Why it so Hard?

[Vora]

Furious mess on the screen. It is absolutely incomprehensible how you can fight in close combat. It is not clear when to press "Evasion". Watch the animations of 5 enemies at the same time? There are a couple of shooters in the distance. WTF? Even on normal difficulty, they kill with two splashes. I don't know something about the mechanics of the game? Help with advice.

[BOWSER]

What character are you playing? You don't have to watch every enemy when you're doing area attacks. Ms Marvel and Hulk have the most Light and Heavy basic attacks that are effective at damaging entire groups. It's possible with the others but they need to rely on Heroics and Specialization/Mastery upgrades.

Some enemies have blue or red shields that overlap their health bar. You do not want to get surrounded by those enemies, always try to fight them 1 or 2 at a time. The amount of dodging to avoid damage would make things more difficult than it needs to be, so take the easy route and Jump out of those situations. Basically, if you're hitting an enemy that doesn't flinch, be prepared to do an Evasion technique.

Dodge is best for the Red circles that appear on the enemy because if you're a melee, you can stay close to do more damage and there are Perks on Gear that award you for evading perfectly. Jump is better for getting away from Red circles that appear on the ground if you haven't learned to Dodge perfectly. Dodge will be your most reliable evasion technique followed by your Parry, Heroics, and Jump. You can also extend the dodge distance by double tapping the button.

All Assault Heroics allow you to Hold the button and it's different for certain heroes, but the general idea is that holding the Assault button has more benefits, especially since you are invincible the entire time. The invincibility part applies to all Heroics by the way.

Off screen attack indicators means you have to turn the camera in that direction to see how to act accordingly. Most of time you're too busy to adjust the camera, so it's better to just take out Range enemies first, especially the ones that shoot homing missiles. If the off-screen indicator is red, you're 1-2 seconds away from getting hit by a missile so double tap Dodge or use one of your Heroics to avoid the damage.

If you think your character dies too fast then equip gear with the Resolve stat which increases Willpower, your health. Putting your first 3 points in the Defensive Boost section of the Champion skills would be a good idea as well for building a more tanky character.

Other than that, learn enemy attack animations so you can see what's coming ahead of time and get into the proper position to damage them without taking damage yourself.

[CheeseWhiskers]

That’s what she said?

[Andrew]

I play Natasha almost exclusively. Stats wise, she is a glass cannon. At range I power attack head shots at 60,000 to 100,000 damage. However, like you said, you cannot watch everything. I have driven my critical chance as high as I can get it. Through valor, she does nearly triple damage on crits which is almost every hit. I also boost my Stun damage over 70%.

How she survives in melee:
Perk: Invulnerability chance on each critical hit.
Proficiency: Boosting my perk chance of activating Invulnerability and critical chance to open the opportunity to perk.
Perk: Invulnerability when critically wounded.
Perk: Jarvis Barrier when taking damage.
Ultimate: Lowers damage taken while active.
Perk: Cosmic Surge on taking damage.
Stealth: Remain unseen while inflicting higher stun damage.
Will Power Regeneration: While stealth and cosmic surge is active.
Take Downs: Heals self and drop Heroic Orbs.

So to answer your question, gear and specialization will effect your game play.

It doesn't hurt Natasha that she is also a super soldier like Steve and Bucky. Additionally, she has medical nanites in her system that halt her aging and offers accelerated regeneration.

[Captain Worthy]

Remember that Takedowns also provide invulnerability, and can often be what saves you due to the willpower boost as well.

[Andrew]

Originally posted by Captain Worthy:

Remember that Takedowns also provide invulnerability, and can often be what saves you due to the willpower boost as well.

You miss worded that.

While in a take down animation you are intangible. But you need the Take Down Perk that grants invulnerability to actually have the buff.

I've been hit with Area of Effect while in a take down. So you can still be harmed indirectly although you are intangible.

[Captain Worthy]

Originally posted by Andrew:

Originally posted by Captain Worthy:

Remember that Takedowns also provide invulnerability, and can often be what saves you due to the willpower boost as well.

You miss worded that.

While in a take down animation you are intangible. But you need the Take Down Perk that grants invulnerability to actually have the buff.

I've been hit with Area of Effect while in a take down. So you can still be harmed indirectly although you are intangible.

That sounds like a bug, you're supposed to have i-frames during takedowns. I take hits during my takedowns and it doesn't faze the willpower meter.

