What this game needs is a CCG!

[Captain Chris]

As the title says, a Star Trek CCG with in-game loot cards like the old Star Wars one or Warcraft did.
There was a really good CCG fairly recently, Adversaries, get those guys on board and BOOM profits that would make a Ferengi proud!
Alternatively just use the classic Star Trek CCG game and make an new digital version of that.
Considering the fans have kept that alive for a decade or more after its demise you would probably get a whole new market to ply STO too!
This idea is free to use, go do it, money waiting!

[Agnithrax]

I think Star Trek Timelines might be the CCG you're looking for

[Captain Chris]

Yeah I had thought so but I really never liked it sadly.

[Agnithrax]

I found it kinda nefarious too. I really dug that it was a lot more problem solving with the Star Trek characters rather than just the usual shoot 'em up, but once you start building up your characters it becomes either overwhelming victory or impossible to accomplish and you're just grinding to level up your characters and ships to accomplish the impossible runs with now overwhelming victories and then proceed to the next set of can and can't do missions. Of course by then you're about 4 to 6 months of sunk cost in building everything up that they've got their hooks set in tight.

[Maj_Cyric]

Originally posted by Agnithrax:

I think Star Trek Timelines might be the CCG you're looking for

Yup... it is "That" game..
https://youtu.be/Gqal_NqOkf0?t=60


I used to play it on my tablet.. and 90% of android games, it will either slowly require more and more $$ to stay relevant, or it will suddenly require more.. this game was subtle slow in how it slowly requires a boost here and pack there.. A very repetitive game though...

As for the OP's "idea"... there are these thingie things called Patents & Copyrights and for someone not owning those would have negotiate a contract of sorts with the holder/owner of said Patented/Copyrighted material to be granted a license with terms stipulating the length of the term of contract, and dictate all the terms of how and what is allowed or not allowed by licensee with the Patented/Copyrighted property...

Which i'm sure the Contract that PWE has with CBS limits what they can and can't do with the Star Trek property.. A CCG would require either a spreprate contract or amending their current one to use the Star Trek property in a new/different way than what they can currently...

Might and Magic Duel of Champions is still the best digital CCG.. RIP Oct 2016.. I've yet to find another as fun and good as that game was..

[cap-boulanger]

Originally posted by GanjaDemon:

As the title says, a Star Trek CCG with in-game loot cards like the old Star Wars one or Warcraft did.
There was a really good CCG fairly recently, Adversaries, get those guys on board and BOOM profits that would make a Ferengi proud!
Alternatively just use the classic Star Trek CCG game and make an new digital version of that.
Considering the fans have kept that alive for a decade or more after its demise you would probably get a whole new market to ply STO too!
This idea is free to use, go do it, money waiting!

Those ideas aren't "free to use". First you'd have to (as Maj_Cyric mentioned) have a licensing agreement for Star Trek, in order to use the intellectual property, and secondly if you were trying to make a digital version of the old Star Trek CCG, for example, you'd have to get licensing rights from the makers of the physical game as well (because there's stuff in the game that was not directly licensed by Paramount/Viacom/whatever it's called now... card texts and such)

[Captain Chris]

Yeah I know it not just "fair game" but since there is already a deal clearly going on with the IP as we are all playing Star Trek I assume the major issue would be a deal with who owns the rights to the older card games (Unless they wanted to come up with something original) but I also assume that if someone came to you and offered to give you some % of takings for an IP that you are not using most people would think thats a good idea!

[Jackie Daytona]

Originally posted by GanjaDemon:

Yeah I know it not just "fair game" but since there is already a deal clearly going on with the IP as we are all playing Star Trek I assume the major issue would be a deal with who owns the rights to the older card games (Unless they wanted to come up with something original) but I also assume that if someone came to you and offered to give you some % of takings for an IP that you are not using most people would think thats a good idea!

You're talking about the Decipher card game from the 1990s, right?

Having the license to an IP is not the same as having free reign over it. For instance, Decipher's SWCCG had to get approval for each and every card. All prototypes had to be sent to Lucasfilm before they were allowed to print and sell the cards.

STO seems to be able to put anything they want in the game. But there's a limit to that. They can't just grab any Star Trek novel or comic to adapt into the game. Some of the writers and artists retain copyright for their unique contributions. However, some may have singed away any of their rights. As part of their licensing agreement.

Copyright law is very complicated. So, I'm not even sure about anything related to it.

The biggest problem with adding STCCG is that Decipher no longer exists. So, who even owns the rights? Decipher itself? Maybe. If so? Well, you can't negotiate with a company that isn't there to talk to you.

I suppose it's possible to hunt down and contact the former heads of Decipher. Try to find someone that has the rights, or the ability to turn them over. Then pay them off. Or try to pay off all the old employees of Decipher.

It's more difficult than it sounds. STCCG (and SWCCG, for that matter) didn't just use material from TNG/DS9. It took inspiration from concept art and novels. Some card pics were complete fabrications. Created entirely in photoshop. (Such as this pic[static.wikia.nocookie.net] of Jodo Kast.)

The point being, you'd have to track down quite a few artists. Pay them all off... individually. That takes way too long. The alternative is that you leave a bunch of cards out. (So you don't have to pay anyone related to them.) Then you'd just have people complaining and demanding the missing cards return.

It's a huge mess. Yes, you have a good idea. I would love to see a digital version of the old STCCG. That would be amazing. Having it integrated into STO? Probably would be a disaster.

I mean, you've seen how they monetize. You've (probably) seen just how rare certain drops are from lockcrates. Now imagine they apply that to digital card packs. Imagine opening up 100 packs of cards, and never getting Riker, Picard, Kirk, Enterprise, Spock, etc. Instead you get shuttlecrafts, Chief Singhs, or Ensign McKnights[cardguide.fandom.com].

