Oni VS Ironsoul

[SqueakCheesetaker]

Howdy, I recently unlocked T2 classes (at e301 right now) and I have been playing mostly Ironsoul before that and really enjoying it. I am not using any guides so what I am doing is definitely not optimal - currently I have spent most of my dust on the Empowering set and the Berserker sword. I did this mostly because it seemed like a pretty generalist set and it seemed to go well with both Abolisher and Ironsoul, which I was interested in. I also switch to some void mana pieces while getting void mana, but I don't really have them upgraded yet. I should probably mention that I do not really like leaving games open for a long amount of time, which does kinda mess with the spellcasting profits obviously - but on Ironsoul I would still get plenty of spell charges from AFK and then I would cast them pretty quickly when checking back on the game.

My issue currently is that I am getting way better profits with just basic Ironsoul when compared to Oni. The passive Incantation buff from Ironsoul is so much higher that Void Radiance gives quadrillions of void mana per second after a few minutes playing the class, while AFKing with Oni for about a day or so doesn't even get me to 100 billion/s (with no void items on both). Even with an Anima Construct at level 440 on Oni instead of around a level 150 on Ironsoul, replacing Empower with Goblet of Fire and the Possesed Blade spell, the profits are just so much slower.

On Ironsoul I was able to get noticeable profits after checking in on the game daily (around e5 usually), but with Oni I couldn't even get to the same mysteries as before after 2 days. Am I missing something about the class, like what am I meant to do to get the incantation bonus as high as on Ironsoul's - or maybe is there another way to get better profits? I have taken a peek at the wiki but it seems to recommend making yet another weapon legendary already and an offhand which I don't have unlocked quite yet + it seems insanely complicated, listing an 8 step process for playing the class.

I was looking forward to maxing out my Berserker and playing a T2 class but at this point I feel I kinda just have to go back to Ironsoul. For now I am still trying all of the T2's though.

[PseudonymousBosh]

Using void radiance for your void mana isn't taking full advantage of the oni's demonologist side. You can level and use a voidterror for this, then switch to another pet and quickly level for burst, as a demonologist would; you might be able to burst with anima construct, but hungerer or pit lord have traditionally found more favour.

Cataclysm is oni's preferred burst weapon, but if it has yet to reach a satisfactory quailty, head of the all-eater might give better results.

[SqueakCheesetaker]

Originally posted by PseudonymousBosh:

Using void radiance for your void mana isn't taking full advantage of the oni's demonologist side. You can level and use a voidterror for this, then switch to another pet and quickly level for burst, as a demonologist would; you might be able to burst with anima construct, but hungerer or pit lord have traditionally found more favour.

Cataclysm is oni's preferred burst weapon, but if it has yet to reach a satisfactory quailty, head of the all-eater might give better results.

That makes sense actually, thank you! I haven't really played Demonologist but it does make a lot of sense to change pets a lot of level them up depending on what you are currently doing. I suppose hungerer and pit lord would be better for bursting when at really high levels as well.

[Elemia]

Oni will be weaker than Ironsoul until e320 when you can get the Commissar's torn sleeve offhand unique

[Merp]

What other people have said (it's weaker than IS until e320, and you should be using VT for void mana), plus the fact that oni is fairly complicated. Due to it wanting to level pets like it does, and little easily-missable quirks of its spells, it's very easy to lose a lot of profits with it. the oni guide on the wiki (https://idlewizard.wiki.gg/wiki/Oni_Guide_Refactored) can come across as incredibly complicated at first glance, but it can help you with maximizing oni if you're willing to look through it.

If you don't want to look at the guide, though (which I totally get), then here's some things to think about:
Possessed Blade scales its effect based on the highest pet level achieved this exile. What pet could you use to level it very, very high relative to others, to get this bonus up? (hint: evocation efficiency affects the pet exp from Hellstorm, and t1 pets take less EXP per level than t2 pets)
Berzerker scales its effect based on current Monuments. it may be worth it to try and gain a lot of mana at the start of an exile, rather than only waiting for the end, to maximize its effect throughout your buildup.
Also, make sure you're maximizing pet exp gained. Oni has enough spells to fill up an entire spell bar and then some with stuff that boosts pet exp in one way or another. If you aren't already, make a separate spell and gear set for pet leveling (you'll need it for leveling the different pets you use throughout the run). And again, evocation efficiency affects Hellstorm (evo^.5, if you know what that means), and incantation efficiency is also often *better* than evocation efficiency in some item slots, because multiple spells are affected by it.

[SqueakCheesetaker]

Thanks for the tips everyone! Playing some Archon at the moment and I will go back to Oni after e320.