Mortal Kombat 11

Mortal Kombat 11

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Shiori Jan 29, 2019 @ 9:38am
Mortal Kombat Women Real Talk
There is no reason to get mad at each other here.

Here is where I begin:

I liked the female ninja design in MK9 better, and I am a female, just so it is out there.

I mained Jade. Still want to, but Skarlet is my second favorite, then Kitana.

I used Sonya when I first started playing MK (1), she was my main then. Her moves just seemed most fun to me at the time. The Leg Grab was cool, and I just... did well when using her.

Now, I see a real noticeable difference, but for the wrong reasons.

I won't ever be a fan of censorship. It is easy to say "oh the Japanese girl likes anime boobs" but consider this is a girl's point of view. I have 2 of them, and they are both boring to me, but seeing others' entertains me. ^,^

I have DOA5:LR, and it's mods. Fun to see, but lost interest immediately though. Much more interested in the game, because DOA games are extremely well-made fighting games, and so are Mortal Kombat games, even though I admit the series has hot girls too, maybe more-so than DOA, which is hard to say when you look at the new Mileena... (Don't try to give her a semi-human mouth now, keep the Baraka-style. She is ButterFace, and everyone is fine with that).

Welcome to the only fighting game to ever make people old... Easily turning everyone's attention to all other fighting games if they are not careful, considering how hard they went out of their way to attract people who want to see sexy ladies. It is risky to intentionally attract people to this aspect and instantly age them, like... actually "age" them, as if we are suddenly demanding real-life aspects in our ninja fighting games.

...I wanna see someone summon a giant frog to squash someone.

Benikage did that in Rumble Roses. Just sayin'... was cool, ftw (free the whales)

Perfect example: Imagine what happens the day Kasumi turns 60, and aesthetics show it. Pitchforks, torches, and upside-down burning crosses, and I am willing to bet that would happen in real life.

So, let us just say... Mortal Kombat and Dead or Alive both have hot ladies. Both can be sexy, both can have physics, both can have destructible clothing, both can receive hate from SJWs, and both can tell these SJWs to f*** off. Girls aren't a fan of them either... they keep making us look bad.

Also, lets all look forward to meeting each other in the Ranks when these great games come out. :-)

Queue Discussions:
Originally posted by Providence 777:
Originally posted by Shiori:
As for the definition of SJW... well, I would greatly hesitate to ask people for their definition, as that falls under the same category as religion and politics now,
My definition is nothing more than "people who inject politics and social issues into media, at the expense of that media and its audience"

Those politics can be either left or right, but when they're looking at trying to address social issues, making the project a "cause", while actual fun and quality take a back seat, that's when I accuse someone of being an "SJW".

"Representation" for example, I understand wanting to see yourself in a game, I typically pick characters which have similar traits as me too, but only CHARACTER traits, I don't pick characters that look like me, I pick characters which either think or behave in a way I relate to, or have life experiences that I might relate to, I don't care if the character is a man or a woman, I don't care what color they are, I just want games to be fun and visually appealing to me.
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Showing 1-15 of 348 comments
Teaspoon Jan 29, 2019 @ 11:59am 
Originally posted by Shiori:
I won't ever be a fan of censorship. It is easy to say "oh the Japanese girl likes anime boobs" but consider this is a girl's point of view. I have 2 of them, and they are both boring to me, but seeing others' entertains me. ^,^

It's not censorship.

What people don't understand is that these games only use a single body type per gender, which is common for most games. If they make a female characters model with giant boobs then every female charactrer model in the game will also have giant boobs, which would be ridiculous. It be one thing if it were a character like Mileena, but it suddenly looks completely ridiculous when it's every female character from Mileena to Cassie. That's why they shifted to a more natural body type in something like MK11 versus the overly elongated, way too muscle toned, big boobed, etc, body from MK9 that every female character shared.

It's like when you mod a game like Skyrim. If you use a female body mod in that game it's going to effect how every female character in that game looks because they all use the same body. That's standard for video games, especially something like Mortal Kombat where all sorts of animations (punches, grabs, etc) have to line up with one another not to mention the fatalities. It's much easier creating a single body type that that you can rip/tear apart in every possible way then having to create a unique body type for each character that you have to tweak against every single other character.

Note that I personally would wather there be a wider range of body types in the game as opposed to just one, however I understand the technical limiations as to why they don't do that and understand that the more unique they make the body types from one another the less time they have to spend on other areas of the game. Think of it this way, is it worth having more unique body types per character if it's at the cost of a smaller roster size?

which is hard to say when you look at the new Mileena... (Don't try to give her a semi-human mouth now, keep the Baraka-style. She is ButterFace, and everyone is fine with that).

