A trend in game reviews on steam

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ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月17日 8時25分

Ive noticed that regardless of the game it seems all bad reviews come from people who play between 0.1hours and 4 hours can you really review a game after 10 mins of play

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投稿主: LunaFortuna:

There is a reason that critics who write for newspapers, for example, have to see the entire thing through in order to come to a conclusion. No newspaper or magazine would ever pay someone to write a review on something that they only experienced 5-10% of, if not less. Whether it be reviewing a movie, a novel, a play, etc., things often have to be seen in their entirety in order to form a 100% accurate opinion. Why? Because opinions evolve. I'm sure we've all played games, watched movies, watched TV shows, read books, etc. that started off crappy or slow, but, grew on us the more we became immersed in them. Steam reviews are often impulse reviews, written without completing a decent portion of the game. "To The Moon", for example, started off very slowly for me. I started that game and lost interest within the few 20 minutes. I stopped and started that game roughly three times before giving it a fair chance. Now, if you go to my profile, you will see that it's listed as my favorite game. I stuck it out til the end, and, I loved every minute of it once I realized what a gem it was. Similarly, I was quite bored with the movie Interstellar because I felt that it started off very slowly, but, I ended up absolutely loving that film once it was over. Very similar instances have happened with other games that I've played, with movies, novels, etc.

If the me who watched Interstellar for 10 minutes went to Amazon to write a review on the WHOLE movie (based on the first 10 minute impression), I'd have stated that the movie is slow and boring. However, if the me who watched the movie to completion were to write a review right now, I'd be gushing about how it's an incredible movie.

Anyone here who is claiming that playing a game for 10 minutes or so and leaving a negative review is okay, because it's the person's opinion, doesn't take into consideration that opinions change, as I said. If you watched 10 minutes of a 3 hour movie, or played 10 minutes of a game that usually takes 30+ hours to beat, or read 10 minutes worth of an 800 page novel, you don't have an "opinion" about said movie / game / novel - you have an opinion on what the first 10 minutes were like for you. We can't all love a movie within the first 10 minutes, or a game, or novel, TV show, etc. Whether we will love it or hate it is something that can only be seen later on, as the story progresses. Yes, first impressions are a real thing and the subconscious mind usually makes up whether it's going to like or dislike something within those first few minutes, but, that opinion isn't about the entire finished piece, as a WHOLE. Any opinion that you form about something like this is only based on your first few minutes of it. As in, if someone plays a game for 10 minutes and write a negative review, stating that they hate "the game", they cannot possibly hate the game - they hate the first few minutes of the game. First few minutes of the game and the completed game in its entirety = not the same thing.

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On Vacation 2018年2月22日 5時39分

I play games to be entertained and frankly I value my time. If a game can not draw me in, in some manner usually within 30 minutes to an hour, then I'm not likely to continue to play it. Perhaps I will miss out on a great game. That is the risk I take and I can accept such.

When it comes to reviews, it doesn't ask if the product is garbage, good or what have you. It asks would you recommend it and if I stopped playing your game because I didn't enjoy or didn't feel I got the perceived value out of it then the answer is typically going to be "no" regardless of what point that occurs.

In my 'review' I would put whatever put me off that made me decide not to pursue the game further. To put it plainly I answer the question of would I recommend it or not, which is hopefully helpful to like minded individuals. People can see what put me off, see my playtime, and then draw their own conclusions. You want more? Fine, that's perfectly valid, you do you.

You can argue semantics if you'd like over what a review means literally, but how many sites that use community driven reviews to aggregate data actually fit that definition? I can't really think of many....imagine that.

#46

Start_Running 2018年2月22日 5時59分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
The word review as defined by the oxford dictionary subsection 2

"A critical appraisal of a book, play, film, etc. published in a newspaper or magazine." Which is where a game review would fall into.

So its not a review then like i said it should be called User opinion not User review.

Yes and you are using a rather deliberately outdated and arbitarily limited definition of the noun.

You could use:
A review is a report in the media in which someone gives their opinion of something such as a new book or film. (Collins)

A critical evaluation (as of a book or play) (Merriam-Webster).

Even in the Oxford definition the keyword is 'publication' or 'published'. which if you check their own definitiom: subsection 1.2: Make (content) available online.

