Is this considered cheating and is it bannable?

[Eldin]

My old mouse broke and I bought a new similar one.
It's a cheap 6€ gaming mouse, it's just Plug&Play, no customization software, macros or anything.
Previous mouse had double click button (I click once and PC register 2 clicks), but when I hold that button on this new mouse it spams 10+ clicks per second.

Basically it transforms any semi-automatic weapon into fully-automatic.
It makes some weapons really overpowered, like AR-15 in KF2, Dual pistols in L4D2 (or any game with dual pistols), some pistols in CSGO, in some games it can empty whole mag in less than 2 seconds.
In some games where you have to click fast to swing sword or quickly stab enemy, I can just hold that button and deal maximum possible amount of damage, etc.

I know that using scripts that do this can get you banned in some games, but on this mouse it's hardware button and no scripts are running.

So my questions are:
-Is this considered cheating? It obviously gives me a huge advantage in some games, but it's just a mouse feature that I didn't even know existed until I bought this mouse.
-Can I get banned in any game for this? There are no any scripts running on my PC, but can game's anti cheat mistakenly detect it as cheat and ban me? And even if in games like CSGO someone reports me for using scripts, can other people that are reviewing CSGO overwatch case think that I'm using scripts and report me for that?

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

For VAC, no.

Game bans, depends on the rules the game developer lays out. Some do and others don't.

[AmsterdamHeavy]

Hotsauce, as usual, has the answer.

This is in the same category as bunny hopping scripts. You wont get a VAC, but you very well could catch a game ban if reviewers dont like what they see.

[Eldin]

But i case I do get a game ban for this, what would be a best thing to say in my defense?
How would I prove to devs that I haven't used any cheats/scripts and convince them to unban me?

And how would I know is thins kind of stuff bannable in that game before I get banned?
I never used any kind of stuff that give me advantage over other players before because I'm afraid of getting banned. But this button is standing next to my finger and it's always enabled, and I kinda got used to it now, so I use it without thinking when needed.

And some devs bans for stupid stuff. Examle is, I got banned from KF2 reward server for using exploit that just gives me a lot of non-tradable/non-marketable cosmetic items that gives no gameplay advantage at all, and devs won't even consider unbanning me.
And in EULA the only thing that can even remotely relate to this is:
"Use, create or distribute cheats, hacks, mods, mutators, exploits or anything else not intended in the game that enable one player to gain an advantage over or otherwise exploit another player they are playing against."

If I got banned for thing that clearly doesn't give any kind of advantage over other players and it's not stated anywhere that this kind of thing is bannable, how can I be sure that using this button that actually gives some kind of advantage over other players won't get me banned?

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Ask in the forums for said game(s). For a game like PUBG, they have their own rules of conduct on their website.

[AmsterdamHeavy]

With all respect man, those are not the same situation. You posted your own answer:

"Use, create or distribute cheats, hacks, mods, mutators, exploits or anything else not intended in the game that enable one player to gain an advantage over or otherwise exploit another player they are playing against."

That would include the button on your mouse, by my reading anyway. I dont think there is an expectation that everyone be using "autoclickers" in order to maximize rate of fire. I know these were always frowned upon when I played DoD and people WOULD get banned, by server admins. I seem to remember it being used for unloading he auto-pistol that the german panzergrenadiers use.

As for the KF2; you were exploiting their reward mechanics. "In game advantage" does not apply because what you would be considered doing is exploiting the economy, since those keys/items/crates sell for real cash in the market.

[Eldin]

Originally posted by AmsterdamHeavy:

With all respect man, those are not the same situation. You posted your own answer:

"Use, create or distribute cheats, hacks, mods, mutators, exploits or anything else not intended in the game that enable one player to gain an advantage over or otherwise exploit another player they are playing against."

That would include the button on your mouse, by my reading anyway. I dont think there is an expectation that everyone be using "autoclickers" in order to maximize rate of fire. I know these were always frowned upon when I played DoD and people WOULD get banned, by server admins. I seem to remember it being used for unloading he auto-pistol that the german panzergrenadiers use.

As for the KF2; you were exploiting their reward mechanics. "In game advantage" does not apply because what you would be considered doing is exploiting the economy, since those keys/items/crates sell for real cash in the market.

I mentioned KF2 just to say that developers sometimes ban for stuff that they never said it's bannable.
In KF2 I exploited Vault crates that are not tradable or marketable, so they don't give any gameplay advantage over other players and they can't be bought/sold/traded (they are earned just by playing) so they have no impact on economy.

