So Steam is going to be "second hand" gaming shop?

[Legata Flavia]

Aka, almost everything is going to be 1yr epic exclusive, or Steam is doing something to prevent that?

[✵ Julianne ✵]

Do you know what "Second Hand" means?

And it's not up to Steam, It's up to the developers / publishers to do as they please. This is America after all, Land of the free, home of the brave.

[ReBoot]

What's "almost everything"? We haven't had new EGS-timed-exclusives for a while now.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

Define almost everything, because far as I know only handful are doing these things on Epic as of late, and most of the games from 2019 launch are showing up already on Steam 2020, it's kind of surprising people forgot were in 2020 already that about to go into 2021, whee basically anything remaining is going show up on later on Steam, and GoG. And so far numbers don't lie, some people really rather wait for release of their game on Steam, or GoG over Epic.

Then there was the whole Xbox ultimate game pass back in 2019, get to play Metro, outer world's, and several of those exclusive that were on Epic were added on Game pass on window store, which game pass was only $1 for first month, or $2 for first two months which is better than paying $200+ for all the games on day one launch day.

✵ Julianne ✵ eredeti hozzászólása:

Land of the free, home of the brave.

*Cough*

[Ganger]

Well, over the last two years I have lost count on how many games epic has taken away from steam. Even now, you have the likes of Mortal Shell, Hitman 3, ghost busters remastered, world war Z, Crysis remastered, Ubi soft titles and many more great titles that we won't see on steam for a year or even never.

✵ Julianne ✵ eredeti hozzászólása:

And it's not up to Steam, It's up to the developers / publishers to do as they please. This is America after all, Land of the free, home of the brave.

This is the problem, epic offers incentives to developers to come over to epic games store. So epic gets all the games steam gamers want. Steam users moan, complain and shout boycotts on the forums while at the same time valve keeps quite and lets us fight amount ourselves.

Let I always said, its up too valve to fight for games not we the gamer.

[J4MESOX4D]

𝕭𝖑𝖔𝖓𝖉𝖎𝖊 eredeti hozzászólása:

Aka, almost everything is going to be 1yr epic exclusive, or Steam is doing something to prevent that?

Almost everything = under 10 games

Steam doesn't have to do anything and does not need to either. EA have returned, ALL future first party Microsoft exclusives are likely to be here and we've also seen Horizon Zero Dawn.

Most Epic exclusives have been pretty dire and when they do arrive here, they are at least half price and by then there are much better games out or I've forgotten it even existed in the first place.

If a game goes to Epic now, it's not even worth buying anyway.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

Ganger eredeti hozzászólása:

Well, over the last two years I have lost count on how many games epic has taken away from steam. Even now, you have the likes of Mortal Shell, Hitman 3, ghost busters remastered, world war Z, Crysis remastered, Ubi soft titles and many more great titles that we won't see on steam for a year or even never.

✵ Julianne ✵ eredeti hozzászólása:

And it's not up to Steam, It's up to the developers / publishers to do as they please. This is America after all, Land of the free, home of the brave.

This is the problem, epic offers incentives to developers to come over to epic games store. So epic gets all the games steam gamers want. Steam users moan, complain and shout boycotts on the forums while at the same time valve keeps quite and lets us fight amount ourselves.

Let I always said, its up too valve to fight for games not we the gamer.

Ubisoft release a VR game on Steam two days ago, they tied to keep it a secret for whatever reason, but not listed on Epic at all. Yes there are VR games on Epic they also use SteamVR which is not required to use Steam.

Also GoG not even trying to fight Epic either rather using the friendliest PR move to show how pro they can be for consumers, but again not exactly trying competing against Epic at all either. Plus some of the games are also affected as well that were planned for Gog get delay, or never come, it not just Steam in this.

I don't expect Steam, and GoG do what Epic wants which Epic wanted the console logic on PC even though the idea doesn't work, nor stable as no one wins as it will be money burning fest, which why only console work is because you're lock in with piece of plastic you fork a large check on, versus PC which no one lock to anything, and no one need to be dedicated to anything either, heck even the devs know it's silly to limit your access to point of sales as lower your visibility and sales by limiting yourself on PC if the exclusivity pay is not worth it. Often enough publishers are sometimes one track goldfish mindset needed to be reminded how there more than one store on PC they can promote their game on for sale.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

J4MESOX4D eredeti hozzászólása:

𝕭𝖑𝖔𝖓𝖉𝖎𝖊 eredeti hozzászólása:

Aka, almost everything is going to be 1yr epic exclusive, or Steam is doing something to prevent that?