She got a new face in MKX as a result of her character having lots more dialogue in the story mode. Her old face would've looked like a bad puppet having to spit out that much dialogue in cutscenes.

Again, there are technical reasons for why things happen during game development. Not everything is the constant conspiracey theories that people on the internet make things out to be.

I don't think her MKX design is great, but I understand why they changed it. The biggest problem with it isn't that they gave her lips, it's that the size of the teeth on the outside of her face gives her head an odd shape, makes it too long, etc.

The MKX design didn't look bad in concept art, it looked bad in the final game because Neatherrealm isn't great at modeling faces.

https://cdnb.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/006/308/675/large/justin-murray-mortal-kombat-x-mkx-concept-art-jm-mileena-mouth-anatomy.jpg?1497577665

https://66.media.tumblr.com/623d94404719c2fefd7c92112ed6447e/tumblr_owsm4hbBTZ1tcwu3to2_1280.jpg

Welcome to the only fighting game to ever make people old...

Mark of The Wolves, Tekken, King of Fighters, Samurai Shodown, etc, have all significantly aged characters, so why are you saying that MK is the "only" fighting game to make people old?

Easily turning everyone's attention to all other fighting games if they are not careful

Given that MK has never really had global/international appeal everyone's attention has always been turned to other fighting games.

considering how hard they went out of their way to attract people who want to see sexy ladies.

Some of the stuff you stated above (as it were fact) can be viewed as you saying them out of ignorrance, but this is just plain made up.

What in MK1 shows that they went out of their way to attract people with sexy ladies? MK1 is where it all started. That's where they gained an audience, and they did that with violence and digitized sprites. That's what got people's attention, that's what captured an audience. The female characters being sexy wasn't really something we saw until Deception (MK6)

They've never gone "out of their way" to make the female characters in MK sexy. That implies they're devoting time, resources, racking their brains, etc, at how to portray the female characters as sexy when it's never been that complicated of a thing to achieve.

It is risky to intentionally attract people to this aspect and instantly age them, like... actually "age" them, as if we are suddenly demanding real-life aspects in our ninja fighting games.

MKX did a time jump because it's an easy way to advance a story, have a lot of changes, etc, it had nothing to do with making the characters "unsexy" they way you're making it out to be.

Perfect example: Imagine what happens the day Kasumi turns 60, and aesthetics show it. Pitchforks, torches, and upside-down burning crosses, and I am willing to bet that would happen in real life.

Based on your previous statements I don't doubt you'd think something like that.

So, let us just say... Mortal Kombat and Dead or Alive both have hot ladies. Both can be sexy, both can have physics, both can have destructible clothing, both can receive hate from SJWs, and both can tell these SJWs to f*** off. Girls aren't a fan of them either... they keep making us look bad.

Games can have attractive/sexy female characters, but having all the female characters in the game be sexy/attarctive is never interesting, creative, etc. We've seen that a million times at this point. Also note there are fighting games like Street Fighter and Tekken that have attractive female designs that nobody complains about.
souleater Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:03pm 
How things got from this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mk+11+sonya&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi1uNiA-5PgAhVHxIsKHdNAANkQ_AUIDigB&biw=1280&bih=607#imgrc=o9kRT8y45oSZqM:

...to this?:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mk+11+sonya&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi1uNiA-5PgAhVHxIsKHdNAANkQ_AUIDigB&biw=1280&bih=607#imgrc=308fVuPV32T9qM:

I am also starting to wonder if female characters have chest at all, thats why very covering chest shaped armors that will create illusion of female body:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mk11+skarlet&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiwpMfj-5PgAhUOqIsKHVwUAbAQ_AUIDigB&biw=1280&bih=607#imgrc=aCrMFJ9j3DDmbM:

Sonya Blade above don't have chest at all at second pic in above and if female body types are copies from each other that would explain why all female characters are covered up, covering chest shaped clothes can hide that.

