Sad state of affairs

[Zeke45]

I'm getting more and more disinterested in acquiring any new games -- not gonna pay AAA prices to find out 8 or 10 hours in that the game's got a woke agenda or some stupid "edgy" crapola shoved in as if the devs were angst-ridden suburban goth kids in the 90's; Steam's refund system is laughable and outdated -- there are some games that take more than two hours just to get past their third-party registration requirements, set up the keyboard keys, manage to nail a suitable and original online username that's not already taken (because you're basically shackled with it for life in many cases), and get past the tutorial; then there are all these "less is less" games and gimmicky trendy-as-hell 16-bit -looking games that are all into reverting to the 1980's (and getting inexplicable rave reviews).

Also, when's the last time Steam had an actual decent, valuable promo giveaway? Age of Wonders 3 or something? You get better giveaways from small-time resellers. (No need to mention the "dread" Unreal people over there.)

Lastly, maybe 20 percent of the time I browse this site, their servers are overloaded or something; videos won't play, or there's lag, even simple photos won't load unless you check back later.

If I'm aware enough and put-off enough about some of these things to take time to post a comment here, you know significant negative issues are starting to dawn on many others.

My whinge for the week.

[Radene]

引用自 RedLightning：

引用自 Arkham99：

The Refund Policy was a bad idea to begin with... people need to learn to make informed purchases and learn from their mistakes instead of whining about it... you pays yer money you take yer chances, no refunds if it was up to me... I do agree that gaming in general is a "Sad state of affairs" today, but vALVE is one of the few bright lights... the hype for 'Alyx' is unlike anything seen in recent memory and we're about to see the fruits to the many years of their devotion to advancements in hardware instead of shipping games... I'm not even all that keen on VR but find myself seriously considering buying one for this game...

too much focus is put on making games (and their trailers) look good instead of playing good... again vALVE's support for Indie Developers has made way for an alternative to the generic clones known as Triple AAAs... 'MASS Effect Andromeda' & 'No Man's Sky' are my most recent purchases (both bought at launch) and they're nearly a half decade old... I can say that I've gotten my $60 worth outta both titles and continue to play both... there's been literally NOTHING that I've been interested to buy since... the only one that I was interested in was 'In The Valley of The Gods' (another vALVE title) which has since been put on hold while the team helps out with 'Alyx'...

doesn't get any better than Steam for gaming nowadays... where you gonna go? XBOX? PS? Epic Games? good luck...:-) :arkham:

Big problem I have with the policy .. is .. like CITIES SKYLINES who 4+ years after I bought the game CHANGES to something that I will not agree to..

How can I make an informed consumer decision about a product when it changes thus.. and requires me to agree or go pound..

Wheres my refund then ?

Take it up with Paradox. They're the ones who changed the policy...

[RedLightning]

引用自 Radene：

引用自 RedLightning：

Big problem I have with the policy .. is .. like CITIES SKYLINES who 4+ years after I bought the game CHANGES to something that I will not agree to..

How can I make an informed consumer decision about a product when it changes thus.. and requires me to agree or go pound..

Wheres my refund then ?

Take it up with Paradox. They're the ones who changed the policy...

Yep and round and round we go, where we stop.. hahahha.

yea right..

Valve lets em do underhanded stuff.. and I'm supposed to take it up with the company that does not care.. or the company that forces whatever update that the dev pushes..

Merry go round time.. round and round..

Much like these forums.

[Radene]

引用自 RedLightning：

引用自 Radene：

Take it up with Paradox. They're the ones who changed the policy...

Yep and round and round we go, where we stop.. hahahha.

yea right..

Valve lets em do underhanded stuff.. and I'm supposed to take it up with the company that does not care.. or the company that forces whatever update that the dev pushes..

Merry go round time.. round and round..

Much like these forums.

Valve doesn't "let" them do anything, they don't need Valve's permission to change their own policies. Do you ask Valve if you're allowed to change your bank package?

[pasa]

Sensible people left impulse and 0-day buying in the past long time ago. And for every game you can find a sea of reviews, discussion, videos, live stream and everything. There is very little excuse to buy without research. And if you're not sure, it's not hard to use the 2h period in an aimed way, expecting the refund.

Also with the amount of games created no problem to just buy the "new" ones after they are 1-2 years old, come with -66 or -75% deal, and already picked up the patches and improvements to get out of the phase we used to call beta.

