Wizardry: Labyrinth of Lost Souls

Wizardry: Labyrinth of Lost Souls

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3201 12 ENE 2020 a las 11:31 p. m.
4
why does it have to be anime? Why? Impostor.
Can't believe they would taint this series with anime. Why??!

A good RPG considers the environment and immersion. Anime is a puerile, pre-teen anathema of disgorged gaming. It utterly destroys and defecates on any mature environment one hopes to create in a classic RPG.

Anime is an insipid manifestation of "woke" postmillennial internet rebel junkies and a blight stain on human intelligence. Anime is one big massive emoticon, an infantile vestigial of creative thought, a callow brain-diaper that belongs in the daycare centers of the internet. It is the 21st century version of the Smurfs. Would you enjoy Wizardry if it took place in Smurf village and you could play as Papa Smurf? I thought not.

Anime to RPG is like Tik Tok to classical theater...one. big. immature. joke. And stop saying that Japan equals Anime, it doesn't, japanese developers make brilliant games. Anime is simply an art-form (one that I hate), and one that has no place in a classic RPG.

Would you like it if you were watching a classical symphony and some stupid teeny bopper invaded the environment, jumped on stage and did a tik-tok jiggy for his brain dead followers, interrupting the orchestra? I thought not.

Anime in any RPG game is an unwanted invasion, a pus-filled infestation that needs to be extinguished.

Anime destroys this game, it takes the great legacy that was once Wizardry and reduces it into a vestigial, purulent speck of garbage. When you are playing a classical RPG game with giant eyeballs, blue hair, neon Gucci pants, white urban shoes, looking like you just got out of your shiny lexus and headed into your 21st century skyscraper slick urban condo while you take selfies and walk at the same time with profane music blasting in your ear-buds, we have some serious issues at hand indeed,

My great hope is that once the post millenial urbanite "tik tok" generation of prepubescent teeny boppers grow up and mature past the baby stage, that Anime will vanish with it, and be nothing more than a fad: a future reminder of a vapid generation of emoticon-"cool"-childish-urban-internet-rebel kiddies.
Última edición por 3201; 21 FEB 2021 a las 9:38 p. m.
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Mostrando 31-45 de 101 comentarios
Mringasa 18 ENE 2020 a las 12:56 p. m. 
I love the new art style. Makes sense in any event as older games can be made more appealing to a new playerbase just by making them more modern. What else are you going to do? Bunch of white lines on a black screen like the originals? That was fine in the 80s, but not now.

Whether you like it or not, anime has an enormous fanbase and not just in Japan. I truly would not be surprised if there were actually more anime fans in America than in Japan, just because of the larger population.

In any event, it looks good and I cannot wait to sit down and delve back into the world again. It seems a good bit different than the Wizardry V I played, Heart of the Maelstrom, on my old computer, but different in this instance seems like better.
Tyler Durden 18 ENE 2020 a las 1:22 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por JosephBas:
At least is not a generic style, and the monsters are awesome as always, in fact Japanese company "ASCII" gave Wizardry an identity before Bane of the Cosmic Forge did, those cool monster designs and iconic theme songs that only appeared in the console ports and the original Japanese games like the Gaiden series.

BTW, this Wizardry OVA is one of the most cool things in the world:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOTHNoODYmY

One of my favourite anime of all time. It's so faithful to the game, right down to the ribbon and the spells. A true masterpiece.
OldGameHermit 18 ENE 2020 a las 3:07 p. m. 
Well, Wizardry is now owned by a Japanese game developer. So, they made it look how they wanted. To be fair, "classic" Wizardry, such as this never had an art style. I suppose you could look to the original instruction manuals. But those featured hand-drawn cartoons that looked like something out of the Sunday Funny Papers.
Admittedly Wizardry 6-8 had a very Western-style D&D look to them. But these games are more like the original 5 games than the later releases.

Scan from the original manual were included in the archives release, see below.

https://www.mocagh.org/sir-tech/wiz1-manual-alt.pdf
Última edición por OldGameHermit; 18 ENE 2020 a las 3:13 p. m.
DivineLion 18 ENE 2020 a las 4:49 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por mcnichoj:
How dare Japanese people make a Japanese aesthetic style game. :balloonicorn:
lmao true
Thorley23 18 ENE 2020 a las 5:56 p. m. 
I will also point out that the Japanese art style used for Anime and Manga is much easier to draw than western style art by a substantial margin. This isn't a knock against it, it's simply a fact, and it's one of the big reasons why you see so much eastern style art popping up internationally, drawn by people who are not remotely Asian, and across a wide variety of mediums. If you hate the art style your going to have increasing problems as I expect it will proliferate even more in the following decades, and I've found a number of those among the millennial+ generations who actually aren't even all that familiar with other styles of art as it's become so common online. I for example showed a couple of kids some western comics (which is a dying art) and they were kind of amazed, especially by some of the older stuff drawn by guys like Jack Kirby as it was new and exotic to them since they were getting bombarded by the eastern stuff almost non-stop online.

