DLC Logic [SPOILERS]

[Gryfer]

I'm wondering if I'm the only one completely offput by the logic in the DLC part 2.

The answer for "what is the sequence of who had the real gun?" is:
- AD
- Andy
- Logan
- Andy

It's really easy to backtrack that Andy ended up with the real gun. He shot Big D at the end and Big D is really dead, so Andy had the real gun.

It's also easy to determine Logan had the real gun prior to Andy. Andy picked up the gun on the floor that Logan left after being "strangled" by Dylan. Thus, Logan had the gun that Andy used to kill Big D, inferring Logan had the real gun prior to Andy.

But prior to that, I struggle to figure how you could determine Andy had it prior to Logan. Andy visits the first locker (I'll call it Locker 1), then Bill tells Andy to use Locker 3. So in order for the answer to work, Andy has to open Locker 1, put the gun down in there, then immediately switch over and start using Locker 3? Who would do that? Who puts their stuff in different lockers like that? The way I interpreted that scene was that Andy tried Locker 1 and found it locked, so Bill recommended he use Locker 3 instead and then placed his stuff there. It's just alien to me to think that in the 1-2 seconds Andy interacted with Locker 1 he decided to drop off the gun (and only the gun!) in that locker and then switch over to Locker 3.

I think the counterargument is that you should look at it from the other direction because the AD says he was focused on giving Andy his gun and forgot about giving one to Bill. The implication is that the AD was "distracted" because the gun he gave to Andy is the real gun. By virtue of giving Andy the real gun, it would obviously only be AD > Andy > Logan > Andy. But that didn't feel intuitive to me. It's too "Chekhov's Gun" if you'll forgive the unintentional parallel. And it just can't overcome how strange I think Andy's behavior is here: Open locker, drop off gun, close locker, move two lockers over, use second locker for everything else. That is so unnatural in my opinion.

On a related note, the AD's motivation to kill someone doesn't make any sense to me unless it's related to the main plot. Unfortunately, I'm playing the DLC nearly a year after I completed the main game, so I can't recall. So although it was clear that the AD's ex died under suspicious circumstances, nothing tied that to Big D (as far as I can tell) so that he would sneak a real gun to the character who would "fake" shoot him.

Two questions:
[1] Am I the only one who was confused about Andy's 1-second interaction with Locker 1?
[2] Is there more to the AD's motivation I didn't pick up on?

[Lau]

I just finished this one a few moments ago and I definitely struggled. Going backwards, Andy and Logan were very easy to trace. I then managed to trace it back to Andy once more because after a long long while of not being able to find any owner prior to Logan, I obsessively tracked his movements and saw him get something from that other locker. I then tracked the interactions the others had with it and found Andy was the only other person to interact with it and figured it must have been him. Then it took me another bit to piece out that the AD gave it to him, but that was quite clear.

That being said, I certainly don't get the AD's motivation (assuming it's his doing out of personal reasons) and I also struggle to see how this could've been planned by him or whoever, since so much had to be "improvised" in the scenes. Even if Andy was instructed to place the gun in that particular locker, Logan would have had to be previously told to retrieve it from there, but the whole thing where Dylan tells him to leave it on the floor and Andy later picking it up was all on the spot. I can't see the AD being THAT calculating and having thought of all of those possibilities in advance. And also everything working out that smoothly.

But then again, this confused me as much as it did you, so there may well be something I've missed.

[Gryfer]

Glad I'm not the only one -- and a scroll through the other discussions shows other people confused with the AD's motivation here.

Originally posted by Lau:

Andy was the only other person to interact with it and figured it must have been him.

That's how I ultimately figured it out, but even after I wrote the answer down (AD > Andy > Logan > Andy), I didn't even bother putting it in because I assumed the real answer was AD > Andy > ? > Logan > Andy. I was just **absolutely convinced** there was no possibility of Andy acting like a complete alien and leaving his gun in a separate locker from the rest of his stuff. So I ended up watching Andy's entire track and thinking maybe Bill stole it instead (even though it's obvious Andy gets the gun from the floor), but then I could never trace something back from Bill to Andy, so I was stumped. I ended up throwing in my "incomplete" answer out of pure frustration thinking that there was nothing else that would work and was legitimately stunned to see it was "correct."

Originally posted by Lau:

I also struggle to see how this could've been planned by him or whoever, since so much had to be "improvised" in the scenes.

If all went according to plan and everyone had been given a prop gun (or, in Andy's case, the real gun), it wouldn't have been an issue. But the moment the AD tells Bill to get Andy's gun, he's sentencing someone to death that he can't foresee because the AD *shouldn't* know that the gun in Locker 3 is fake. Or if he does know that the gun in Locker 3 is fake, the AD is omnipotent. It's just wild.