Fact is, any company would create their own card game instead. It would actually be cheaper and easier. Not at first, but definitely in the long run.

Personally, I think STO needs 3D chess, dom-jot, and parrises squares. How are these not in the game already?

[Maj_Cyric]

Well at least they have DABO!

[Captain Chris]

Originally posted by Jackie Daytona:

Originally posted by GanjaDemon:

Yeah I know it not just "fair game" but since there is already a deal clearly going on with the IP as we are all playing Star Trek I assume the major issue would be a deal with who owns the rights to the older card games (Unless they wanted to come up with something original) but I also assume that if someone came to you and offered to give you some % of takings for an IP that you are not using most people would think thats a good idea!

You're talking about the Decipher card game from the 1990s, right?

Having the license to an IP is not the same as having free reign over it. For instance, Decipher's SWCCG had to get approval for each and every card. All prototypes had to be sent to Lucasfilm before they were allowed to print and sell the cards.

STO seems to be able to put anything they want in the game. But there's a limit to that. They can't just grab any Star Trek novel or comic to adapt into the game. Some of the writers and artists retain copyright for their unique contributions. However, some may have singed away any of their rights. As part of their licensing agreement.

Copyright law is very complicated. So, I'm not even sure about anything related to it.

The biggest problem with adding STCCG is that Decipher no longer exists. So, who even owns the rights? Decipher itself? Maybe. If so? Well, you can't negotiate with a company that isn't there to talk to you.

I suppose it's possible to hunt down and contact the former heads of Decipher. Try to find someone that has the rights, or the ability to turn them over. Then pay them off. Or try to pay off all the old employees of Decipher.

It's more difficult than it sounds. STCCG (and SWCCG, for that matter) didn't just use material from TNG/DS9. It took inspiration from concept art and novels. Some card pics were complete fabrications. Created entirely in photoshop. (Such as this pic[static.wikia.nocookie.net] of Jodo Kast.)

The point being, you'd have to track down quite a few artists. Pay them all off... individually. That takes way too long. The alternative is that you leave a bunch of cards out. (So you don't have to pay anyone related to them.) Then you'd just have people complaining and demanding the missing cards return.

It's a huge mess. Yes, you have a good idea. I would love to see a digital version of the old STCCG. That would be amazing. Having it integrated into STO? Probably would be a disaster.

I mean, you've seen how they monetize. You've (probably) seen just how rare certain drops are from lockcrates. Now imagine they apply that to digital card packs. Imagine opening up 100 packs of cards, and never getting Riker, Picard, Kirk, Enterprise, Spock, etc. Instead you get shuttlecrafts, Chief Singhs, or Ensign McKnights[cardguide.fandom.com].

Fact is, any company would create their own card game instead. It would actually be cheaper and easier. Not at first, but definitely in the long run.

Personally, I think STO needs 3D chess, dom-jot, and parrises squares. How are these not in the game already?

Honestly, it does not have to be the old CCG game, would be epicly good if it was though!
Adversaries was only released a few years ago and was very short lived but was far and away one of the best ccg's I've played, might be easier to get the rights to that.
But, even if not, there could always be a new concept, just riskier in case it's not very good!

[cap-boulanger]

Well yes, but also, the licensing agreement that Cryptic has for STO may not (probably does not) give them the authority to use the IP for other purposes, outside of the game. Because most licensing agreements are for a specific use, not a blanket license.

Like for example, if Nike licenses the name and logo of a pro soccer team (let's just say), that would allow them to make products with the team's name and logo on them. But it wouldn't give them permission to make a digital game with the team in it.

So Cryptic may not (probably does not) have permission to make a CCG, even if it was all new built from scratch.

[PhotriusPyrelus]

Originally posted by Jackie Daytona:

The biggest problem with adding STCCG is that Decipher no longer exists. So, who even owns the rights? Decipher itself? Maybe. If so? Well, you can't negotiate with a company that isn't there to talk to you.

Wish I had learned how to play that game back in the day. Also, if a business doesn't exist any more, it can't hold assets. The IP *SHOULD* be open to the public. I'm not saying that' *is* how copyright works, but it should. A business can't hold any other asset when it doesn't exist, why does a special exception exist for IP?

Originally posted by Jackie Daytona:

Personally, I think STO needs 3D chess, dom-jot, and parrises squares. How are these not in the game already?

They'd just screw them up like they did """Dabo""". Also, "3D" chess was incredibly inconsistent throughout the series (plural).

Also, I'd be more interested in Tongo and good old fashioned stud poker. Also, Stratagema looked neat.

[vorik]

I thought the DOFFs and Admiralty were my CCG....

There's a new game out called Star Trek Legends. there's some streamlined improvements to the Timelines model, and its kind of a character-based version of Timelines' space battles. There's also a DOFF-like shuttle system. I'm a bit mixed because Legends' LootBox game is pretty Evil/Stronk/Bad. At the beginning, the highest you can get is a green "rare". The animation is kinda cutesy lol, with Worf tanking damage and swinging bat'leths.

[PHX-Sisko]

Originally posted by GanjaDemon:

As the title says, a Star Trek CCG with in-game loot cards like the old Star Wars one or Warcraft did.
There was a really good CCG fairly recently, Adversaries, get those guys on board and BOOM profits that would make a Ferengi proud!
Alternatively just use the classic Star Trek CCG game and make an new digital version of that.
Considering the fans have kept that alive for a decade or more after its demise you would probably get a whole new market to ply STO too!
This idea is free to use, go do it, money waiting!

There was a Trek CCG Online - Star Trek Adversaries. It was on Steam, but the project got killed off.

https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Trek:_Adversaries

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gd99YKLMCJY