At any rate, everything people here said is more or less true about where this series has gone and how it's owned by a Japanese company, and how the art style makes sense. That said given that it's using so much 2D artwork even if it was developed by a western company it is likely the artwork would still have a very eastern vibe to it, because that's what increasing numbers of artists around the world do now in a general sense as it is so much easier. If you look on STEAM alone, notice how many anime-looking games there are that have nothing to do with any kind of asian development at all.

Also before anyone thinks this is some kind of not so subtle knock on Asian artists and an attempt to slam Asian art, understand I am an old guy and I have some familiarity of things like Anime even before the boom in the 1990s when it started to become popular. There was a period for a while when Western comics were MUCH bigger than Eastern ones in terms of the money to be made (the opposite is true now, with Manga outselling Western comics for a lot of reasons, a lot of them sadly political). Growing up and following a lot of geeky stuff I saw a lot of artists who were "big in Japan" try and break into comics and such and fail utterly because they could not duplicate the western art style. Indeed this was one of the many things that made "they're big in Japan" a meme before there was such a thing, as it involved everthing from art, to porn, to most commonly associated with the joke, music. Conversely a lot of western artists could easily do the "Anime Style" but were generally met with xenophobia when they tried overseas (some tried under pseudonyms with mixed results apparently) and of course for a long time the money was just not there as the market was exactly the opposite of what it is now.

Some artists like Jim Lee became particularly famous for a while due to being able to do both styles, and using elements of both in their work. Jim Lee even started his own comics company called "Wildstorm" (later bought out by DC), and his work was popular enough that you even had his WILDCATS team competing favorably for cartoon audience against the much better established X-men. His talent and ability to do this, and do it well, is one of the reasons he's a legendary artist.

At any rate another advantage of the anime style is not just the ease, but that this relative ease also makes it easy to mass produce even when fairly detailed. Let's just say it was noticed globally when things like "Dragonball Z" became international successes using low grade, easily mass produced artwork that could get away with this because it was so heavily stylized. That's not a knock on the artist (who can do very good stuff) just a point about why hyper-stylized asian art became so popular. Basically you can produce a lot more stuff in that style, usually cheaper, in far less time, than you can using western art, and since more artists can
do it, they don't demand as high a rate on average. I mean if you search the internet you can find high school kids producing professional level anime art work, and it seems like there are people taking comissions in that style crawling out of the woodwork everywhere. Going to a comic con, you can typically find guys dropping anime prints of their stuff for like $5-$10 where the more western style artists can demand two or three times that much as they have to put more into it.... from a business perspective, in a disposable consumer culture, the eastern art is winning out in a big way. In maybe 20 years I think even in the US and Europe it will be the dominant art style for business. Also for the record in 20 years I think Manga will still be going strong, but Western comics will be dead, although many of the characters birthed that way will likely still exist in various forms of media.

Halfshell 18 ENE 2020 a las 6:13 p. m. 
Wonder if the people complaining about "anime" would also be complaining if it wasn't localized at all. If it bothers you, just disable voices. I did, although because some of the voice actors are just bad: like F Dwarf.
Captain n00by 20 ENE 2020 a las 2:09 p. m. 
It's what kids like today so they make what's popular.

Publicado originalmente por COINCELPRO:
it's the superior art style, though

lol
Sarina 21 ENE 2020 a las 11:05 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por 3201:
Can't believe they would taint this series with anime. Pathetic. What a joke!

This is exactly how it was in Wizardry Online. the job classes and races are the same, the character artwork looks the same. Also spells and potions don't have gibberish names like in the previous games.
theNightStar 21 ENE 2020 a las 11:55 a. m. 
Publicado originalmente por Lenfer:
wizardry made for soyboy. totaly destroy the wizardry ambiance , i cant even name it a wizardry , game is so blend ,i definitly dont call that superior art style , Barbie is more detailed than that.

"soyboy?" Oh, for the love of christ. Grow up, little child. You DO realize that by using that idiotic sounding word unironically, in any way, the only thing you accomplish is making yourself sound like a worthless, ignorant, and pathetic loser, right?
Seriously at this point, that's the kind of laughably stupid word that only a mentally damaged, ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ little pre-teen 8 year old thinks means anything in a legitimate conversation.