Almost everything = under 10 games

Steam doesn't have to do anything and does not need to either. EA have returned, ALL future first party Microsoft exclusives are likely to be here and we've also seen Horizon Zero Dawn.

Most Epic exclusives have been pretty dire and when they do arrive here, they are at least half price and by then there are much better games out or I've forgotten it even existed in the first place.

If a game goes to Epic now, it's not even worth buying anyway.

Often enough far as I know most common reason why they go for exclusivity with Epic are these reasons.

A) Needs the funds badly, and willing to put up with the negative feedback. Epic does offer a large up front cash, example like control, or etc where they paid millions of dollars just to make it only exclusive to Epic for x amount of time.

B) Has doubts about their fans supporting their game on launch, and expecting a large sale count. Which Epic does promise a fix amount of sales, which covers the sale window they wanted, so if lack sale, epic pay the remaining.

C) Both A) and B).

So take it with grain of salt why Dev/Publishers jump for the exclusivity deal as it's easy pay check for them, without having to rely on us the consumer to support them by buying their game.

[J4MESOX4D]

Dr.Shadowds 🐉 eredeti hozzászólása:

J4MESOX4D eredeti hozzászólása:

Almost everything = under 10 games

Steam doesn't have to do anything and does not need to either. EA have returned, ALL future first party Microsoft exclusives are likely to be here and we've also seen Horizon Zero Dawn.

Most Epic exclusives have been pretty dire and when they do arrive here, they are at least half price and by then there are much better games out or I've forgotten it even existed in the first place.

If a game goes to Epic now, it's not even worth buying anyway.

Often enough far as I know most common reason why they go for exclusivity with Epic are these reasons.

A) Needs the funds badly, and willing to put up with the negative feedback. Epic does offer a large up front cash, example like control, or etc where they paid millions of dollars just to make it only exclusive to Epic for x amount of time.

B) Has doubts about their fans supporting their game on launch, and expecting a large sale count. Which Epic does promise a fix amount of sales, which covers the sale window they wanted, so if lack sale, epic pay the remaining.

C) Both A) and B).

So take it with grain of salt why Dev/Publishers jump for the exclusivity deal as it's easy pay check for them, without having to rely on us the consumer to support them by buying their game.

Also C) Pure Greed - Darkest Dungeon 2 is a prime example of that.

That game made a ridiculous amount of money and garnered a huge playerbase on here. The sequel was always gonna be a guaranteed success especially as the boardgame made $1m in one day through Kickstarter despite the publishers being multi-millionaires. They are pocketing the Epic money through the early access period and then are releasing the full game on Steam in the future for a double payoff essentially. Be very interesting to see how that game fares as an alpha on that platform after many people turned their back on it who helped guide the original through to release and its huge success.

[Gallifrey - CSSC Gaming Founder]

Epic's strategy would only really make sense if it was attacking a weak competitor. By depriving it of its main sources of income they could kill or cripple it.

However looking at the increase in Steam's concurrent users over the past two years the likelihood is not only that Steam remains vastly profitable but that its profits have increased dramatically. Epic's market impact will have been to slow the rate of Valve's profit growth. If Valve were a tank Epic's impact will have been to scuff a track and place a small mark on the paintwork.

If a game doesn't release on Steam most people don't appear to be tracking it to Epic but buying something different on Steam instead. Borderlands 3 may have been an exception, Darkest Dungeon 2 too. But a lot of gamers will have been reasonably content to wait the additional year or so, have the devs sort out the launch bugs and add some extra content, and then buy it cheaper on Steam.

Valve would be irresponsible and self harming to enter into a bidding war with Epic that would simply massively increase game prices (since the exclusivity payments would have to be recouped somehow). They are also unusually out gunned. They are potentially going up against one of the few entities on the planet that could financially outspend them - the Chinese government.

