IDLE, CLICKER & INCREMENTAL games. Devs need to clarify

[Ra7en]

When you play as many games as I have, and even as long, you start trying to figure out genres of the different games. Even the term "ROGUE-LIKE" has lost it's meaning. Simply put, these days it just means randomly generated. While that is only ONE facet of a "rogue" game (and I am referring back to the 70's and 80's when they were popular), it is not the defining definition. And just as bad, RPG has lost its meaning as well. However, I do digress :-)

One thing I have noticed, that if you do a search of "idle" games on steam, it pukes up clicker games. Some might say "... so, and?..", All three of these genres are completely different and have different mechanics. Sadly, even game devs these days cannot figure out what to call their game, so they throw it in the "clicker" bucket. Let me clarify.

the CLICKER, INCREMENTAL & IDLE GAME CONUNDRUM

IDLE GAMES
Steam has no idle games[1]. For the purest form of an IDLE game, go to the playstore (android) and download EZPZ RPG. THAT game is the purest form of an IDLE game. The game plays itself, no screen breaking clicking needed. Once the game starts, it is playing and doing all the grinding. Even loots. All the player does is upgrade the armor, check evens, and a few other things (the game is very strategic during middle game). but there is ZERO, NONE, NO CLICKING involved to progress this game. It idles fine on it's own.

CLICKER GAMES
Tiny selection of clicker games on steam. the moble stores are flooded of them. Some of the better clickers are like TAP TITANS(mobile) CLICKER HEROES 1 & 2 (mobile/steam/many others) to name a couple. These games CANNOT progress - when starting - without burning through our mouse button, or finger busting tapping on your mobile device. your CLICKING. Agreed that after awhile, the game goes idle, but not before some heavy duty grinding.

INCREMENTAL GAMES
Now this is an odd genre that popped up a few years ago. It would seem the gaming community actually confused this genre with a CLICKER genre. And the two kinda mushed together. The only game I have ever come across - MASSIVE time sink as well and very addicting - that fits the term INCREMENTAL is TRIMPS[2]. INCREMENTALS are a little tricky, they need to click as item in the game to progress before it opens up something else. You are not really, CLICKING so to speak, but instead trying to get enough of one object to start another, while attempting to get it into auto mode (or idle). But it is not a true clicker.


With all this said, I think there should be a standard of definitions regarding these three, so when someone does a search of IDLE games (because, like me, they are TOTALLY burned out on clicker games), we don't want to see our search results filled with .... clickers! Game devs too, should get together as well so they too can classify their games correctly.

what do you guys think - Make sense?

Thanks.

ps
If there are idle games on steam, post here, I am at 25k games viewed, and have not seen any, same goes for INCREMENTALS here on steam, would love to take a look at these as well.


[1] At the time of this writing
[2] Trimps FREE[trimps.github.io], Not sure how long this guy has been playing, but he is VERY far along in the game. Notice there is no clicking. Trimp Game Play

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Tags are user generated.

There will never be a consortium of game devs that will agree on 1 term for any genre/tag. Why not? Look at other tags and see how they match up with what YOU want them to be.

25K titles? You have about 6K more to go.

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Tags are user generated.

There will never be a consortium of game devs that will agree on 1 term for any genre/tag.

:qr:

sadly true, I am surprised warcraft doesn't come up under pokemon - right? :-)

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

Originalmente postado por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Tags are user generated.

There will never be a consortium of game devs that will agree on 1 term for any genre/tag.

sadly true, I am surprised warcraft doesn't come up under pokemon - right? :-)

Tag abuse can be reported.

[Cathulhu]

Considering both aren't sold on Steam, not really surprising.

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por Cathulhu:

Considering both aren't sold on Steam, not really surprising.

figurative speaking. ofc

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por cSg|mc-Hotsauce:

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

sadly true, I am surprised warcraft doesn't come up under pokemon - right? :-)

Tag abuse can be reported.

:qr:

strong word "abuse"

there is a difference between "abuse" and lack of knowledge in naming. If the tagger cannot tell the difference between a clicker and a idle game(where you never click), it is not abuse, just uninformed.

[BossGalaga]

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

Steam has no idle games

Welp, I never thought I'd see an idle games elitist but there it is. Just because you have to start a game and it includes some minimal interaction, doesn't mean that it's not an idle game. In fact, you yourself used EZPZ RPG as an example of an idle game in its "purest form", your words, which indicates that there are less pure idle games that are still idle games.

If you have a dispute with what people classify as an idle game, you can take it up with the individual developers and you can also edit the wikipedia entry to your personal liking.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incremental_game

Perhaps, you could write some articles for GameSkinny or pitch this to other gaming publications and start a revolution in defining game genres.

[Walach]

I would start with a standard for things like:
Action. RPG. Strategy. All of those are used so wildly that they don't have a meaning anymore in my eyes.

What I'm trying to say is that I don't really see the tags as something that has a meaning over "they say this is a strategy game then I believe it's going to have some sort of resource or building mechanic and maybe other similar mechanics".

And if it doesn't, then I would probably see that on the screenshots. I don't believe we can define something as absolute over years of change within the industry. In my eyes some GAMES aren't even GAMES in my eyes. :P

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por Walach:

I would start with a standard for things like:
Action. RPG. Strategy. All of those are used so wildly that they don't have a meaning anymore in my eyes.