[Maxine Caufield]

The new DLC explains that the female vice director (the missing girlfriend) killed by D and Liu Dawei .
That D is the same person of this big D. This is why the AD murdered big D.

[Maxine Caufield]

My view on the logic of guns:

First of all, Andy and the AD are likely to be a group. The AD gave him a real gun and a fake gun.

In the reality show script, the director designed the exchange of two pistols, so the AD designed a second pistol exchange in order to finally let Andy get the real gun.

At the beginning, Andy secretly changed Logan's fake gun into a real gun in Locker 1, and then put his fake gun in Locker 3.

The AD didn't give the gun to john,so Bill took away the fake gun in Locker 3 and gave it to john, and the real gun in Locker 1 was thrown to the ground after being taken away by Logan. Finally, Andy picked it up and shot...

If the director didn't designed the exchange of two guns in the script,this story will be much simpler.

The AD planned all this, found the murderer big D, found Andy to act and kill, found a retired real gun, used the director's play, all for revenge for his girlfriend's dies.
And afterwards, he can explain it as an accident like failure of the props group, to escape the charge of murder.

And Andy, he may not be a good actor, but a good killer.It's truly incredibleXD

Due to the language barrier, it's hard for me to explain to you. I'm sorry.

[Kynan Wolf]

Originally posted by 多莉丝米勒:

My view on the logic of guns:

First of all, Andy and the AD are likely to be a group. The AD gave him a real gun and a fake gun.

In the reality show script, the director designed the exchange of two pistols, so the AD designed a second pistol exchange in order to finally let Andy get the real gun.

At the beginning, Andy secretly changed Logan's fake gun into a real gun in Locker 1, and then put his fake gun in Locker 3.

The AD didn't give the gun to john,so Bill took away the fake gun in Locker 3 and gave it to john, and the real gun in Locker 1 was thrown to the ground after being taken away by Logan. Finally, Andy picked it up and shot...

If the director didn't designed the exchange of two guns in the script,this story will be much simpler.

The AD planned all this, found the murderer big D, found Andy to act and kill, found a retired real gun, used the director's play, all for revenge for his girlfriend's dies.
And afterwards, he can explain it as an accident like failure of the props group, to escape the charge of murder.

And Andy, he may not be a good actor, but a good killer.It's truly incredibleXD

Due to the language barrier, it's hard for me to explain to you. I'm sorry.

Thank you sooo much for this explanation! Just finished Lethal Script and was super confused about what the deal was with AD. I'm assuming the other commenters here are like me and we unfortunately can't play the other DLC due to the language barrier. Appreciate the bit of extra info about the other DLC.

[mudjoe2]

Originally posted by 多莉丝米勒:

My view on the logic of guns:

First of all, Andy and the AD are likely to be a group. The AD gave him a real gun and a fake gun.

In the reality show script, the director designed the exchange of two pistols, so the AD designed a second pistol exchange in order to finally let Andy get the real gun.

At the beginning, Andy secretly changed Logan's fake gun into a real gun in Locker 1, and then put his fake gun in Locker 3.

The AD didn't give the gun to john,so Bill took away the fake gun in Locker 3 and gave it to john, and the real gun in Locker 1 was thrown to the ground after being taken away by Logan. Finally, Andy picked it up and shot...

If the director didn't designed the exchange of two guns in the script,this story will be much simpler.

The AD planned all this, found the murderer big D, found Andy to act and kill, found a retired real gun, used the director's play, all for revenge for his girlfriend's dies.
And afterwards, he can explain it as an accident like failure of the props group, to escape the charge of murder.

And Andy, he may not be a good actor, but a good killer.It's truly incredibleXD

Due to the language barrier, it's hard for me to explain to you. I'm sorry.

I agree with all of this - the part that makes everything make sense is when you realize Andy must have been secretly given two guns at the start by the AD - not only one prop gun

[mooglemania]

I actually think it's possible that Big D was NOT the intended target, though I'm pretty sure that the AD rigged it too. But due to the mixup with the guns, it's also possible that Andy wasn't the intended recipient of the loaded gun, and that Big D was never supposed to be shot.

The AD put 2 guns in the locker room. The one Andy eventually used on Big D, but also the one that Bill took out. Someone was always supposed to take both guns. In fact, 5 people were supposed to be using guns, and at least 2 of them were supposed to be getting them from the locker room.

Big D had his all along, and so did Dylan, right? So the other three were supposed to be shared between Logan, John, and Andy. So it's kind of possible that someone else was supposed to be shot, but due to the changes in the lineup, Big D got shot instead.

it's definitely hinted that the AD's ex is the reason for the shooting, but we don't really get enough info to determine who was involved in her disappearance or how that happened, so we can't know for sure it involved Big D. It's possible he was the target all along, but considering 2 other people could've just as easily had this gun, and a bunch of last minute changes were made, there's definitely a chance he was not the real target.