[ReBoot]

引用自 pasa：

Sensible people left impulse and 0-day buying in the past long time ago. And for every game you can find a sea of reviews, discussion, videos, live stream and everything. There is very little excuse to buy without research. And if you're not sure, it's not hard to use the 2h period in an aimed way, expecting the refund.

Also with the amount of games created no problem to just buy the "new" ones after they are 1-2 years old, come with -66 or -75% deal, and already picked up the patches and improvements to get out of the phase we used to call beta.

Pretty much this. While I'd agree that the volume of trash (including scummy A releases) grew over the years, there's no shortage of awesome games and with the sensible purchasing strategy outlined in that quote, grabbing more games than one got time for cheap is totally doable.

[RedLightning]

引用自 Radene：

引用自 RedLightning：

Yep and round and round we go, where we stop.. hahahha.

yea right..

Valve lets em do underhanded stuff.. and I'm supposed to take it up with the company that does not care.. or the company that forces whatever update that the dev pushes..

Merry go round time.. round and round..

Much like these forums.

Valve doesn't "let" them do anything, they don't need Valve's permission to change their own policies. Do you ask Valve if you're allowed to change your bank package?

okay then .. so round and round.

Now the question stands.. how am I supposed to make an 'educated' decision about ANY game on this platform when ANY unscrupulous developer can use Valves forced updates to foister a new EULA on people .. and get away with it.

Yea.. 4 years later or so.. oh yea.. sweet deal there.

And that is added to an increasing number of developers on this platform doing just that..

Gaming has become something else entirely.. becoming less fun .. more frustrating.. and annoying .. with what developers get away with as of late much less Valve.

Gotta love this wonderful world of DRM .. woohoo.

No matter what .. people in this forum just chase their tails and point fingers.. while this service does less and less for the customer and more for the developers.. much much much more. While the entire time.. Valve.. the private company in control of most of the PC gaming scene remains quiet behind the curtain.

As far as taking it to Paradox .. nah.. they are steadfast in their decision.. and knowing Valve and their new UI.. so are they.. not that I want to test it by waiting up to six months for a reply from Valves so called support system.

Thats allright.. I'll just raise my middle finger to both.. There is quite a few developers on the scratchpad already that I do not bother with..

Soon I might just have to find another hobby entirely. This one is getting maddening.

Refunds should be extended in the event that a customer 4 years later is entertained with a NEW EULA that they do not agree with.. just like you have to agree to a new purchase EULA before you can play .. or you get your money back.

[Zekiran]

There's this thing.



It's called GOOGLE.


Maybe you've heard of it?

Also they have a thing that's known as 'Youtube'. You may have heard of it too.

And also again: all your complaints need to be levied at the publisher of the game you so royally think must conform to YOUR standard of EULA.

Valve has *absolutely nothing* to do with it.

Nothing at all.

They are a store.

They are not in any way responsible for you not learning what's up with games you may want, or keeping up with the publishers decisions of the games you play. That is 100% entirely on YOU.

Get over yourself.

[isomorphic_projection]

引用自 Zeke45：

引用自 cSg|mc-Hotsauce：

1. The 2 hour/weeks are to see if it runs well.

I don't care what the excuse or explanation of their "official policy" is -- the policy is outdated, off-putting, and consumer unfriendly. Say what you will about EA but Origin gives you 24 freaking hours from the time you first launch the game. That's more than reasonable. I don't do business there (yet) but I'm finding fewer reasons not to expand my business onto other platforms.

I once sent a request for a refund to Humble Bundle after 6 hours of play and they came through with a refund within maybe half an hour. THAT is customer service.

Two hours is a backhanded insult to the customer. I'll tell you this much -- since they refused my refund on Elite:Dangerous after about four hours (I sent several requests for reconsideration with carefully worded explanations, only to be robo-refused each time), I have been EXTREMELY reluctant and hyper-cautious about purchasing here. In fact I have bought all of one game that was a buck and change during the past six weeks.


Not really here to argue. Some people are going to dogmatically defend Steam as a matter of habit. Go to town.

3th party's and their own launchers, nough said. 2 hours not enough. Downloading the rest from them, setup the controls, fixing conflicts caused by conflicting drivers which got worse after the new ui which uses a driver that conflicts with my gpu, getting an intro, tutorial. 3 worthless unplayable games in my list and you can forget a refund. Cause the 2 hours are over. They only use the EU law when it suits them. Privacy laws, a forced rollback if it does not work within 72 hours by EU laws forget about it.

