software you paid for which runs on the hardware you already own......

Why should I have to?

[Komarimaru]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Originally posted by Chika Ogiue:

It has everything to do with your behaviour on this forum, and any one who's been around here the past few months knows it. What's next on your list? The fact win 11 doesn't support punch cards? cassette tapes? Zip drives?

Besides that, Valve are not stopping you from using an older PC to support any firewire based technology you might have (which I highly doubt you have any of). If you want to play Steam games in the future when Steam no longer works on windows 7/8, then get more modern hardware specifically for that task and keep the older hardware for older peripherals.

I still have a Win XP machine specifically to support an old scanner that's still in use, and for that matter another machine with a built-in firewire port. But I also know when to get newer hardware and operating systems for modern uses, too. This is not a hard concept, anyone who seriously relies on older outdated peripherals is already using working solutions that have no connection to Steam.

Buy more stuff to use the software you paid for which runs on the hardware you already own......

Why should I have to?

Except that Windows 10 and 11 can use firewire if use the default drivers, manufacturers of the old hardware simply didn't want to make new compatible drivers. But the devices will work.

And most device manufacturers swapped to USB anyway, for any that are decent. Even RME updated to USB, but still offers Firewire for those on antiquated hardware.

[__++__==]

Originally posted by Komarimaru:

Originally posted by __++__==:

Buy more stuff to use the software you paid for which runs on the hardware you already own......

Why should I have to?

Except that Windows 10 and 11 can use firewire if use the default drivers, manufacturers of the old hardware simply didn't want to make new compatible drivers. But the devices will work.

And most device manufacturers swapped to USB anyway, for any that are decent. Even RME updated to USB, but still offers Firewire for those on antiquated hardware.

Here's the thing, all the hardware works in Windows 7....

[Komarimaru]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Originally posted by Komarimaru:

Except that Windows 10 and 11 can use firewire if use the default drivers, manufacturers of the old hardware simply didn't want to make new compatible drivers. But the devices will work.

And most device manufacturers swapped to USB anyway, for any that are decent. Even RME updated to USB, but still offers Firewire for those on antiquated hardware.

Here's the thing, all the hardware works in Windows 7....

And it works on 10 and 11 as well. What's your point? The default driver does just fine. You don't need a custom driver like in Windows 7.

[metamec]

Firewire support went south because of direct memory access issues. A lot of people don't want gaping security holes like that in their operating systems.

I'm a little confused about Windows 11 support for Firewire. My understanding is that there is limited built-in support for certain kinds of device while unsupported devices need a driver from the hardware manufacturer. If its impossible to develop one for the new (Win 11) driver model due to the security holes that are now blocked, then that's on the manufacturer. They should have been more attentive to the flaws when they developed the product.

[__++__==]

Originally posted by metamec:

Firewire support went south because of direct memory access issues. A lot of people don't want gaping security holes like that in their operating systems.

Yeah I'm sure there's a massive threat of someone breaking into your house and plugging in via firewire to access direct memory

USB is vunlnerable to DMA attacks as well. I guess we should brick USB drivers as well

I'm a little confused about Windows 11 support for Firewire. My understanding is that there is limited built-in support for certain kinds of device while unsupported devices need a driver from the hardware manufacturer. If its impossible to develop one for the new (Win 11) driver model due to the security holes that are now blocked, then that's on the manufacturer. They should have been more attentive to the flaws when they developed the product.

Like I said; USB has the same DMA vulnerabilities

[Chika Ogiue]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Buy more stuff to use the software you paid for which runs on the hardware you already own......

Why should I have to?

You already know the answer. Because that software isn't going to stay working on that hardware at some point past the date Valve warned you about. And that's something you AGREED to every time you made a purchase. In fact, look at your non-Steam purchases and their user agreements, I guarantee you that no software or hardware promises you 100% ability to use the software/hardware in perpetuity in whichever operating environment you had at the time of purchase.

[Crashed]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Originally posted by .EteRnal.:

Except Windows 11 does support it.

Except, you're wrong - every singe audio interface company has said that firewire on WIn 11 is a no go

Where did you get that info?

[Crashed]

Originally posted by Komarimaru:

Originally posted by __++__==:

Here's the thing, all the hardware works in Windows 7....

And it works on 10 and 11 as well. What's your point? The default driver does just fine. You don't need a custom driver like in Windows 7.

Maybe it stops working when the computer goes to screen saver or lock screen because the kernel DMA protection kicks in.

[__++__==]

The suggestions such as using a USB adapter are stupid as USB sends data in packets whereas Firewire does not.

[Cathulhu]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_1394
Firewire uses packets as well.
You seriously have no idea what you are talking about.

[BaLuX]

Originally posted by Cathulhu:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_1394
Firewire uses packets as well.
You seriously have no idea what you are talking about.

I bet he just googled about it and picked one of the results that suit his narrative.

[Crazy Tiger]

Originally posted by Cathulhu:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_1394
Firewire uses packets as well.
You seriously have no idea what you are talking about.

Correct. It's all just making drama about Valve/Steam as aftermath of the CoH3 debacle. This time the dropping of support is the vector.

[BJWyler]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Buy more stuff to use the software you paid for which runs on the hardware you already own......

Why should I have to?

You don't have to. You either use what you got until it doesn't work any more or you do what you need to do to continue to future proof with advancing technology. It's so simple even a cave man can understand it.

Originally posted by __++__==:

Here's the thing, all the hardware works in Windows 7....

So what? Windows 7 is yesterday's news and is being phased out of support by the tech industry. If you don't like it, perhaps you can find an old abacus lying around because the rest of the world is moving on.

Originally posted by __++__==:

The suggestions such as using a USB adapter are stupid as USB sends data in packets whereas Firewire does not.

Hey, whatever floats your boat, bud. But the rest of the world is done with the paddle boat and heading down the information superhighway with them newfangled motors. Nobody cares how much you love your paddles. You can join the rest of the world or just get left behind.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

Originally posted by __++__==:

Originally posted by Komarimaru:

Except that Windows 10 and 11 can use firewire if use the default drivers, manufacturers of the old hardware simply didn't want to make new compatible drivers. But the devices will work.

And most device manufacturers swapped to USB anyway, for any that are decent. Even RME updated to USB, but still offers Firewire for those on antiquated hardware.

Here's the thing, all the hardware works in Windows 7, 8.1, 10, & 11....

Fixed it for you.

Originally posted by metamec:

Firewire support went south because of direct memory access issues. A lot of people don't want gaping security holes like that in their operating systems.

I'm a little confused about Windows 11 support for Firewire. My understanding is that there is limited built-in support for certain kinds of device while unsupported devices need a driver from the hardware manufacturer. If its impossible to develop one for the new (Win 11) driver model due to the security holes that are now blocked, then that's on the manufacturer. They should have been more attentive to the flaws when they developed the product.

Depending on things they are either removed, or disable by default, the end user are put at risk for themselves when they readd/enable the things end user may want it for, such as running legacy devices, or software for that matter. Can always remove/disable the things again.