[SpaceWitch]

I'm three years late but I just finished the DLC and was so confused that I had to look it up and found this thread.

I think we're missing a piece of information here because otherwise, it doesn't make sense why Andy would swap his and Logan's guns in the lockers.

If AD had given the gun to Bill like he was supposed to, it would still have ended up shooting Big D. through Bill > May > John. Because he gave the gun to Andy, Bill had to go and fetch the gun from Andy's locker which just adds an extra step to the Bill > May > John chain of the real gun owners. However, at this point, Andy had swapped the real gun with Logan's fake gun in the lockers without any reason or explanation. Even if he had secret instructions to swap, why would anyone give him those instructions if the result was going to be the same (with the only small difference being who pulled the trigger)?

[Stickman]

Originally posted by SpaceWitch:

I'm three years late but I just finished the DLC and was so confused that I had to look it up and found this thread.

I think we're missing a piece of information here because otherwise, it doesn't make sense why Andy would swap his and Logan's guns in the lockers.

If AD had given the gun to Bill like he was supposed to, it would still have ended up shooting Big D. through Bill > May > John. Because he gave the gun to Andy, Bill had to go and fetch the gun from Andy's locker which just adds an extra step to the Bill > May > John chain of the real gun owners. However, at this point, Andy had swapped the real gun with Logan's fake gun in the lockers without any reason or explanation. Even if he had secret instructions to swap, why would anyone give him those instructions if the result was going to be the same (with the only small difference being who pulled the trigger)?

I occasonally check discussions for this game because I really liked it. I've seen and participated in silmiliar discussion abot guns here: https://steamcommunity.com/app/942970/discussions/0/4512129484685441450/#c4512129903359071958 you can check the tread for some extra details

I thnk that initial plan didn't need any gun swaps. It was very simple:

1. Andy brings real gun to the set
   
2. Andy puts real gun into his locker
   
3. Real guns just here waiting for finale. It minimizes the risks - nobody runs around with it, nobody points it at people, nobody tries to grab it a fight
   
4. For the finale Andy grabs the gun, goes to Big D and shoots him

Andy doesn't even need to know that his gun is real, that he is supposed to shoot Big D for real. Initial plan can be executed by AD alone.

But actor playing Andy was a rookie, it's stated in the Director-AD dialohue. We can also see how he makes mistakes under pressure, just watch him run in the finale - runs in wrong direction, overshoots the exit, mistimes his "heroic" jump.

So swap was a honest human mister of the actor plating Andy. There was a fake gun inside Logan's locker from the begining. It makes sense inside the script - Logan owns a gun, he shot Big D after a failed deal. Logan also goes straight to his locker after hearing details about him shooting Big D and there is no line like "Oh my, where did this gun come from, that convinient", he just grabs it and goes to shoot/treaten Vincent and Lisa.

And the whole swap went like this:

1. Andy opens the wrong (Logan's) locker, a simple human mistake for a stressed rookie actor
   
2. Andy sees a gun in here, that's unexpected
   
3. Andy is confused, but goes with the script, he puts real gun into Logan's locker. Due to the way whole setup works, he can't call out "Oh, there is a gun here, let's figure it out and shoot this whole thing again". So he goes for an action closest to the script - put his gun inside a locker. You can hear the sound of this gun clanking.
   
4. There are now two guns inside Logan's locker, fake and real
   
5. Bill calls out Andy's mistake - wrong locker
   
6. Andy realizes and tries to correct it quickly and discretely. He is still confused and even more stressed so he makes another mistake - he grabs the wrong gun - Logan's fake gun. He doen't calls out to this
   
7. Andy puts fake gun in his locker

[SpaceWitch]

Originally posted by Stickman:

Originally posted by SpaceWitch:

I'm three years late but I just finished the DLC and was so confused that I had to look it up and found this thread.

I think we're missing a piece of information here because otherwise, it doesn't make sense why Andy would swap his and Logan's guns in the lockers.

If AD had given the gun to Bill like he was supposed to, it would still have ended up shooting Big D. through Bill > May > John. Because he gave the gun to Andy, Bill had to go and fetch the gun from Andy's locker which just adds an extra step to the Bill > May > John chain of the real gun owners. However, at this point, Andy had swapped the real gun with Logan's fake gun in the lockers without any reason or explanation. Even if he had secret instructions to swap, why would anyone give him those instructions if the result was going to be the same (with the only small difference being who pulled the trigger)?