For every developer who takes their game to Epic Valve have more than a dozen eager to take their publicity shots. The issue is quality - but gaming's now a global industry and Valve certainly aren't limited in choice of whom to promote.

It would be a cultural disaster if Epic put Valve out of business. Epic is Chinese backed and plays by Chinese rules. Freedom of expression effectively doesn't exist and Epic would filter out a lot of Steam's range. No more discussion pages. No more player reviews. Users would face total bans from the site for saying things the Chinese government didn't like - and not necessarily on site.

On the other hand I don't want Epic to go out of business just yet. Partly it was because Valve in recent years have been somewhat complacent, even bordering on the contemptuous, about their community. A serious competitor threat will cause them to up their game. Also, y'know, lot of free games I've still got to play yet.

S.x.

[Gallifrey - CSSC Gaming Founder]

Eisberg eredeti hozzászólása:

Gallifrey - CSSC Gaming Founder eredeti hozzászólása:

Epic's strategy would only really make sense if it was attacking a weak competitor. By depriving it of its main sources of income they could kill or cripple it.

However looking at the increase in Steam's concurrent users over the past two years the likelihood is not only that Steam remains vastly profitable but that its profits have increased dramatically. Epic's market impact will have been to slow the rate of Valve's profit growth. If Valve were a tank Epic's impact will have been to scuff a track and place a small mark on the paintwork.

If a game doesn't release on Steam most people don't appear to be tracking it to Epic but buying something different on Steam instead. Borderlands 3 may have been an exception, Darkest Dungeon 2 too. But a lot of gamers will have been reasonably content to wait the additional year or so, have the devs sort out the launch bugs and add some extra content, and then buy it cheaper on Steam.

Valve would be irresponsible and self harming to enter into a bidding war with Epic that would simply massively increase game prices (since the exclusivity payments would have to be recouped somehow). They are also unusually out gunned. They are potentially going up against one of the few entities on the planet that could financially outspend them - the Chinese government.

For every developer who takes their game to Epic Valve have more than a dozen eager to take their publicity shots. The issue is quality - but gaming's now a global industry and Valve certainly aren't limited in choice of whom to promote.

It would be a cultural disaster if Epic put Valve out of business. Epic is Chinese backed and plays by Chinese rules. Freedom of expression effectively doesn't exist and Epic would filter out a lot of Steam's range. No more discussion pages. No more player reviews. Users would face total bans from the site for saying things the Chinese government didn't like - and not necessarily on site.

On the other hand I don't want Epic to go out of business just yet. Partly it was because Valve in recent years have been somewhat complacent, even bordering on the contemptuous, about their community. A serious competitor threat will cause them to up their game. Also, y'know, lot of free games I've still got to play yet.

S.x.

Chinese company that is a minority share holder literally has no power over Epic because, they are a minority share holder, and the majority shareholder is an American who gets to make all the decisions. This idea that some how Epic is ruled by Chinese government is nothing more than on the same level of conspiracy theories. I mean, if you really want to go down that route, then look at Valve, and realize that Valve has a massive amount of market in China, who is most likely going to want to play nice with Chinese government and do what that Government wants? Valve who has massive business in China, where a large portion of their customer base is from China, or Epic who has barely any business in China since Fortnite isn't even monetized in China at all, Fornite and EGS isn't popular in China, leaving pretty much the only thing they have in China is their asset creation team that creates art assets for Epic and third parties which can easily be replaced with developers any where else in the world. Valve has a ton to lose if they don't play with China, a ton they can lose and no feasible way to replace, where as Epic has very little to lose and is easily replaceable... yeah, it is far more likely that Valve would want to play nice with the Chinese Government than Epic would. heck, Epic is on record stating they don't censor speech, meanwhile Valve kicked off a Pro-Hong Kong game from Steam.

See how easy it is to come up with these "conspiracy theory" type things using known facts and then making up theories in between?

Hi Eisberg,

You'll have noted that the Epic site totally lacks any space for customer feedback on any topic.

The golden rule - he who has the gold makes the rules. Someone is financing some seriously expensive giveaways at Epic.

Ruled by the Chinese government ? No. But having to play by their rules to keep a major investor onboard - yes.

