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Quadsword 2019 年 7 月 5 日 下午 7:47
Epic is starting to worry me
Despite massive backlash from their practices, Epic hasn’t let up even slightly. They have financial backing from Disney and Tencent, two of the largest corporations in the world, and a massive cash flow from Fortnite and unreal engine, the former being the most popular game in the world and the latter being the most popular commercial game engine in the world.

I feel like no amount of consumer backlash will stop them getting the monopoly they obviously want. They can just keep throwing money around until they control the entire games industry. I miss the days before mega corporations entered this industry.
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Dr.Shadowds 🐉 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 1:58 
引用自 Erebus
Why do they need to? They can't actually stop Epic from poaching and moneyhatting. Any measures taken to block it would be illegal.

Likewise commenting on it would give the appearance that Epic's model is <working>. Valve is doing the smart thing here, and they aren't hurting at all (biggest titles and 99% of indies still coming to steam).

If you want to reward Epic's ♥♥♥♥♥♥ business model though... idk what to say to you other than patience isn't a bad trait to learn... Everything notable is a timed exclusive at worst if you "have to have it".


What they need to do is actually be competitive. For a long time Valve has suffered from a lack of competition, and along it comes and what do they do? Nothing.

Patience is all very well but games die. What's the point in buying a game when it's already dead?

I give Valve a chance here because I really don't like Epic but if Valve aren't going to do anything then I see no reason why I shouldn't support Epic.

I mean right now I have no new games to play yet there are half a dozen or more Epic exclusives I would like to get.

Valve's silence is just an outdated way of working. Unless they reassure their base then they are going to lose it.

My initial loyalty to Steam is starting to disappear simply because Valve aren't responding to Epic. They need to at least tell us what wonderful things they have planned.

If they do nothing then I will be getting an Epic account shortly. Sorry an all, but I am not going to be patient forever and I am not going to suffer a six month delay on games forever.
Most the games are single player games, and don't need others to play the game, in fact few of them it's best to have friends, which wouldn;t be an issue, as it be smarter to get the game at a lower price when they got on sale, and friends will pick it up as well. Borderlands is a good example as it's not worth buying any of them day one, it's better waiting until most of the DLC's are out for it to get all the gameplay out of it, instead of reaching end game, only to be lacking content, plus you be paying an ever higher amount compare to others that simply waitied that basically drop to low as 50% or more with the DLC's.

I don't think Valve will do anything agasint Epic, and I believe they see no reason to go agasint them either, as they were basically the ones that want the PC gaming market to grow, so it would be weird to be fighting agasint other store platforms, when you think about it.

Now Steam did have other platforms compete agasint them, you may not even knew this, back in 2004 there was a store called direct2drive that was a mulit game store, which Steam became one in 2005. Funny how direct2drive crash and burn only to turn into a key reseller site these days. Later came GoG, then came bunch of others after 2008, Twitch store own by Amazon came out in 2010 I believe, but that end up closing due to lack of sales, or that Amazon see no point to it needing to be around anymore, Itch existed, Discord, lists goes on, and in 2019 we're above 50+ platforms to choose from, sound great right? But only one platform so far is throwing money like crazy is Epic ATM, which not working out it might seems well in their PR light anyways, as it only shows how quick some Devs, and Publishers are willing to throw a whole community under the bus for easy cash in their pockets, and don't have to care about sales number anymore since Epic is gonna pay them.

Now saying you have no games, are you extremely picky about which games you want to play? Or does the games must be 2019, or something? Because I could recommend a bunch of games, base on what you might be looking for, and they can be from GoG, Steam, and etc. and Epic would be the least option due to the fact they lack the most compare to everyone else for games by sheer volumes to Steam, GoG, and etc...

You're free to get an Epic account, most people that I know on my friends list got one, but they only did it for the free games, i know only 2 people out of 400 friends I have that bought anything from Epic, for the past 8 months now, and that's a lot saying how lack of interest my friends have in Epic due to lack of games they wanted, that's only on GoG, Steam, and etc...
引用自 gatto_nero
Another few free games on Epic - this is Epic
I'm happy you enjoy getting games for free. Very cool contribution to this thread.

引用自 tipsy
More than Steam in years. Yeah it is.
Games like Limbo? The game given away so many times for dirt cheap and for free on Steam and other launchers... woohoo.

引用自 gatto_nero
Wait - Steam purchased this games for players or developers gave them to players?
Epic is paying for those "free games" those developers - claiming them they earn money...

