Lossless Scaling

Lossless Scaling

Mouse Cursor Disappears in Various Ways (Game, OS, or both)
Similar to the thread here: https://steamcommunity.com/app/993090/discussions/0/3770111248593317990/

Problem:
(1) the game (any game) will retain mouse cursor display. If I move the mouse cursor off the game to my second monitor, the cursor disappears but I can see it highlight items on mouse over. Clicking on the second monitor will not re-display the mouse cursor. The only workaround is to toggle the game scaling. Rinse and repeat.

(2) The inverse of #1. I click/alt+tab out of the game and the cursor over the game window disappears, but works fine within Windows. I can still see stuff highlight in the game as I mouse over it, but the cursor works in the OS but not the game. Workaround is same as #1. Less frequent than #1.

(3) Multi-monitor off makes things worse. I'll run into situation #1 or #2, but then I lose the mouse cursor for both the game AND the OS until I exit the game. Toggling scaling off/on does not fix the problem.

Other notes: I've played around with G-sync vs Fixed Refresh but that doesn't seem to make a difference. Toggling VRR within Lossless Scaling doesn't seem to make a difference, either.

I've also just noticed that I can usually move the mouse off the game once without Alt+Tab or clicking off. If I move the mouse back to the game I can see it in the game, but never again in the OS unless I toggle scaling.

This happens in any game, whether the game overrides the mouse cursor or not. None of the games I've tried this with bind the mouse cursor to the window, either.

LS configuration:
Version 2.2.7
Mode: Auto/Fullscreen
Type: Usually AMD FSR, non-optimized
Cursor: all off
Rendering: VRR support on
GPU: Auto
Crop: 0
Behavior: Multi-display on. See #3, above, for off.

System:
i9-13900K, 64 GB, 3070 TI
LG C2 @ 4k/120Hz (Display 2 - Main) and BenQ EW3270U 4k@60 (Display 1) arranged with the BenQ on top.
Windows 11 22H2 (22621.2428, Xpack 1000.22674.1000.0)
nVidia Driver 537.34
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Showing 1-10 of 10 comments
(ノ°□°)ノ  [developer] Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:19pm 
Hi,
Regarding 1) - I am aware about the problem, but I could not solve it when it appeared. At the time when support for multiple displays was added, everything worked as intended, until one day Microsoft changed something in Windows 11 that broke the reappearance of the cursor (on Windows 10 everything should work as it should until now). To hide or show the system cursor, the program uses a non-public API, so it's useless to complain to them.
2) As I understand, when you press alt-tab scaling remains active? Does the cursor start showing when you reactivate the game window?

VRR support was experimental and only worked on RTX 20. This option should have been removed by now, but some users were against it.
Last edited by (ノ°□°)ノ; Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:56pm
kamikaze.kyle Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:43pm 
Thanks for the followup! I guess if you're using a non-public API it just comes along with the territory :)

#2 is identical to #1, but the cursor disappears from the OS instead of the instead of the game. Basically #2 is cursor disappears in the OS, stays in game. #1 cursor disappears in the game, but stays in the OS. Both have the same trigger conditions of basically just leaving the game window in some fashion. *Usually* this is an off click or Alt-Tab event.

Once the cursor disappears from either OS or game, I have toggle off/on of Scaling for a fix. It never comes back when I mouse back from wherever it disappeared without that fix. Though twice I've run into a situation where the cursor just never reappeared when Scaling was turned back on and I had to exit the game entirely. The cursor will always come back for both game and OS if I disable Scaling, it just might very rarely not come back when Scaling is re-enabled.
Last edited by kamikaze.kyle; Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:45pm
(ノ°□°)ノ  [developer] Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:52pm 
I might be confused between 1 and 2. Anyway, the bug I know about is when the cursor does not appear in Windows, but is visible in the game. There is a big difference when it's the other way around, because the system cursor is drawn by the system, and the game cursor is drawn by the LS (except software cursors that drawn by game), and when you don't see the cursor in the game, it's either a bug or I coded it that way. If I remember correctly, I decided not to draw the cursor in the game when the game window is not active, in order to avoid the scenario when the user sees two cursors at the same time in different places (the in-game will be shifted due to scaling).
Last edited by (ノ°□°)ノ; Oct 21, 2023 @ 12:53pm
kamikaze.kyle Oct 21, 2023 @ 2:31pm 
I've had it happen both ways. The most common situation is as you stated where the cursor doesn't appear in the OS but does appear in the game. If the game window loses focus (click out the game widow, alt-tab, etc) then reacquires focus, the mouse cursor doesn't come back until I retoggle scaling.