I would say MK3 Kitana counts as fan service:

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b&biw=1280&bih=607&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=uMxQXLj2NsSfsAHFireIAQ&q=mortal+kombat+3+kitana&oq=mortal+kombat+3+kitana&gs_l=img.1.0.0i19j0i8i30i19.5604.6739..9380...0.0..0.88.488.6......1....1..gws-wiz-img.xtyh14wXuKA#imgrc=QViw9yrb_zElRM:

Way I see it they went far below average in in female body types chests, close to none.
Teaspoon Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:15pm 
Originally posted by souleater:
How things got from this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=mk+11+sonya&client=firefox-b&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi1uNiA-5PgAhVHxIsKHdNAANkQ_AUIDigB&biw=1280&bih=607#imgrc=o9kRT8y45oSZqM:

Fan art created by Henrique Naspolini one of Insomniac's character artists...

https://www.artstation.com/henriquedw

Just further proof that Neatherrealm has never been great at modeling characters, and that character designs are better than face scans.

Companies like Naughty Dog, Insomniac, etc, have always been known for impressive visuals and that artist's profile shows that. It shows the difference between the techniques a studio like Neatherrealm uses versus a studio like Insomniac.

I think in a lot of cases people make certain studios like like Neatherrealm and Bioware to be better than they really ever were at something, especially graphical fidelity, designs, etc, and now that the technology has gotten to a point where we have greater visual fidelity in games the limitations of studios like Neatherrealm, Bioware, etc, have really started showing where as studios like Naughty Dog and Insomniac have only continued to grow and demonstrate that they've always been good and will no doubt continue down that same path.

I would say MK3 Kitana counts as fan service:

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b&biw=1280&bih=607&tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=uMxQXLj2NsSfsAHFireIAQ&q=mortal+kombat+3+kitana&oq=mortal+kombat+3+kitana&gs_l=img.1.0.0i19j0i8i30i19.5604.6739..9380...0.0..0.88.488.6......1....1..gws-wiz-img.xtyh14wXuKA#imgrc=QViw9yrb_zElRM:

A bit more than what was in MK2, but really it's not much of an alteration from her MK2 design. Deception and MK9 is where the most notable design changes occur for the female characters.
Last edited by Teaspoon; Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:20pm
Cinnamoon_dragon Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:33pm 
Get the kids off the screen
I saw someone posted it on Reddit, I think this picture says it all!

https://i.imgur.com/MD1TbEy.jpg
Last edited by Cinnamoon_dragon; Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:34pm
Captain n00by Jan 29, 2019 @ 2:48pm 
Originally posted by Static-ghost:
Get the kids off the screen
I saw someone posted it on Reddit, I think this picture says it all!

https://i.imgur.com/MD1TbEy.jpg

You know, I don't wanna say this being in a lady's thread and all, but dang, I shudder to think what sort of a BJ would she give...
CoolINaturrBoy Jan 30, 2019 @ 12:04am 
Haters are haters :/ and yeah its Designers /editor choices i guess.. but yeah we shouldnt mad at this..
Originally posted by Shiori:
......... both can have destructible clothing,....
And ... Yeah... but they would never make proper Destructible feature would they?...... .( like you then i mentioned before on my thread/other thread .. ? )

Last edited by CoolINaturrBoy; Jan 30, 2019 @ 3:11am
Teaspoon Jan 30, 2019 @ 12:29am 
Originally posted by CoolNatureBoy:
Haters are haters :/ and its Desinger/editor choices i guess.. but yeah we shouldnt mad at this..
Originally posted by Shiori:
......... both can have destructible clothing,....
And ... Yeah... but they will never make proper Destructible feature would they?...... .( like you then i mentioned before on my thread/other thread .. )

What is proper destruction? What are you basing destruction off? There is no consistent or accurate depection of destructable clothing, whether it's in real life or fiction.

The way descrution is portrayed in comic books isn't the same way it's portrayed in anime, just as destruction in anime isn't the same way as it's depicted in movies nor are various types of media even consistent within themselves. For instance not all anime depict destruction the same way.

You literally want to see an insanely specific and extremely niche version of destruction that results in nudity, which almost nothing ever does, and no matter how often people explain to you why it doesn't happen you can simply never accept it.

Just because there is small selection of things out there that depect nudity as a result of clothing destruction doesn't mean every thing that has clothing destruction should follow suit.

You could never wrap your head around the fact that the Senran Kagura anime showed nudity while the game didn't. One is a game and another is an anime though. They're different forms of media. It doesn't matter that they're part of the same franchise. The way anime is made isn't the same way games are made.
Last edited by Teaspoon; Jan 30, 2019 @ 12:29am
souleater Jan 30, 2019 @ 12:55am 
I would not mind some clothing damage, I don't mean nudity or even sexy damage, I mean wear and tear that make character look like that they were in intense fight, dirt, dried blood, tear which shows cuts etc.
Teaspoon Jan 30, 2019 @ 12:58am 
Originally posted by souleater:
I would not mind some clothing damage, I don't mean nudity or even sexy damage, I mean wear and tear that make character look like that they were in intense fight, dirt, dried blood, tear which shows cuts etc.