Which games Steam actually purchased for players?
Please don't tell me you actually believe the developers are giving away free copies of their games on Steam, without Steam compensating them? Surely you're not that silly?

引用自 TheRandomGuy
So Epic watches the Steam top 50 wishlisted games, lets Steam do the advertising for it, comes in to bribe the dev or publisher once hype is there, and steals it away.

So basically they rely on Steam doinv thd hard work and steal it away once said work is done.

If its true, Steam should make wishlist information private and only visible to developers on Steam. Third parties should not be allowed to view it because of what Epic is doing.
That's why I'm upset Steam's not booting these devs/pubs to be honest. They get free advertising on Steam, and Epic swoops in looking like the hero because Steam is not signing deals left and right to prevent other stores from having the game.

But if Steam made any move to punish these players... you can bet the media would turn it into a crusade against Steam, and more "proof" that Steam's this big evil monopoly.

引用自 kamk /idle
... for now, and that might be a huge problem in the future.

Imagine a new generation of kids growing up with Fortnite, starting their friendlist on the Epic Trash Store, they will be way less likely to try other stores in the future.
Fortnite is already dying despite the numbers Tim Sweeney puts out. Apex Legends is seen as the objectively better game, gamers are quiting Fortnite because of the whole brute mech situation... and the class action lawsuit as well as laws targeting lootboxes are going to make a sizeable dent in the game's future.

引用自 Deadsea_1993
We should boycott certain companies !
Already voting with my wallet. Any company that sides with Epic and puts games there when Epic’s Launcher and security is a joke gets boycotted by me.

These companies want to put people at risk of hacking problems and forcing Steam users to wait while the game is available everywhere else is a scumbag company.

Why wait months or a year for a game on Steam ? If enough people vote with their wallet, these dumb companies will think twice about Epic.
Weren't you the user defending EGS and saying things like it'll "be the start of a beautiful friendship" not too long ago? What changed man?

You even said you put out videos debunking a lot of our claims.
Count_Dandyman 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 2:39 
引用自 -3xA'Lu©κy

引用自 Deadsea_1993
We should boycott certain companies !
Already voting with my wallet. Any company that sides with Epic and puts games there when Epic’s Launcher and security is a joke gets boycotted by me.

These companies want to put people at risk of hacking problems and forcing Steam users to wait while the game is available everywhere else is a scumbag company.

Why wait months or a year for a game on Steam ? If enough people vote with their wallet, these dumb companies will think twice about Epic.
Weren't you the user defending EGS and saying things like it'll "be the start of a beautiful friendship" not too long ago? What changed man?

You even said you put out videos debunking a lot of our claims.
He experienced first hand Epic blocking him from purchasing the game he wanted from them and could no longer deny the reality of it happening and once one card was removed the entire house came tumbling down for him.
最后由 Count_Dandyman 编辑于; 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 2:39
引用自 Count_Dandyman
引用自 -3xA'Lu©κy


Weren't you the user defending EGS and saying things like it'll "be the start of a beautiful friendship" not too long ago? What changed man?

You even said you put out videos debunking a lot of our claims.
He experienced first hand Epic blocking him from purchasing the game he wanted from them and could no longer deny the reality of it happening and once one card was removed the entire house came tumbling down for him.

Lol. That's all it took to shatter his stance?

I could've told him that would inevitably happen.
最后由 -3xA'Lu©κy the disappearing act 编辑于; 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 2:48
Niko-Ni 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 3:02 
Boy or girl, you’re absolutely right, but what I’ll say personally about this is sad, but it makes our favorite steam move forward and be a competitive platform.
Trundle 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 3:29 
引用自 nalieteew
Boy or girl, you’re absolutely right, but what I’ll say personally about this is sad, but it makes our favorite steam move forward and be a competitive platform.
Move forward and be a competitive platform? Nah steam be like.
https://youtu.be/9yhyX9APrUM
Count_Dandyman 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 3:31 
引用自 nalieteew
Boy or girl, you’re absolutely right, but what I’ll say personally about this is sad, but it makes our favorite steam move forward and be a competitive platform.
Move forward and be a competitive platform? Nah steam be like.
https://youtu.be/9yhyX9APrUM
its almost like Steam is already competitive and lets its actions speak for themselves instead of having to try and buy out any competition while making grand statements that are contradicted by the reality of what they are doing.
TheRandomGuy 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 3:36 
引用自 Erebus
Why do they need to? They can't actually stop Epic from poaching and moneyhatting. Any measures taken to block it would be illegal.