So yeah. User reviews are, even by Oxford Definition, reviews. They are published critical appraisals. And reviews of subjective matters are nothing but opinion. Especially when it comes to books, film, music, etc. vThere is no authority or objective metric. You can review say the performance of a worker by the objective measures of: accuracy, efficacy, time taken, effeciency, etc. You can review the performance of a piece of a equipment or tool based on, useability, durability, efficacy, even food and drink can be reviewed based on things like nutrioonal value, edibility, and toxicity.

With a product geared towards entertainment, there is only the binary of whether or not the audience is entertained and engaged and that is 100% subjective to the audience. Tell a joke to a hundred different people and you will always find some who laugh and some who don't. Some people will laugh at the Blonde Knock-Knock joke, others will roill their eyes and others will likely want to slap you.

It's the same for books, film, and games. There are no 'great' books. there is no film that does not have at least 10 people who enjoyed watching it and you will be hard pressed to find a game that did not provide someone with a quantity of entertainment value worthy of its cost.

Some people enjoy laughing at terrible things, and other people make highly monitized videos based on bad things.

#47

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月22日 6時48分

The Rock God の投稿を引用：
ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
The word review as defined by the oxford dictionary subsection 2

"A critical appraisal of a book, play, film, etc. published in a newspaper or magazine." Which is where a game review would fall into.

So its not a review then like i said it should be called User opinion not User review.

You keep using one narrow definition as if it proves your point.

"At the Movies" ran for over a decade, but apparently contained no movie reviews by Siskel and Ebert because it was a TV show.
There are many websites that publish reviews, but none of them count because they don't also print it out on paper.
On the other hand, a review written by a kid in high school is more legit because it is printed in the school newspaper.

No im using the definition of the word

#48

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月22日 6時51分

Start_Running の投稿を引用：
ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
The word review as defined by the oxford dictionary subsection 2

"A critical appraisal of a book, play, film, etc. published in a newspaper or magazine." Which is where a game review would fall into.

So its not a review then like i said it should be called User opinion not User review.

Yes and you are using a rather deliberately outdated and arbitarily limited definition of the noun.

So get the word changed in the dictionary then also while your at it look at the definition of opinion

People trash a language that they write in which to me is more insane than repeating yourself

#49

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月22日 6時54分

Forgive me people for wanting a word used correctly I must have been wrongly educated.

#50

Start_Running 2018年2月22日 7時33分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
Forgive me people for wanting a word used correctly I must have been wrongly educated.

As I pointed out. You're cherry picking and I do believe managing an od variation of the equivocacy fallacy at the same time.

Even by Oxford standards, user-reviews , qualify as reviews as they are indeed published crititique.

#51

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月22日 9時05分

Start_Running の投稿を引用：
ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
Forgive me people for wanting a word used correctly I must have been wrongly educated.

As I pointed out. You're cherry picking and I do believe managing an od variation of the equivocacy fallacy at the same time.

Even by Oxford standards, user-reviews , qualify as reviews as they are indeed published crititique.

Of course a "review" can be legitimate on steam but you can not review a game in 10mins it would be a report or an opinion at best

Try reading an entire thread before casting your opinion i have never stated it cannot be classed as a review. I stated if you have 10 min game time then you cannot review a product which is clearly alot longer.

Is reading 10 pages of a novel then writing about it a review of that novel?

Is watching 10mins of a movie then writing about it a review?....No its not

But on steam it is a review not a opinion not a report not an observation but a review.

My OP is to point out games are "reviewed" on steam with tiny amounts of time on the game so therefore not reviews they are opinions from that person or at best a report on their findings.
And if cherry picking is how you class correct use of a word then why bother making a sensible sentence anymore lets take any word and use it in any context we feel we can justify.

If there is a game that is only 10mins long then yes writing up on it would be a review but games are not 10min long but yet on the very first page you see on a game the review status is at the top of the page and reviews influence peoples opinions.

#52

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月22日 9時13分

FYI your sentence is wrong it would be equivocal fallacy not "equivocacy fallacy" but im sure you knew that.

最近の変更はProF4HUntaaが行いました; 2018年2月22日 9時13分

#53

VisciousFishes 2018年2月22日 9時50分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
FYI your sentence is wrong it would be equivocal fallacy not "equivocacy fallacy" but im sure you knew that.

Or "false equivalence".

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
But on steam it is a review not a opinion not a report not an observation but a review.

Erm, excuse me but a review is an opinion. It may be codified by an in depth critique examining what the person find relevant to their experience but to see a review (professional or not) it's still an opinion.

