AoE III: DE total number of civs prediction

[James3157]

Considering how long it is taking for this new dlc to come out, complex tech trees (especially for Hausa and Ethiopians which could potentially include other civs besides just Hausa and Ethiopians such as Hausa for example can include allies such as Moroccans, Berbers, and etc... ), and the basegame alone has 16 civs (8 from original, plus six from expansion packs, and two added for free to Definitive Edition) I am predicting that probably AoE III: DE is not going to have more than 32 civs at most. This is of course assuming that Forgotten Empires can somehow come up with 8 more civs to be added into this game after Danes and Polish and you also need to combine this with the fact that apparently even civs locked behind dlc have limited time events for unlocking new explorer skins as well. If Forgotten Empire were to eventually have more than 32 civilizations that possibly could mean more than half of them are not going to be basegame, but the complex tech tree and perhaps revolutionary civs (such as Canadians for example who already have a historical battle despite not being an actual civ on this game just like the Barbary Pirates and Moroccans) have to be taken into an account as well.

[James3157]

It is worth mentioning that I cannot rule out Canadians entirely, but them being added eventually does not seem likely where they would need to somehow stand out as being different from the British, French, and United States. Persians and Omani have been frequently mentioned as well; although, mamelukes (which originally were a unique unit for Saracens on AoE II: DE) are already included on this game as well meaning they would not be a unique unit for either Persians or Omani. Also worth mentioning as well that if Persians were to ever get added officially to this game they would need to specifically stand out somehow as being different from the Indians who uses various different types of elephants. Another problem as well as to why there might never be more than 32 civs at most is not only because of the complex tech tree but also because AoE III: DE time period is much shorter than AoE II: DE and it seems like it was originally intended for each civilization to be very different from each other on this game contrary to AoE II: DE because of the complex tech tree and having so many unique units for each civ.

[Primhose]

Originally posted by James3157:

...although, mamelukes (which originally were a unique unit for Saracens on AoE : DE) are already included on this game as well meaning they would not be a unique unit for either Persians or Omani....

Age Conquistadores belong to Jesuits rather than Spanish, and there are plenty of cases, e.g., French "Ancien Regime" or German "Prince-Electors," where a unit that doesn't "belong" to a civilization can be obtained by that particular country elsewise.

Also look at cases like Inca & Quechua (where they had to change some names and stats around to turn the native settlement into a full civ., while retaining the native settlement).

[James3157]

Originally posted by Primhose:

Age :AoE3DE: Conquistadores belong to Jesuits rather than Spanish, and there are plenty of cases, e.g., French "Ancien Regime" or German "Prince-Electors," where a unit that doesn't "belong" to a civilization can be obtained by that particular country elsewise.

Also look at cases like Inca & Quechua (where they had to change some names and stats around to turn the native settlement into a full civ., while retaining the native settlement).

My point is that even if Forgotten Empires could have the maximum number of civilizations at 32 it would be a stretch to have that many considering half of them would be locked behind dlc at that point and this might also help explain why the dlc for Danish and Polish is slow to come out for 2024. Also, would the tech tree have to be reworked if Persians/Omani were to added to AoE III: DE? A number of problems might get in the way the more civilizations Forgotten Empires adds to this game. I already mentioned Omani and Persians as possible new civs for adding (although, I am not sure what they would have for buildings, tech tree, and units) which Asian (three) and African (two) civs are overall severely lacking on AoE III: DE which eventually at some point Forgotten Empires might have to add more African, Asian, and/or Native American civs as well that specifically stand out as being unique enough to be added officially to this game.

[James3157]

Other civilizations for possibly adding in the future besides Omani and Persians are Brazilians which became independent 1822 and Argentinians who became independent 1816 and only slightly later than when Mexico became independent assuming they get recognized as official civs on this game instead of revolutionary civs which the United States and Mexicans used to be considered revolutionary civs as well at one point before they were officially added to this game. So that makes four out of eight civs for possibly adding in the future for dlc, but then there comes the hard part as well when it comes to determining units, tech tree, and buildings. As for the other four two them could potentially be based on Africa (but probably not based on any civ that can be allied to Hausa or Ethiopia when aging up), but not sure about the last remaining two and the other two I mentioned may not even be based on Africa. The biggest problem with Africa is apparently not very many of them actually had empires during the AoE III: DE time period besides civs allied to Hausa when aging up, because of European colonization for much of Africa.

[Primhose]

They could also maybe expand Revolutions, as well as giving us AI personalities such as Simon Bolivar....

[James3157]

Originally posted by Primhose:

They could also maybe expand Revolutions, as well as giving us AI personalities such as Simon Bolivar....

Simon Bolivar might be an interesting personality, but Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, Panama, and Bolivia who helped gain independence from Spain are all small countries as well. Reason why I did not mention any of those countries. Argentina had a fight for independence and civil wars with their leader maybe could be José de San Martín. Brazil's history is a bit more complicated because it became independent apparently from tensions in Portugal instead of Brazil from the Liberal Revolution of 1820. I would love to see Brazil added officially to this game, but I am not sure how or when they ever will get added. Even if they were to have a leader personality (probably Pedro II from 1831-1889) I am not sure what they would have for a historical battle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Revolution_of_1820

[James3157]

I was not sure what they would have for a historical battle originally, but there was apparently a Brazilian War of Independence from 1822-1825 that ultimately resulted in Brazilians being finally recognized by Portugal as being independent. They were independent starting 1822, but it took until 1825 when Portugal finally recognized them as being independent as well. This means it is entirely possible that Brazil could have a historical battle plus a leader personality (Pedro II) in addition to Argentina as mentioned earlier. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_War_of_Independence

[James3157]

I am predicting our next dlc for 2025 is probably going to be either Brazil and Argentina (because their history is well known for how they got independence which required war during this time period) or Persians and Omani, but like I said earlier I am not sure what the other four civilizations would be assuming that 32 civs is going to be maximum amount on AoE III: DE.

[Primhose]

Originally posted by James3157:

Simon Bolivar might be an interesting personality, but Colombia, Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru, Panama, and Bolivia who helped gain independence from Spain are all small countries as well....

Sorry, what I meant was,
Simon Bolivar (plus maybe middle-eastern and eastern-European counterparts) would be an AI personality who starts as one of the standard civilizations, but is (nearly) guaranteed to revolt to one of the appropriate nations.

This isn't to say they should never go for new main civ's, but that this would be something that works with the existing content.

[James3157]

Originally posted by Primhose:

Sorry, what I meant was,
Simon Bolivar (plus maybe middle-eastern and eastern-European counterparts) would be an AI personality who starts as one of the standard civilizations, but is (nearly) guaranteed to revolt to one of the appropriate nations.

This isn't to say they should never go for new main civ's, but that this would be something that works with the existing content.

From a more realistic approach in adding more official civs Brazil, Argentina, Persians, and Omani definitely make perfect sense, but you are correct on your last sentence. Even though there is enough information online about these countries/empires during this time period (which were the four I mentioned earlier) where they could be added officially to AoE III: DE the complex tech tree does complicate things as well.