Yes, I agree. The type of battle damage you see in things like Dragon Ball, DOA5, etc, is perfectly fine and cool to see, but battle damage to the point where it's revealing nudity is just going to seem ridiculous or unnecessary or like the battle damage only exists to expose nudity.
CoolINaturrBoy Jan 30, 2019 @ 2:14am 
Originally posted by Teaspoon:
You literally want to see an insanely specific and extremely niche version of destruction that results in nudity, which almost nothing ever does, and no matter how often people explain to you why it doesn't happen you can simply never accept it.
Yeah i know , you already know this , also answered this already before.

Thing is , it can be part of Game's detail too like how MK9 had [but should have been in uncensored/proper way for some outfits ,not all outfits like armor one ,etc ,since its rated M that’s what I meant ( in my opinion or suggestion )]
But OK.
Last edited by CoolINaturrBoy; Jan 30, 2019 @ 3:11am
Teaspoon Jan 30, 2019 @ 3:16am 
Originally posted by CoolNatureBoy:
Yeah , you already know this , also answered this already before.
Thing is , it can be part of Game's detail too like how MK9 had [but should have been in uncensored/proper way for some outfits ,not all outfits like armor one, since its rated M that’s what I meant ( in my opinion or suggestion )]
But OK.

MK9 didn't have nudity nor was it censored. You don't seem to undertand what censoring means. For something to be censored it needs to have existed in the first place. MK9 at no point ever had any nudity therefore it's literally impossible for them to have censored MK9's nudity given that it never existed in the first place.

Also once again just because something is rated M doesn't mean that it's able to include anything and everything under an M rating, nor should it. There are plenty of M rated games out there that don't do nudity. Game series like Call of Duty, Resident Evil, Fallout, etc, are plenty violent and have been for a long time but what would any of them gain from adding nudity? How would it have any benefit to the story, gameplay, or sales of the game(s)?
Nuka-Cola Zero Jan 30, 2019 @ 2:08pm 
Originally posted by Teaspoon:

It's not censorship.

What people don't understand is that these games only use a single body type per gender, which is common for most games. If they make a female characters model with giant boobs then every female charactrer model in the game will also have giant boobs, which would be ridiculous. It be one thing if it were a character like Mileena, but it suddenly looks completely ridiculous when it's every female character from Mileena to Cassie. That's why they shifted to a more natural body type in something like MK11 versus the overly elongated, way too muscle toned, big boobed, etc, body from MK9 that every female character shared.

I see that you're the type of guy who likes to speak out of his behind with full confidence even when he actually knows nothing about the topic he's speaking of. Have you ever heared about sliders? Check SC6. Different boob sizes is one of the easiest things to achieve.
Last edited by Nuka-Cola Zero; Jan 30, 2019 @ 2:09pm
Teaspoon Jan 30, 2019 @ 2:28pm 
Originally posted by Nuka-Cola Zero:
Originally posted by Teaspoon:

It's not censorship.

What people don't understand is that these games only use a single body type per gender, which is common for most games. If they make a female characters model with giant boobs then every female charactrer model in the game will also have giant boobs, which would be ridiculous. It be one thing if it were a character like Mileena, but it suddenly looks completely ridiculous when it's every female character from Mileena to Cassie. That's why they shifted to a more natural body type in something like MK11 versus the overly elongated, way too muscle toned, big boobed, etc, body from MK9 that every female character shared.

I see that you're the type of guy who likes to speak out of his arse with full confidence even when he actually knows nothing about the topic he's speaking of. Have you ever heared about sliders? Check SC6. Different boob sizes is one of the easiest things to achieve.

Good lord, let me break it down for someone who has shown his ignorance multiple times over.

A game like Street Fighter uses a wider variety of body types than most fighting games due to the way the characters are built. They're basically "hand crafted" models. A character like Blanka doesn't share any parts with a character like Ryu. Different meshes, different skeletons, etc. The Soul Calibur characters are also built the same way. The Create A Character characters in Soul Calibur however are not built this way. They use a different tool set to be created than the way the default SC are created. This is why the CACs never have the same level of visual fidelity that the default characters do.