What this thread is really about is at what point does the veracity of the review become relevant. No matter what you dress it up as, it's still an opinion of the opinion of others and whether you think they are invalid due to your preconceptions of what a review should be.

#54

Quint the Alligator Snapper 2018年2月22日 9時56分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
FYI your sentence is wrong it would be equivocal fallacy not "equivocacy fallacy" but im sure you knew that.

And FYI your OP is wrong because this is not a "trend" but just a phenomenon that has been occurring since a while ago. :P

Anyhow, the more practical aspect of this is that this would all be solved (aside from nitpicking about wording) by Steam introducing a way to filter reviews by maximum or minimum playtime.

#55

Start_Running 2018年2月22日 11時29分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：
Start_Running の投稿を引用：

As I pointed out. You're cherry picking and I do believe managing an od variation of the equivocacy fallacy at the same time.

Even by Oxford standards, user-reviews , qualify as reviews as they are indeed published crititique.

Of course a "review" can be legitimate on steam but you can not review a game in 10mins it would be a report or an opinion at best

All reviews on entertainment media are opinion. Or reports on opinion. And yes you can review a game after 10 mins. Saying it gets better is basically bollocks. That's like sayinga wisdom tooth extraction gets less un comfortable after the first 20 mins. It's well and good for people who are paid to, or who somehow profuit by such activities to say such but for people who are looking to unwind in what little free time they have,

Is reading 10 pages of a novel then writing about it a review of that novel?

Fiction publishers make such calls within the first 1-5 pages of a manuscript. If you haven't grabbed their attention within 1-5 pages you will if you're lucky, get your manuscript mailed back with a rejection letter, mostlikely your manuscript just goes in the bin.

Why because the person doing the reading has about 60 other manuscripts in the slush pile in front of them.

Is watching 10mins of a movie then writing about it a review?....No its not

Yes it is actually. technically a review about the first 10 minutes of the movie and the fact that the person could not be bothered to go beyond 10 mins emphasizes the critique.

But on steam it is a review not a opinion not a report not an observation but a review.

All reviews of entertainment products are opinion.

My OP is to point out games are "reviewed" on steam with tiny amounts of time on the game so therefore not reviews they are opinions from that person or at best a report on their findings.

It is their review of the game sweetie. A game they could only be bothered to play for 10 minutes. AGain , if the first 10 minutes of your game actively makes people want to not play your game to that extent. you dun fuxxed up.

And if cherry picking is how you class correct use of a word then why bother making a sensible sentence anymore lets take any word and use it in any context we feel we can justify.

Dude you were basically tunneling the interpretation of the sentence to what suited your narrative as opposed to considering the broader context of the sentence. You chose a specifica definition out of one of three dictionaries and even then you ignored the context of the word 'published' within it.

If there is a game that is only 10mins long then yes writing up on it would be a review but games are not 10min long but yet on the very first page you see on a game the review status is at the top of the page and reviews influence peoples opinions.

And that's good. Simply means that buyers will know the top rated relevant reviews are by people who couldn't sit through more than x mins of the game.

Not even mentioning that many games can be launched without using the steam client. The Doomsday mod for the classic doom games for example does not increment the counter. So I basically have 20 mins in doom, yet have played the game for ...well more time than I am confortable admitting.

OP. THe games are fine. But saying you want people to choose between a refund and leaving critique is the sort of move that shows you're only interested in hearing the stuff that affirms your opinions.

#56

ProF4HUntaa 2018年2月23日 2時02分

Start_Running の投稿を引用：
ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：

Of course a "review" can be legitimate on steam but you can not review a game in 10mins it would be a report or an opinion at best
All reviews on entertainment media are opinion. Or reports on opinion. And yes you can review a game after 10 mins. Saying it gets better is basically bollocks. That's like sayinga wisdom tooth extraction gets less un comfortable after the first 20 mins. It's well and good for people who are paid to, or who somehow profuit by such activities to say such but for people who are looking to unwind in what little free time they have,

Is reading 10 pages of a novel then writing about it a review of that novel?
Fiction publishers make such calls within the first 1-5 pages of a manuscript. If you haven't grabbed their attention within 1-5 pages you will if you're lucky, get your manuscript mailed back with a rejection letter, mostlikely your manuscript just goes in the bin.