Likewise commenting on it would give the appearance that Epic's model is <working>. Valve is doing the smart thing here, and they aren't hurting at all (biggest titles and 99% of indies still coming to steam).

If you want to reward Epic's ♥♥♥♥♥♥ business model though... idk what to say to you other than patience isn't a bad trait to learn... Everything notable is a timed exclusive at worst if you "have to have it".


What they need to do is actually be competitive. For a long time Valve has suffered from a lack of competition, and along it comes and what do they do? Nothing.

Patience is all very well but games die. What's the point in buying a game when it's already dead?

I give Valve a chance here because I really don't like Epic but if Valve aren't going to do anything then I see no reason why I shouldn't support Epic.

I mean right now I have no new games to play yet there are half a dozen or more Epic exclusives I would like to get.

Valve's silence is just an outdated way of working. Unless they reassure their base then they are going to lose it.

My initial loyalty to Steam is starting to disappear simply because Valve aren't responding to Epic. They need to at least tell us what wonderful things they have planned.

If they do nothing then I will be getting an Epic account shortly. Sorry an all, but I am not going to be patient forever and I am not going to suffer a six month delay on games forever.

Valve offers a better user experience than Epic for one. Epic relies on exclusivity, which will end after a year, letting Steam get the long term sales.

Steam is basically competing by offering a better service. If Valve tried to buy exclusivity, you can bet both the Media, Epic, and gamers would rip into them for it. Besides, Epic has continuously tripped up with their store features and their PR, they may be the only place to get certain games for right now, but that doesn't make them a good storefront by any means.

The only games that die are multiplayer games by the way, and Epicbonly has one major multiplayer game, Borderlands 3, which has had enough controversy to the point I'd not be surprised if the multiplayer is already dead after the games first month on PC, no crossplay, no preload, denuvo, and Epic Exclusivity all add up to reduce overall player numbers.

At least singleplayer games never really die.
Xaelath 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 6:04 
You know at some point i was actually kinda worried how Steam actually going for years ahead.

But on the same time i am glad that Steam offered this much features following the "Community" itself than Epic relying on 3rd party website or application.

You know these days, almost every single community either use Discord or Reddits, technically speaking Forums is useless for pretty much most of active or competitive multiplayer games in steam considering these community are much more active other place to gather much bigger players.

Well i said useless but it doesnt really apply to most of the games, singleplayer games benefit the most from this, some niche games obviously wont have any community for these hence you probably need to create a post and ask for help or invite people to play.
Bug fixing, quick guides do wonders in steam community and sometimes it cant be found somewhere else including in Gamefaqs.

Some of these games force you to mail to developer directly, speak to them in twitter, join their discord or reddits because they obviously wont reply on Forum.



That said talk about EGS Shenanigans , Its obvious that Tim did not care if an Indie game coming to their store if its not Exclusive or use their engine or isnt popular enough for them,
To be bold "They did not care about the game unless it's an AAA or Popular" tittle, like the top 50 wishlisted games on steam thing, because i am not even sure how did he got himself this information by trying to make exclusivity deal in the first.
HiraBeing🩰🦢 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 6:24 
引用自 Quadsword
Despite massive backlash from their practices, Epic hasn’t let up even slightly. They have financial backing from Disney and Tencent, two of the largest corporations in the world, and a massive cash flow from Fortnite and unreal engine, the former being the most popular game in the world and the latter being the most popular commercial game engine in the world.

I feel like no amount of consumer backlash will stop them getting the monopoly they obviously want. They can just keep throwing money around until they control the entire games industry. I miss the days before mega corporations entered this industry.
don't worry they gonna die after fortnite & u will see

It's just like Microsoft with Maincraft
They're just a bubble that's stretching out until it explodes
Erebus 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 6:58 
What they need to do is actually be competitive. For a long time Valve has suffered from a lack of competition, and along it comes and what do they do? Nothing.
Valve's model actually allows for competition though. Why do you think we have a booming 3rd party seller market these days? We sure didn't have that back before Steam's rise to power. Epic is literally paying money so they don't have to compete with far better services and stores. Which is also why they aren't improving anything notably either they have no reason to. Epic's business model is "take it or leave it, you can't get this elsewhere".

Idk what to tell you if you think that is meaningful competition.

Patience is all very well but games die. What's the point in buying a game when it's already dead?
If a game dies completely in 6months to a year it probably wasn't worth getting day 1 <anyway>.