Steam, if it chose, could literally flip the bird at China and have nothing further to do with it. It would harm profits, sure, but Steam doesn't NEED its Chinese business for survival. Most of its income comes from outside China.

People "go on record" with a lot of things. Doesn't mean what they say is true. When Epic has discussion and review pages that mirror Steam's I might reconsider.

S.x.

[Dr.Shadowds 🐉]

*cough*
https://www.wegame.com.cn/store/2000196/Fortnite

Eisberg unless you got proof that Steam/GoG/Etc need to depend on China to stay a float I suggest back it up.

Just because Tencent not the majority shareholder, doesn't mean can't form deals, nor hold discussion with the shareholder. Not saying Tencent runs them either.

[Brian9824]

Less then .1% of games are epic exclusives, and Epic Store has been losing money by having them be exclusive. The only reason they aren't dead is because they are using their Fortnite money to stay alive. Without Fortnite they'd be out of business already.

[Legata Flavia]

Its far more than just a 10 games and new titles tends to keep the practice.

I know the definition of second hands. But the 1 year practice is giving me such a feel, like Steam is becoming second-grade, second-hand shop in the figurative sense of the word. Not my problem, that you cant get the pun.

[Ganger]

𝕭𝖑𝖔𝖓𝖉𝖎𝖊 eredeti hozzászólása:

Its far more than just a 10 games and new titles tends to keep the practice

Here is a upto date list of epic's exclusives games list. Mind you some games have come to steam over the last few years. its no small list of games.

3 out of 10
A Knight's Quest
Airborne Kingdom
Among Trees
Anno 1800
Arise: A Simple Story
Assassin's Creed Valhalla
Auto Chess
Battle Breakers
Bee Simulator
Before We Leave
Bloodroots
Borderlands 3
Bugsnax
Castle Storm 2
Chivalry 2
Corruption 2029
The Cycle
Dangerous Driving
Darkest Dungeon II
Dauntless
Diabotical
The Division 2
Dread Nautical
Eternal Cylinder
Foregone
Fortnite
Ghost Recon Breakpoint
Ghostbusters: The Video Game Remastered
Godfall
Hitman 3
Huntdown
Immortals Fenyx Rising
Industries Of Titan
Jett: The Far Shore
John Wick Hex
Journey to the Savage Planet
Kena: Bridge of Spirits
The Last Campfire
Magic: The Gathering Arena
Maneater
MechWarrior 5: Mercenaries
Mortal Shell
No Straight Roads
Oddworld: Soulstorm
Old World
Omen of Sorrow
Ooblets
Overpass
The Pathless
Phantom Brigade
Phoenix Point
Predator: Hunting Grounds
ReadySet Heroes
Red dead II
The Red Lantern
Rocket League
Rogue Company
RollerCoaster Tycoon Adventures
Rune II
Saints Row: The Third Remastered
Samurai Shodown
Saturnalia
The Settlers
Shakedown: Hawaii
Shenmue III
The Sinking City
Sludge Life
SnowRunner
Solar Ash
Spellbreak
Super Meat Boy Forever
Superliminal
SuperMash
Surgeon Simulator 2
Tetris Effect
Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 1 + 2
Total War Saga: Troy
Totally Reliable Delivery Service
Twin Mirror
Unexplored 2: The Wayfarer's Legacy
Unreal Tournament
The Walking Dead: The Telltale Definitive Series
Watch Dogs: Legion
Wattam
The Wolf Among Us 2
World War Z
Yaga
Zombie Army 4: Dead War

[J4MESOX4D]

𝕭𝖑𝖔𝖓𝖉𝖎𝖊 eredeti hozzászólása:

Its far more than just a 10 games and new titles tends to keep the practice.

I know the definition of second hands. But the 1 year practice is giving me such a feel, like Steam is becoming second-grade, second-hand shop in the figurative sense of the word. Not my problem, that you cant get the pun.

Most of the games are trash - 2020's list of Epic Exclusives are mostly average unheard of titles that 99.99% of Steam users wont have even heard of. Steam this year has made huge strides in terms of acquisitions which will lead on in the future - this includes potential PS5 exclusives along with confirmed Xbox Series X titles.

Sounds like you need to improve your taste in games really if that's how you view it.