Soul Calibur 6's CAC system allows for a wide variety of variation however their character models don't all need to be torn apart in fatalities. MK typically uses a single skeleton and mesh per gender of character so that all the fatality animations will line up properly between every character. The more unique you make the bodies the more you have to manually adjust, tweak, edit, etc, the characters in order to get the fatalities to work properly for every character. This is part of the reason why you don't see more characters like Goro with unique body types in these games. There's usually only 1 or 2 at most characters per MK game with a unique body type for that reason.

People have added all sorts of custom value sliders to games like Skyrim, The Sims 4, etc, that let them alter the characters beyond what the developers intended, however it results in sorts of clipping in terms of clothing and animations due to the character models, meshes, etc, never being designed to extend that way. If you use a custom body type like CBBE or UNP in Skyrim the clothing doesn't change with them, only the naked body. The meshes for the clothing/armor needs to be altered as well.

The MK models are made the way they are, with copy and pasted skeletons/bodies, so that they don't require a ton of extra work when it comes to things like fatalities, which allows the developers to spend more time making more characters, stages, modes, etc.

So, is there anything else you want to say to further highlight that you don't understand how and why not all games made exactly the same way or are you good? Based on previous history you'll no doubt continue to display your ignorrance, but I figured I'd ask.
JARK Jan 30, 2019 @ 8:47pm 
If I am designing a male character for a violent game, I don't think it is necessary that he looks like Marcus Fenix (or any of the Delta Squad from Gears of War).

Designing a female with small boobs isn't censorship. It's called being different -- and taking risks.

Censorship usually refers to someone ELSE telling the creator what to do. So, big boobs in a game being covered with shawls, because of some prickly senator throwing a hissy fit.

"But, what about self-censorship?" What is that, really? Everybody does this anyway, unless you, the reader, are one of those special people with zero social filtering. It's called being self-conscious. We aren't talking about that, though, are we?

"But, but, what about SJWs spewing propaganda to make things favourable for themselves?" What about them? They weren't a thing 5-10 years ago. It takes a generation or more for such things to become so entrenched that institutions and companies kowtow to their will. I don't know if you noticed, but in the gaming community, for every one person spewing "SJW propaganda", there's about 10 people resisting. You won the war before it even started.
souleater Jan 31, 2019 @ 7:41am 
Originally posted by JARK:
If I am designing a male character for a violent game, I don't think it is necessary that he looks like Marcus Fenix (or any of the Delta Squad from Gears of War).

I agree you with that.

Originally posted by JARK:
Designing a female with small boobs isn't censorship. It's called being different -- and taking risks.

I think MK11 too far with this, Sonya looks more like feminine male than masculine female, Skarlet wears armor that is molded with feminine features and he has heavy make up like they want to say "look, this is a woman not a man!". Its not good if character is lacking so much feminine features that you are not sure if it is boy or dude.

I would like wide variety of body types, but I believe Teaspoon had valid point when we were debating body types, using one body type makes developement much easier and faster, especially when this game has detailed fatalities.

Characters I have seen so far has pretty much zero sex appeal from my point of few, I made fun of Skarlet, but at least she is somewhat better looking (...without her helmet that is) than Cassie or Shre...Sonya. It is possible that faces are improved of course and there has been big improvements with those in Injustice 2 I believe, but I am glass half empty kind of guy.

Originally posted by JARK:
Censorship usually refers to someone ELSE telling the creator what to do. So, big boobs in a game being covered with shawls, because of some prickly senator throwing a hissy fit.

"But, what about self-censorship?" What is that, really? Everybody does this anyway, unless you, the reader, are one of those special people with zero social filtering. It's called being self-conscious. We aren't talking about that, though, are we?

"But, but, what about SJWs spewing propaganda to make things favourable for themselves?" What about them? They weren't a thing 5-10 years ago. It takes a generation or more for such things to become so entrenched that institutions and companies kowtow to their will. I don't know if you noticed, but in the gaming community, for every one person spewing "SJW propaganda", there's about 10 people resisting. You won the war before it even started.

Mortal Kombat had feminine big chested females before (even first Mortal Kombat games, those did not have revealing costumes yet though), this is build from ground up to hava as little sex appeal as possible, though its possible that fan service is moved behind paywall to get more profits, but I doubt it, no point to buy revealing outfits if you dont find characters attractive. I am not saying this is necessarily censorship, its possilbe that modern players like their character to look like normal everyday average people, not like Hollywood stars, but I certainly dont like this new direction.

All characters, costumes, customizations, graphics improvements are not shown yet though, so there is hope, but as I said I am glass full empty kind of guy. Am I hyberbole? Of course, this is internet!
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Date Posted: Jan 29, 2019 @ 9:38am
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