[BOWSER]

Originally posted by Captain Worthy:

Remember that Takedowns also provide invulnerability, and can often be what saves you due to the willpower boost as well.

True. I always forget something even though I'm writing these huge comments. There's so much in the game. Most people will overlook how many combat techniques are in the game because they play one way. There's actually a lot of ways to play each character that can all be effective.

[Captain Worthy]

Originally posted by BOWSER:

Originally posted by Captain Worthy:

Remember that Takedowns also provide invulnerability, and can often be what saves you due to the willpower boost as well.

True. I always forget something even though I'm writing these huge comments. There's so much in the game. Most people will overlook how many combat techniques are in the game because they play one way. There's actually a lot of ways to play each character that can all be effective.

I had entirely missed one series of moves on KB, until I had played Clint a lot and out of habit did the same button combo on Kate recently. 😁

It's not indeed possible to keep all of the things about the combat system in mind at once, it's a constant journey of rediscovery!

[foxy]

Originally posted by BOWSER:

What character are you playing? You don't have to watch every enemy when you're doing area attacks. Ms Marvel and Hulk have the most Light and Heavy basic attacks that are effective at damaging entire groups. It's possible with the others but they need to rely on Heroics and Specialization/Mastery upgrades.

Some enemies have blue or red shields that overlap their health bar. You do not want to get surrounded by those enemies, always try to fight them 1 or 2 at a time. The amount of dodging to avoid damage would make things more difficult than it needs to be, so take the easy route and Jump out of those situations. Basically, if you're hitting an enemy that doesn't flinch, be prepared to do an Evasion technique.

Dodge is best for the Red circles that appear on the enemy because if you're a melee, you can stay close to do more damage and there are Perks on Gear that award you for evading perfectly. Jump is better for getting away from Red circles that appear on the ground if you haven't learned to Dodge perfectly. Dodge will be your most reliable evasion technique followed by your Parry, Heroics, and Jump. You can also extend the dodge distance by double tapping the button.

All Assault Heroics allow you to Hold the button and it's different for certain heroes, but the general idea is that holding the Assault button has more benefits, especially since you are invincible the entire time. The invincibility part applies to all Heroics by the way.

Off screen attack indicators means you have to turn the camera in that direction to see how to act accordingly. Most of time you're too busy to adjust the camera, so it's better to just take out Range enemies first, especially the ones that shoot homing missiles. If the off-screen indicator is red, you're 1-2 seconds away from getting hit by a missile so double tap Dodge or use one of your Heroics to avoid the damage.

If you think your character dies too fast then equip gear with the Resolve stat which increases Willpower, your health. Putting your first 3 points in the Defensive Boost section of the Champion skills would be a good idea as well for building a more tanky character.

Other than that, learn enemy attack animations so you can see what's coming ahead of time and get into the proper position to damage them without taking damage yourself.

Thanks -- this is very helpful information!

[kaworu83]

Originally posted by Vora:

Furious mess on the screen. It is absolutely incomprehensible how you can fight in close combat. It is not clear when to press "Evasion". Watch the animations of 5 enemies at the same time? There are a couple of shooters in the distance. WTF? Even on normal difficulty, they kill with two splashes. I don't know something about the mechanics of the game? Help with advice.

Because the devs couldn't figure out a simple combat mechanics like in the batman arkahm games and instead made the combat so messy that is frustrating especially to new players or older folks who don't have cat like reflexes anymore.

[BOWSER]

Originally posted by kaworu83:

Originally posted by Vora:

Furious mess on the screen. It is absolutely incomprehensible how you can fight in close combat. It is not clear when to press "Evasion". Watch the animations of 5 enemies at the same time? There are a couple of shooters in the distance. WTF? Even on normal difficulty, they kill with two splashes. I don't know something about the mechanics of the game? Help with advice.

Because the devs couldn't figure out a simple combat mechanics like in the batman arkahm games and instead made the combat so messy that is frustrating especially to new players or older folks who don't have cat like reflexes anymore.

I remember becoming frustrated with Batman's combat more than Avengers. I especially didn't like the knife wielding enemies in Batman. The window to avoid damage was small. Avenger's dodge is a double dodge + direction giving players more time and be less precise to actually avoid damage when compared to the knife counters.

I'm not saying either one is worse than the other. I realize I just need more time invested in Batman's combat to recognize how to counter each enemy. I feel like there are more viable options that can work for every enemy type in Avengers which increases the variety of your approach in combat.