And when it comes to the original poster, why are any of us even trying to give answers to this garbage post? Why does anyone care about the ignorant and worthless opinions of someone that clearly sounds like a stupid child throwing a trolling, whiny tantrum for childish attention seeking about the one thing in the world that couldn't possibly matter LESS?

This was nothing but a garbage troll post made by a tiny little mentally inferior child, so why are people feeding it and even contributing to this garbage, idiotic thread like it's an actual conversation worth having?
Raybon256 11 FEB 2020 a las 3:47 p. m. 
I don't really hate anime per se, because I like cute anime girl/pretty anime ladies and I do like me some RPG heroines (who doesn't). How a game looks *does* have some influence on how people (including myself) choose to play a game, but in the end, it's the gameplay that makes a game. You need more than a pretty girl face on something to get me buy a product.

There was a game I bought 20 years ago called Darkened Skye that had a gorgeous short red-head sorceress on it, but the 40 dollar price tag and my budget deterred me from buying it. When it went on sale for half price I decided to but it and I was in for a good time. It wasn't the best game ever and had some issues (and it's a game about Skittles) but I still enjoyed it.

On the other hand, games that are just generic fanservice for the sake of fanservice (like say Sakura Dungeon) I find kind of base and I feel appeals to the lowest common denominator, it puts me off. I want to pay a game, not have generic anime tropes/catgirls/whatever shoved into my face.

On the other side of the fence, you have to have something that makes your gameplay more palatable. Wizardy 1 is boring as hell: One music track for dungeons, one music track for battles (other than WERDNA), every single wall looks the same throughout the entire dungon. Half the dungeon isn't even relevant once you can just take an elevator down from the Blue Ribbon gang to the Contra Dextra chute to Silence/Tiltowait/Mahaman-Teleport WERDNA. This is what made Final Fantasy such a hit. Older RPGs only appeal to a very narrow range of Stat Nerds, and now its gotten mainstream over the course off the 25 years I have been playing RPGs since I was introduced to them since Final Fantasy II for the Super Nintendo.

What puts ME off the game isn't the anime it's the fact that each Wizardry (most of them) doesn't do anything that the previous installments didn't do. When I see a new Final Fantasy or Dragon Warrior I can immediately recongize each one I've played. LoLS is Class of Heroes without any of the charm Class of Heroes had. LoLS has the same five races and the same eight classes the original wizardry had (Class of Heroes also had Fairies, Anime Cats, Humaniod Dragons, Half-Angels and Half-Demons. Gnomes were actually Astral Projections with low HP. There were Monks/Psionicists (thing Samurai/Mage or Lord/Priest), Rangers, Summoners and the Lord and Ninja classes where split into male/female variations. My biggest issue with Class of Heroes, however (outside the copy/paste Maps) is the fact they dumbed the spells down. Class of Heroes has a Fire/Earth/Air/Water/Light/Dark system which means over half the spells the Wizard gets have been replaced by generic nukes where the only real difference is single target/group/all enemies, and Cleric/Priest gets Shine and is a heal bot; older Wizardries and DnD priests had more going for them.

In short, looks don't make a game, but in order for it to be a game it has to me more than just blocks of statistics. Because if it's just a block of stats than it's more of a job than a game and if I wanted to do a job, I would get a job and get paid for it.
3201 18 MAR 2020 a las 6:27 p. m. 
anime is terrible. it has no place in classic RPG.
Shiroi Ren 18 MAR 2020 a las 8:07 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por 3201:
anime is terrible. it has no place in classic RPG.
Well, considering this title survived because of Japanese market is kind of preposterous. :-)
Última edición por Shiroi Ren; 18 MAR 2020 a las 8:07 p. m.
MacDKnife 2 ABR 2020 a las 9:12 a. m. 
As an old time player since SirTech introduced the game for the earliest PC's (an Apple IIE in my case) in 1981-82, I have to agree with 3201 above. Anime is way too cartoonish for my tastes - look too much like the big eyed children (painted on velvet??) that were popular in certain circles 20-30 years ago. Yuk....
Shiroi Ren 2 ABR 2020 a las 2:20 p. m. 
Publicado originalmente por MacDKnife:
As an old time player since SirTech introduced the game for the earliest PC's (an Apple IIE in my case) in 1981-82, I have to agree with 3201 above. Anime is way too cartoonish for my tastes - look too much like the big eyed children (painted on velvet??) that were popular in certain circles 20-30 years ago. Yuk....
Well, I kind of understand it but the Western audience just hadn't support it enough and title survived only in Japan and S.Korea as far as I understand. Those changes are partially fault of franchise fans to some degree as well after all.
3201 6 ABR 2020 a las 10:08 a. m. 
Anime has nothing to do with classic RPG, it is an abomination.
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