They haven't said anywhere that this is bannable, but they banned me from reward server because of it. (I can't receive/craft/salvage any items now. I even haven't received items I paid for with real money because of that)


About autoclick button, I haven't used it in multiplayer games yet.
For KF2 exactly, I think they're referring to software cheats because of "create or distribute cheats, hacks..."
And I don't think hardware button applies to "cheats, hacks, mods, mutators, exploits". Or does it?

How can I figure out from EULA is the hardware autoclick button bannable? And how can I be sure that one day I won't get banned because of it even if it's not stated that it's bannable in that game?
I mean in any game, not just KF2.

[B-o-B]

Dev's ain't stupid, but one also says "they wont lie it could change and you will be informed" they know about devices that use that kind of button.
What your experiencing is being able to shoot the weapon at full speed. You cant affect that.

If anything it is optimising the clicking your fingers cant do as quickly. It certainly ain't interfering with the Engine that's for sure. Show me it emptying an AWP(in 2 seconds(seems to be the theme)) clip in cs:go then ill believe it needs banned.

https://steamcommunity.com/app/730/discussions/0/617336568075052443/

https://www.reddit.com/r/PUBATTLEGROUNDS/comments/92x4c2/is_it_bannable_to_use_logitechrazer_mouse_rapid/


Edited to make first point more clear.

[Eldin]

Originally posted by b☣bz:

If anything it is optimising the clicking your fingers cant do as quickly. It certainly ain't interfering with the Engine that's for sure. Show me it emptying an AWP(in 2 seconds(seems to be the theme)) clip in cs:go then ill believe it needs banned.

It shoots about 2-3 times faster than when fast clicking with my finger.
And finger doesn't get tired because I'm just holding the button instead of spamming it.

It can't empty AWP in two seconds because of animation after each shot.
But semi-automatic weapons that can shot as fast as you can click, they can fire faster than some fully automatic weapons.

[B-o-B]

Ye i did miss on the auto part. Sorry.
Its un'natural to try and spam as you say. You loose stability with cursor if done wrong obviously.

If it's a game changer, that's the signal i look for.

[Eldin]

Originally posted by b☣bz:

Ye i did miss on the auto part. Sorry.
Its un'natural to try and spam as you say. You loose stability with cursor if done wrong obviously.

If it's a game changer, that's the signal i look for.

That too.
While spamming button accuracy is worse. But with autoclick button I can just hold it, keep mouse stable and concentrate more on managing in-game recoil.

[Brian9824]

Originally posted by Eldin:

But i case I do get a game ban for this, what would be a best thing to say in my defense?
How would I prove to devs that I haven't used any cheats/scripts and convince them to unban me?

You don't need to use cheats/scripts to get banned. The mouse has what is basically a built in script that causes it to autofire. Depending on rules of the game that is all it could take to ban you.

[↑↑↓↓←→←→BASelect]

Don't use that mouse to buy something you will end up with 30 of the same item all charged to your credit card.

[Satoru]

PUBG bans for macros and mouse macros. Your mouse 100% looks like a mouse macro and doesnt behave like any 'normal' mouse should.

[Eldin]

Originally posted by Satoru:

PUBG bans for macros and mouse macros. Your mouse 100% looks like a mouse macro and doesnt behave like any 'normal' mouse should.

Yep, but it's not like those mouses where you install mouse software and set up buttons and autoclick there.
Whatever this mouse is doing, it's doing it internally and then sends signal to PC like I'm actually clicking LMB.
It even works when I plug it in my phone.

If game or anticheat is looking for any script running on PC, it won't find anything.

They could only detect it if actual human is looking at me shooting, or if game detects that I'm shooting too fast.

[Satoru]

Originally posted by Eldin:

Originally posted by Satoru:

PUBG bans for macros and mouse macros. Your mouse 100% looks like a mouse macro and doesnt behave like any 'normal' mouse should.

Yep, but it's not like those mouses where you install mouse software and set up buttons and autoclick there.
Whatever this mouse is doing, it's doing it internally and then sends signal to PC like I'm actually clicking LMB.
It even works when I plug it in my phone.

If game or anticheat is looking for any script running on PC, it won't find anything.

They could only detect it if actual human is looking at me shooting, or if game detects that I'm shooting too fast.

Your mouse will send clicks at an abnormal rate which will trigger heuristics to show you’re using a macro