What I'm trying to say is that I don't really see the tags as something that has a meaning over "they say this is a strategy game then I believe it's going to have some sort of resource or building mechanic and maybe other similar mechanics".

And if it doesn't, then I would probably see that on the screenshots. I don't believe we can define something as absolute over years of change within the industry. In my eyes some GAMES aren't even GAMES in my eyes. :P

You my friend are exactly correct (tags loosing meanings). However, my OP is not about tags, I was just making a suggestion about those three labels that are getting blurred. Since they are so wildly popular(its been about 5-6yrs now when they finally took off like wildfire, and there seems to be no end insite - they are just getting more elaborate), they should have it defined a little more. Example: I like idle games, but don't really care for clicker games. And the only real addicting incremental I found (so far) in TRIMPS.

Hope that makes a little sense.

thanks for your input

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por BossGalaga:

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

Steam has no idle games

Welp, I never thought I'd see an idle games elitist but there it is. Just because you have to start a game and it includes some minimal interaction, doesn't mean that it's not an idle game. In fact, you yourself used EZPZ RPG as an example of an idle game in its "purest form", your words, which indicates that there are less pure idle games that are still idle games.

If you have a dispute with what people classify as an idle game, you can take it up with the individual developers and you can also edit the wikipedia entry to your personal liking.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incremental_game

Perhaps, you could write some articles for GameSkinny or pitch this to other gaming publications and start a revolution in defining game genres.

You seem to be a casual gamer, this thread is probably not a good fit for you. I am a serious gamer - or at least love gaming as a hobby. From heavy modding, wow(15yrs), to all kinds of console games, cute games, top ended RPG'S. When I search for a game type, I do not want to trudge through the mislabled games - google is now infected with that. Hell, even google has the MMORPG - confused with hero collector games. yes they are MMO, but one is about collecting heros (or monsters) the other one is you ROLE PLAYING) Its a mess when searching for your favorite game.

[BossGalaga]

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

Originalmente postado por BossGalaga:

Welp, I never thought I'd see an idle games elitist but there it is. Just because you have to start a game and it includes some minimal interaction, doesn't mean that it's not an idle game. In fact, you yourself used EZPZ RPG as an example of an idle game in its "purest form", your words, which indicates that there are less pure idle games that are still idle games.

If you have a dispute with what people classify as an idle game, you can take it up with the individual developers and you can also edit the wikipedia entry to your personal liking.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incremental_game

Perhaps, you could write some articles for GameSkinny or pitch this to other gaming publications and start a revolution in defining game genres.

You seem to be a casual gamer, this thread is probably not a good fit for you. I am a serious gamer - or at least love gaming as a hobby. From heavy modding, wow(15yrs), to all kinds of console games, cute games, top ended RPG'S. When I search for a game type, I do not want to trudge through the mislabled games - google is now infected with that. Hell, even google has the MMORPG - confused with hero collector games. yes they are MMO, but one is about collecting heros (or monsters) the other one is you ROLE PLAYING) Its a mess when searching for your favorite game.

OP: *complains about idle/clicker games not being idle enough.
Also OP: Ur a casual gamer

Thanks for the chuckle man. ;)

[Ra7en]

Originalmente postado por BossGalaga:

OP: *complains about idle/clicker games not being idle enough.
Also OP: Ur a casual gamer

Thanks for the chuckle man. ;)

Incorrect.
I'll help:

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

I think there should be a standard of definitions regarding these three,

Please re-read. THEN post.

[Ra7en]

@BossGalaga
BTW nice game count, 'cept its private.
I actually respect your comments :-), at least you are a gamer - some people comment and have like 3 or 4 games LOL!!

[BossGalaga]

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

Originalmente postado por BossGalaga:

OP: *complains about idle/clicker games not being idle enough.
Also OP: Ur a casual gamer

Thanks for the chuckle man. ;)

Incorrect.
I'll help:

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

I think there should be a standard of definitions regarding these three,

Please re-read. THEN post.

Feel free to re-read my post at any time sport.

If you're going to try to insult people by calling them casuals then don't also complain about idle games requiring too much effort. Just because an idle game requires a minimum of effort doesn't mean it's not an idle game. Also, If you're going to try and flex by talking about how long you've been a gamer, that's not going to be very effective when my Steam account is nearly a decade older than yours.

[BossGalaga]

Originalmente postado por Ra7en:

@BossGalaga
BTW nice game count, 'cept its private.
I actually respect your comments :-), at least you are a gamer - some people comment and have like 3 or 4 games LOL!!

Check again, my game details are public and have been since the privacy update. If you have one game and you play it then you are a gamer.

IMO, unless you're getting paid a living wage to play or make video games then it's a hobby. Nothing wrong with that.

I understand that some developers/publishers overuse gaming buzzwords but you yourself referred to the "purest form of an IDLE game" which still means that even if an idler isn't the "purest form" it can still be classified as an idler.

I'm a big roguelike fan myself. Does the term get abused? Of course but as long as it contains some fundamental elements, it can still be classified as a roguelike or roguelite. I've enjoyed watching the roguelike/lite genre evolve over the years.

Games change. Some of them may suck but change is still a good thing, otherwise we'd still be playing Pong and Guess the Number.

Gamers do love to argue about stuff, not gonna lie, I've done some arguing too, but I don't see a reason to claim that such and such isn't a real idle game and divide the gaming community as long as it contains the basic elements of an idle game. Personally, I'm not a huge fan of the genre although ProgressQuest is good for a laugh every now and then.