Just right now I was testing with Lord of the Rings Online at the character select screen. I enabled scaling, clicked to my second monitor, then lost the cursor from both OS and the game. I alt-tabbed back to the game, used the shortcut to disable scaling, and got my cursor back. I then re-enabled scaling and lost my cursor permanently in the game. It would still show up in the OS if the game window had focus. I'd move the cursor out of the game window, see it in Windows, move it back to the game window then lose the cursor permanently while scaled. Forcing focus back to the game window didn't do anything. I never could get the cursor working in the game again while scaled until I restarted the game.

It might be something the game is doing when losing focus as I know it at least frame caps on focus loss. Other games (ie: Eldevin, Toukiden 2) I'll lose the cursor in game if the game loses focus and it won't come back on regaining focus. I can get it back by toggling scaling.

In LOTRO I can replicate the "totally missing cursor while scaled until game relaunch" issue every time at the character selection screen. In game it usually just has the missing OS cursor as you described, though I did have it totally lose both OS and game cursors once while in game.

Only other clue I have is that the LOTRO game window flashes when I move the cursor back to the window like it was re-recognizing it got focus even though it was still operating as if it had focus. That might be mucking around with things.
(ノ°□°)ノ  [developer] Oct 22, 2023 @ 2:22am 
Okay, that looks like a bug. I will check it out. Does anything change when the multi-display option is disabled?
kamikaze.kyle Oct 22, 2023 @ 7:05am 
Multi display doesn't really seem to make a difference as far as I can tell.

I also think LOTRO is just...special. For example, if I force Lossless Scaling to have a fixed refreshed rate (no VRR) via the Nvidia Control Panel, VRR is then turned off for my display when I activate scaling. It stays off even after game and Lossless Scaling exit until I manually toggle G-SYNC or reboot the system. It doesn't seem to happen for other games, though. So it might not really be a bug in Lossless Scaling but just how LOTRO's engine hates my setup.

I've also noticed that vsync is sometimes disabled when scaling is enabled, so I have to limit the framerate and get tearing. This is with the "Allow tearing" option off and happens in both global fixed refresh and global G-SYNC modes. But it doesn't happen to all games. I haven't done extensive testing since most of the games I'd scale have built-in hard frame caps anyway. I can't really even pinpoint a specific engine as I had two Unity based games where one went AWOL without an external hard limit, but the other stuck to vsync no problem.

From the three games I mentioned earlier, LOTRO loses all vsync with scaling enabled even if vsync is enabled in the game. I have to hard cap it via Nvidia control panel or it'll hit a few hundred FPS. Eldevin seems to honor vsync regardless of scaling and runs at 120 FPS, but it's a custom Java engine game and doesn't have an option to toggle vysync in game. Toukiden 2 is a Vita to PS3 to PC port, so it can only do 60 FPS before its engine hard caps.

I might have also made a little headway in getting the cursor back to the game. I seem to have more reliability if I can take my invisible cursor and guess where the non-scaled window is located. If I then click back instead of Alt-Tab I've had better success in getting the game cursor back without toggling scaling. Helpful for when the scaling keyboard shortcut doesn't work. I still lose the cursor in Windows once the main game window loses focus, however, and it doesn't come back until scaling is toggled.

Thanks again for the help. I wouldn't put it past an unholy combination of my game choices and setup breaking the API voodoo for Lossless Scaling, especially if nobody else is reporting issues.
cje.churchill Jun 9, 2024 @ 6:40pm 
I am having this issue too. When I scale the in game curser becomes invisible....
Danali Aug 9, 2024 @ 7:52am 
yeah experiencing this issue as well. Cursor visible outside the game but when I tab back in its completely invisible
Roquexzs Aug 11, 2024 @ 3:35pm 
Originally posted by Danali:
yeah experiencing this issue as well. Cursor visible outside the game but when I tab back in its completely invisible
I had the same problem, does someone knows how to fix it?
I still have this problem too.
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Date Posted: Oct 20, 2023 @ 4:51pm
Posts: 10