I give Valve a chance here because I really don't like Epic but if Valve aren't going to do anything then I see no reason why I shouldn't support Epic.
Soooo you hate this problem caused by Epic's anti-consumer business model... but hold Valve responsible for solving something they have no power to "solve".

It's in the consumers hands whether they reward Epic for creating this problem or tell them to take a hike. There are no legal actions Valve could take to prevent someone from buying exclusives. And say Valve starts fighting fire with fire moneyhatting... then GOG and all kinds of third party stores get screwed in the process and Valve opens themselves up to anti-competitive lawsuits and pushes their business partners even further away.

People are looking for excuses to take Steam down a peg. Valve going iron-fist would just play into that.

Or do you just want Valve to cough up meaningless platitudes about something they can't legally stop? It's in the consumers hands whether this model is a success and persists or not.

I mean right now I have no new games to play yet there are half a dozen or more Epic exclusives I would like to get.

Valve's silence is just an outdated way of working. Unless they reassure their base then they are going to lose it.
Again though... reassure of what? They can't stop Epic from being anti-consumer. Only the consumers or a gov't body can put a stop to Epic's crap. Anything they could tell you would be an empty platitude. They're still working on tools for customers and developers constantly. What more can they actually do? I honestly want your answer on this because I see people stamping their feet all the time "VALVE NEEDS TO DO SOMETHING" but they often never even have an idea of what Valve could do or worse have ideas that aren't even feasible or legal.

My initial loyalty to Steam is starting to disappear simply because Valve aren't responding to Epic. They need to at least tell us what wonderful things they have planned.
It's not smart business to tell everyone all the things you are working on constantly. People get pissed when stuff is delayed or cancelled or when you miss a roadmap 8 months in a row. People also get impatient when they know things are in the works "OMG ITS BEEN <X> MONTHS/YEARS". Communication is a double-edged sword and will be used against you if everything doesn't go exactly how the end-users (who don't know much) expect.

If they do nothing then I will be getting an Epic account shortly. Sorry an all, but I am not going to be patient forever and I am not going to suffer a six month delay on games forever.
The irony being you'd be yet another person showing that this business model works, ensuring more people try it in the future.

Are you truly so addicted to games you can't see the forest for the trees? If this venture is a success do you think others won't follow suit? Do you think Epic won't continue? Do you really want gaming to turn into a more expensive version of the problems that currently exist with streaming services?
Amne 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 7:24 
The thing is, regardless of perks, no one in their right mind would leave Steam for Epic
Xaelath 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 7:44 
引用自 HAZRD🌌
引用自 Quadsword
Despite massive backlash from their practices, Epic hasn’t let up even slightly. They have financial backing from Disney and Tencent, two of the largest corporations in the world, and a massive cash flow from Fortnite and unreal engine, the former being the most popular game in the world and the latter being the most popular commercial game engine in the world.

I feel like no amount of consumer backlash will stop them getting the monopoly they obviously want. They can just keep throwing money around until they control the entire games industry. I miss the days before mega corporations entered this industry.
don't worry they gonna die after fortnite & u will see

It's just like Microsoft with Maincraft
They're just a bubble that's stretching out until it explodes
Fortinite isnt going to die anytime soon though thats the real problem.

Although BR fad seems going to end really soon following PUBG downfall in PC (i am not even sure why my younger brother mentioned that "People are returning to play PUBG" while Steam stats say the otherwise.
Game used to have 3 million concurrent players then back in early 2019 it still has 1m concurrent now its even having a hard time hitting 800k.

Apex also pretty much dead at this point with EA in charge.

Not entirely sure how Fortinite turn out later but i doubt its going to be gone really soon until next fad found.

I doubt its going to be autochess though, I mean its been there for a while and it seems theres not much story covering it.

The real question now, is how long that Fortinite money going to pay for the exclusivity.
Dont quote me "Muh Unreal Engine is enough to fund Sweeney" no thats a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ considering UE has exist for years and Sweeney only started this ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ when Fortinite boomed.
Erebus 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 8:07 
引用自 Dixon Sider
Competition is good for the customers.
That's exactly why people don't like Epic.
Dixon Sider 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 8:15 
引用自 Erebus
引用自 Dixon Sider
Competition is good for the customers.
That's exactly why people don't like Epic.

How does that make sense lol? PPL like paying for monopolies? They are the ones to benefit
最后由 Dixon Sider 编辑于; 2019 年 8 月 18 日 上午 8:15
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发帖日期: 2019 年 7 月 5 日 下午 7:47
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