[Niele]

引用自 RedLightning：

Big problem I have with the policy .. is .. like CITIES SKYLINES who 4+ years after I bought the game CHANGES to something that I will not agree to..

How can I make an informed consumer decision about a product when it changes thus.. and requires me to agree or go pound..

Wheres my refund then ?

problem is you don't own a game, you have a license to play it.
probably after 4 years that game has given you more in return than what you paid, a refund after 4 years is senseless
you have to take it on Paradox.

[isomorphic_projection]

引用自 Niele：

引用自 RedLightning：

Big problem I have with the policy .. is .. like CITIES SKYLINES who 4+ years after I bought the game CHANGES to something that I will not agree to..

How can I make an informed consumer decision about a product when it changes thus.. and requires me to agree or go pound..

Wheres my refund then ?

problem is you don't own a game, you have a license to play it.
probably after 4 years that game has given you more in return than what you paid, a refund after 4 years is senseless
you have to take it on Paradox.

Well news flash i own every game bought since October 2019. According to EU laws, even have the right to a hard copy. And a rollback if it still does not work within 72 hours.

[PXL]

引用自 Zeke45：

I'm getting more and more disinterested

CYALATERTHEN!

/waves

[Niele]

引用自 isomorphic_projection：

Well news flash i own every game bought since October 2019. According to EU laws, even have the right to a hard copy. And a rollback if it still does not work within 72 hours.

own what? the game or the license?

[Start_Running]

引用自 Zeke45：

I'm getting more and more disinterested in acquiring any new games -- not gonna pay AAA prices to find out 8 or 10 hours in that the game's got a woke agenda or some stupid "edgy" crapola shoved in as if the devs were angst-ridden suburban goth kids in the 90's;

You're bnot saying as much as you think you are. You're losing interest in games... That happens. Usually a sign you either need to widen your field of interest, or pick a new hobby for a while.

Steam's refund system is laughable and outdated --

Would you prefer Blizzard's refund policy?

there are some games that take more than two hours just to get past their third-party registration requirements, set up the keyboard keys, manage to nail a suitable and original online username that's not already taken (because you're basically shackled with it for life in many cases), and get past the tutorial;

The tutorial is part of the game m8. Might surprise you to know that for most games out there. 80% of their content is tutorial. And as for the rest of that. Yeah, hypervbople does not make your argument stronger. it just makes it weaker. If these things take that much time (barring third party launcher downloads, for which rexceptions are made), then thats a 'YOUR problem not a game problem.

then there are all these "less is less" games and gimmicky trendy-as-hell 16-bit -looking gamesthat are all into reverting to the 1980's (and getting inexplicable rave reviews).

Good pixel are acrtually does fairly well and takes quite a vbit of effort. THe reward is of course is that it ages a lot better than 3d art. But this is of course just your preferences and well kinda shows your problem. AAt least part of it. Its your taste in games.

Also, when's the last time Steam had an actual decent, valuable promo giveaway? Age of Wonders 3 or something? You get better giveaways from small-time resellers. (No need to mention the "dread" Unreal people over there.)

Steam has never done promo give aways me thinks. Except for their own games and those are rare. Publishers and developers do their own give aways and the last one I recall was sniper elite 3 . Small time retailers have to use give aways *(which they eat the cost on) just to ghet people into their stores, and its debateable as to how effective this reallty is froma business perspective.

Lastly, maybe 20 percent of the time I browse this site, their servers are overloaded or something; videos won't play, or there's lag, even simple photos won't load unless you check back later.

That's your ISP. THey may be throttling traffic.

If I'm aware enough and put-off enough about some of these things to take time to post a comment here, you know significant negative issues are starting to dawn on many others.

My whinge for the week.

Take up another hobby. YOu're clerly burned out on gaming. Very easy to do when you have such a narrow interest set and wide range of prejudices. Might I suggest anime.

[AirborneMuffins]

引用自 Zeke45：

gimmicky trendy-as-hell 16-bit -looking games that are all into reverting to the 1980's (and getting inexplicable rave reviews)

Care to give some examples? Because some of the very best games to come out in the last few years have been pixel-art based in their design and I'm curious which ones you're referring to.

[Crazy Tiger]

引用自 Niele：

引用自 isomorphic_projection：

Well news flash i own every game bought since October 2019. According to EU laws, even have the right to a hard copy. And a rollback if it still does not work within 72 hours.

own what? the game or the license?

Merely the license. He's confusing things, both the EU directives and our country laws still are the very same on that subject as they have been the past years