I occasonally check discussions for this game because I really liked it. I've seen and participated in silmiliar discussion abot guns here: https://steamcommunity.com/app/942970/discussions/0/4512129484685441450/#c4512129903359071958 you can check the tread for some extra details

I thnk that initial plan didn't need any gun swaps. It was very simple:

1. Andy brings real gun to the set
   
2. Andy puts real gun into his locker
   
3. Real guns just here waiting for finale. It minimizes the risks - nobody runs around with it, nobody points it at people, nobody tries to grab it a fight
   
4. For the finale Andy grabs the gun, goes to Big D and shoots him

Andy doesn't even need to know that his gun is real, that he is supposed to shoot Big D for real. Initial plan can be executed by AD alone.

But actor playing Andy was a rookie, it's stated in the Director-AD dialohue. We can also see how he makes mistakes under pressure, just watch him run in the finale - runs in wrong direction, overshoots the exit, mistimes his "heroic" jump.

So swap was a honest human mister of the actor plating Andy. There was a fake gun inside Logan's locker from the begining. It makes sense inside the script - Logan owns a gun, he shot Big D after a failed deal. Logan also goes straight to his locker after hearing details about him shooting Big D and there is no line like "Oh my, where did this gun come from, that convinient", he just grabs it and goes to shoot/treaten Vincent and Lisa.

And the whole swap went like this:

1. Andy opens the wrong (Logan's) locker, a simple human mistake for a stressed rookie actor
   
2. Andy sees a gun in here, that's unexpected
   
3. Andy is confused, but goes with the script, he puts real gun into Logan's locker. Due to the way whole setup works, he can't call out "Oh, there is a gun here, let's figure it out and shoot this whole thing again". So he goes for an action closest to the script - put his gun inside a locker. You can hear the sound of this gun clanking.
   
4. There are now two guns inside Logan's locker, fake and real
   
5. Bill calls out Andy's mistake - wrong locker
   
6. Andy realizes and tries to correct it quickly and discretely. He is still confused and even more stressed so he makes another mistake - he grabs the wrong gun - Logan's fake gun. He doen't calls out to this
   
7. Andy puts fake gun in his locker

Thank you for explaining, it does make sense that Andy would panic and and make sense within the logic of the story. I still think it was hard to deduce this out without any direct clues, it would have helped if Andy hinted at this, for example, in a monologue while he was alone in the toilet (this would also be a nice pay off for listening to that room's recording which was pretty useless otherwise). Thanks again!

[Fien]

It's confusing, that's for sure. I love it when a game makes me still figure out things afterwards. But it can't have happened like that. Fact: We hear Andy open Logan's locker, put something in it and close the locker BEFORE Bill tells him to use locker 3. It all happens very fast too, in just one second, so Andy must know what he's doing. My take on the gun issue is: Andy has 2 guns from the start. The AD tells Andy to put one of them in Logan's locker. Probably with the excuse that he forgot to do it himself. It doesn't matter which gun bc either John or Andy will shoot Big D. The AD gets nervous when John enters the scene, a sure sign that he doesn't know if John has the real gun. He must have planned all of this in advance, including the lie that he "forgot" to give Bill his gun and the solution to this "problem". Now both guns have been handled by several people and the AD won't be the obvious culprit, which he would have been if he'd put the real gun in Logan's locker himself without involving rookie Andy.

[Peach Rose 1985]

I feel AD's original plan was for John to shoot Big D, not Andy.
I think AD intentionally forgot to give John a gun. The easiest way to sneak the real gun on set was through Andy, who is established not to be the most astute person. That way, when John is missing a gun, the scene could play out as is, and in that scenario, John would have ended up with the real gun. The fact that John says, “Wait. This is fa—” led me to believe John was expecting it to be real.
What AD didn’t plan was Andy screwing up and accidentally going to the wrong locker first. That’s how the guns got swapped and Logan ended up with it. But Andy shooting Big D panned out as well, as Andy could feign plausible deniability.

I just don’t think AD would have trusted Andy to work with him, only to use him as a pawn.

[stanstanstan]

Originally posted by Peach Rose 1985:

I feel AD's original plan was for John to shoot Big D, not Andy.
I think AD intentionally forgot to give John a gun. The easiest way to sneak the real gun on set was through Andy, who is established not to be the most astute person. That way, when John is missing a gun, the scene could play out as is, and in that scenario, John would have ended up with the real gun. The fact that John says, “Wait. This is fa—” led me to believe John was expecting it to be real.
What AD didn’t plan was Andy screwing up and accidentally going to the wrong locker first. That’s how the guns got swapped and Logan ended up with it. But Andy shooting Big D panned out as well, as Andy could feign plausible deniability.

I just don’t think AD would have trusted Andy to work with him, only to use him as a pawn.

Out of all of the responses here, this one feels the most like what the developers probably actually intended to me. It actually makes sense with all of the setup and comments. All of the other suggestions require ignoring some of the details we get and if there is anything this game does, it is to make sure everything you hear matters in some way.