For instance, In Batman you must first Stun then vault over the enemies who carry shields in order to damage them while in Avengers you can immediately do a vault, Heroic, or Power Attack (to name a few maneuvers) to get around them or directly break through their shields with a frontal approach.

Feel free to correct or give me advice on Batman's combat. I am recalling this information from memory and if I remember correctly, Batman's combat felt more strict and simple (like you said). As simple as it is, I think being more strict is what turned me off the combat. I had a lot of fun beating up the basic enemies but when the more advanced enemies appeared in groups, there was basically one tactic to counter each enemy type. So it probably doesn't make sense that I couldn't adapt quicker to Batman's combat but here we are. Maybe I just like having more options. *shrug*

[BOWSER]

Originally posted by foxy:

Thanks -- this is very helpful information!

You're welcome. Glad I could be of service. :)

[BOWSER]

Originally posted by Captain Worthy:

Originally posted by BOWSER:

True. I always forget something even though I'm writing these huge comments. There's so much in the game. Most people will overlook how many combat techniques are in the game because they play one way. There's actually a lot of ways to play each character that can all be effective.

I had entirely missed one series of moves on KB, until I had played Clint a lot and out of habit did the same button combo on Kate recently. 😁

It's not indeed possible to keep all of the things about the combat system in mind at once, it's a constant journey of rediscovery!

Yep. Exactly. There are so many options, sometimes people will forget they even exist and basically just stick to the one that is fastest, does the most damage, or most familiar. I'll admit I do that often myself. But in reality, if an attack doesn't feel worth it, there is always the option to combine different attacks or adjust stats/perks/upgrades to increase or change the overall effectiveness.

[kaworu83]

Originally posted by BOWSER:

I remember becoming frustrated with Batman's combat more than Avengers. I especially didn't like the knife wielding enemies in Batman. The window to avoid damage was small. Avenger's dodge is a double dodge + direction giving players more time and be less precise to actually avoid damage when compared to the knife counters.

I'm not saying either one is worse than the other. I realize I just need more time invested in Batman's combat to recognize how to counter each enemy. I feel like there are more viable options that can work for every enemy type in Avengers which increases the variety of your approach in combat.

Well in batman you never got attacked by more enemies than you can counter whereas in MA all mobs can attack you at once and if you used your 2 dodges already you are screwed! Especially if you cannot dodge ranged attacks or aoe from strongest mobs.
Once you mastered Batman combat you became a killing machine unless you slipped up, but with MA combat it's all hoping that mobs don't gang on you right after you already double dodged! It's like take your chances instead of play it with skills. Some mobs are a brickwall which doesn't really help with the fun but adds to the frustration.
In MA combat you simply don't have to get swarmed and take down weak or annoying mobs first and as fast as you can instead of letting you decide to kill the strong ones first and weak ones later.

[BOWSER]

Originally posted by kaworu83:

Originally posted by BOWSER:

I remember becoming frustrated with Batman's combat more than Avengers. I especially didn't like the knife wielding enemies in Batman. The window to avoid damage was small. Avenger's dodge is a double dodge + direction giving players more time and be less precise to actually avoid damage when compared to the knife counters.

I'm not saying either one is worse than the other. I realize I just need more time invested in Batman's combat to recognize how to counter each enemy. I feel like there are more viable options that can work for every enemy type in Avengers which increases the variety of your approach in combat.

Well in batman you never got attacked by more enemies than you can counter whereas in MA all mobs can attack you at once and if you used your 2 dodges already you are screwed! Especially if you cannot dodge ranged attacks or aoe from strongest mobs.
Once you mastered Batman combat you became a killing machine unless you slipped up, but with MA combat it's all hoping that mobs don't gang on you right after you already double dodged! It's like take your chances instead of play it with skills. Some mobs are a brickwall which doesn't really help with the fun but adds to the frustration.
In MA combat you simply don't have to get swarmed and take down weak or annoying mobs first and as fast as you can instead of letting you decide to kill the strong ones first and weak ones later.

Very valid points. Especially the 1 on 1 feature when surrounded which works perfectly for Batman since it's a single player game. I think the team/multiplayer aspect of Avengers forces broader combat. Slower combat could be problematic when playing with other people. I think each system works better for each game which makes them unique.

Once you become comfortable with all your evasion techniques, possible maneuvers for each character, and equip appropriate stats/upgrades to boost durability or playstyle, it's actually not that bad. There's just a lot more happening in real time.