Why because the person doing the reading has about 60 other manuscripts in the slush pile in front of them.

Is watching 10mins of a movie then writing about it a review?....No its not
Yes it is actually. technically a review about the first 10 minutes of the movie and the fact that the person could not be bothered to go beyond 10 mins emphasizes the critique.

But on steam it is a review not a opinion not a report not an observation but a review.
All reviews of entertainment products are opinion.

My OP is to point out games are "reviewed" on steam with tiny amounts of time on the game so therefore not reviews they are opinions from that person or at best a report on their findings.
It is their review of the game sweetie. A game they could only be bothered to play for 10 minutes. AGain , if the first 10 minutes of your game actively makes people want to not play your game to that extent. you dun fuxxed up.

And if cherry picking is how you class correct use of a word then why bother making a sensible sentence anymore lets take any word and use it in any context we feel we can justify.
Dude you were basically tunneling the interpretation of the sentence to what suited your narrative as opposed to considering the broader context of the sentence. You chose a specifica definition out of one of three dictionaries and even then you ignored the context of the word 'published' within it.

If there is a game that is only 10mins long then yes writing up on it would be a review but games are not 10min long but yet on the very first page you see on a game the review status is at the top of the page and reviews influence peoples opinions.
And that's good. Simply means that buyers will know the top rated relevant reviews are by people who couldn't sit through more than x mins of the game.

Not even mentioning that many games can be launched without using the steam client. The Doomsday mod for the classic doom games for example does not increment the counter. So I basically have 20 mins in doom, yet have played the game for ...well more time than I am confortable admitting.

OP. THe games are fine. But saying you want people to choose between a refund and leaving critique is the sort of move that shows you're only interested in hearing the stuff that affirms your opinions.

And their was me thinking you had a fairly decent education but in reallity you are a man who has too much time on his hands thinks his "Opinion" is gospel.

Go drop your opinion in where ever you feel just in doing so.

The reason you posted on this discussion is because you clearly play a game and after a minor amount of time you think you have the authority to write a negative "review" because your words carry so much weight and you have paid for it. When in reality you have played a game, you didnt like the game and instead of jumping into the forums of that game to post at your disgust of that game your authoritarian belief caused your to write a negative review in the hope that someone from the developers of that game or someone thinking of purchasing the game will take the time to listen to your ramblings.

Reading your last post i can only come to one conclusion....Your a mess, sort yourself out.

最近の変更はProF4HUntaaが行いました; 2018年2月23日 2時08分

#57

Start_Running 2018年2月23日 4時22分

ProF4HUntaa の投稿を引用：

And their was me thinking you had a fairly decent education but in reallity you are a man who has too much time on his hands thinks his "Opinion" is gospel.

So are you the pot, the kettle or the coal?

The reason you posted on this discussion is because you clearly play a game and after a minor amount of time you think you have the authority to write a negative "review" because your words carry so much weight and you have paid for it.

Notice you only focus on negative, People can do the same for positive reviews as well. I mean sure it takes *you* hours upon hours to tell if something is worth your limited free time and hard earned money.. not everyone is afflicted by that handicap.

When in reality you have played a game, you didnt like the game and instead of jumping into the forums of that game to post at your disgust of that game your authoritarian belief caused your to write a negative review in the hope that someone from the developers of that game or someone thinking of purchasing the game will take the time to listen to your ramblings.

And... yeah, that's how reviews work, professional or otherwise. You don't like a thing, you give it a negative review. You seem to think that reviews and reviewers have some obligation to meet whatever arbitary criteria the octopus in your head says they should.

It's all opinion. Many reviewers , even pro game reviewers don't play the entirely of a game.. They don't aime for a 100% completion, and remember they are paid to do so. If I was given the game for free and being paid for the time spent playing it, I too would give play games I do not enjoy longer than i'm inclined, but since I am not...I play as much of the game as I can stand before turning my time to a game I would actually enjoy.

Reading your last post i can only come to one conclusion....Your a mess, sort yourself out.

Says the guy who starts a post because other people have the audacity to give a game he likes a *gasp* negative review. You like the game, that's fine. I hear some people like country Western music and Budweiser beer too, Nothing wrong with that, just don't get it in your head that anyone else does.

Other people dislikeing something you love does not make you less of a person; your inability to understand that other people's subjective opinions equal to your own...that makes it hard for anyone to take you seriously as an adult.

#58