No your builds suck and you're not good at the game

[Prince Ian]

You guys need to stop thinking that you're better than you actually are. If you're not sniping, tanking or healing then you're USELESS. I don't care about your worthless mom belgian build, your shotgun and smg build. Your run speed build, its all useless on no hope with real players. Get with the program and build a deck that works.

[Bullied by Pigeon]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SaiJaku Kami | Chino:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Tevron:

doc is a must on your team is the most overrated statement in the community. They're many alternatives to heal. Coppers decks for toolkit room heals, team upgrades, melee builds, amped up, buckshot brusier etc. It's good to have doc on your team, but it's not the end of the world if there isn't.

well if it is NM or below, then it really doesn't need with randoms, but it comes in NH, the number of riddens, damage of them, the trauma damage of them are very high which melee builds or buckshot bruiser can't help a lot if there are too many in the surrounding, not to say copper is very limited in NH.

your mele build probably sucks then.. i have no issues with mele medic in nohope carrying newplayers everyday... try changing stuff around . there are multiple ways to make your own deck that suits your playstyle dont complain about difficulty there is a counter to everythign in this game.

[TsarFlow]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SaiJaku Kami | Chino:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von TsarFlow:

Healer is a must ? No. That's a waste and a lose of DPS. Having just EMT and Med Professionnal is far enough on one only.
High DPS is a must ? Yes. On all 4.
Having economy is a must ? Yes. On all 4 (2 Scavenger, the rest MG and LP).

Everyone should be a crowd killer and high DPS. Learn to dodge attacks and go forward. Ez NM and NH.

There is no point in Doc to be a crowd killer if there is a super efficient crowd killer (melee) exist or (and) semi crowd killer (goes for support) if the whole team not running speed cards, simply just aiming head to kill small numbers riddens behind is enough to do, but doc with both amp and on your mark can help the team keep longer survivability. Well it is quite hard for dodging attacks due to the ping and ridden slow resistance debuff unless your whole team equipped speed cards.

Then switch the doc for something else or keep it but then you can still use some dmg/eco cards. I can agree that with randoms on NH it's hard but if people get hit too easily it doesn't mean healing is a need, it means they should train about doding before. As I said, having Run Like Hell is far enough to dodge the specials if they attack or even run away from riddens by climbing cars/trucks. You can still take the cards you mentioned, if it gives comfort to you, but don't forget eco and damage as well. A doc who cannot kill anything is a dead doc, even by shooting heads she can get overcrowded easily.

I get that the server lags get the game WAY harder it should me, it's even a corruption card now. Yet, if you're used to "how" the server lags, you can dodge everything. I'm not a "speed card" addict, just saying if you use Run Like Hell you'll have enough move/sprint speed to get away from dangerous situations.

My personnal experience while playing with a friend and 2 bots on NH is having 2 damage builds (and not OVERdamage), me having just EMT Bag and Med Professionnal and we get this easily. Economy is a must to keep your deck evolving and improving the whole act. There is a moment where you're strong enough to feel like you're playing Vet.

Yet I agree about how playing with randoms is hard. That's why I rarely play with randoms on higher difficulties in any game. No communication, random builds, no training on lower difficulties before. But I don't blame them, they're trying. If I wanna have fun in a random game I'll go NM but not NH.

[kozerd.lb]

Bots don't suffer from trauma damage, have very high damage resistance, take no damage from acid pool or most hazards (= they are cheating) so it's difficult to compare to games with randoms who take hits very hard in any difficulty and where a Doc is very beneficial most of the time.

Also bots give you their coppers so it's easier to build an economy and buy team upgrades or card shrines.

So playing with friends and bots is definitively easier than playing in QP.

[TsarFlow]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von kozerd.lb:

Bots don't suffer from trauma damage, have very high damage resistance, take no damage from acid pool or most hazards (= they are cheating) so it's difficult to compare to games with randoms who take hits very hard in any difficulty and where a Doc is very beneficial most of the time.

Also bots give you their coppers so it's easier to build an economy and buy team upgrades or card shrines.

So playing with friends and bots is definitively easier than playing in QP.

I agree about bots, NH is easy af with them.

Any difficulty : Doc very beneficial ?

I play often NM with randoms (with or without a friend), I never felt the need of a Doc on my team. Most of all, damage is lacking by building tankish/healing decks. I can kill as many riddens/specials as I want, if all my team gets down I become useless if I can't go forward.

As I said, EMT Bag and Med Professionnal on any character is far enough of a heal. If people get hit and downed easily, having a Doc will just have a lose in damage and most of the time will become useless because whoever/whenever you're healing, people will still get down.

You don't have infinite healings, I was thinking like you before and played Doc a lot but still managed to lose because of people constently going down and me having no damage output ; once you have no healing, you become the most useless character ever.

Melee is strong actually and I have nothing to say against, but tankish/healing ONLY builds are just useless. You're just surviving a bit more but still get down because you're slow or unable to kill.

[kozerd.lb]

Any healer can still use his gun when not healing or reviving.

Why should we think about not having enough firepower if someone is playing Doc while the 3 other players should have enough DPS with their high damage weapons? Like a sniper build can kill any mutation in a few bullets. Same for a random grenadier build. Melee would remove all common riddens without any difficulty.

You can totally play as Doc with more than 2 healing cards, a few economy cards (copper/scavenger), a reliable weapon like the M1A which can already kill most common enemy with 1-shot and be good enough for shooting weakspots with ease.
Plus, with the new card Suppressing Fire, you can actually slow down many enemies and greatly help the team with a single card investment for this weapon.

It seems that the healer players you met (or yourself) didn't have time to shoot a single bullet and were waiting for someone to heal or were too busy healing (nobody is healing 24/7 anyway) then quickly assist the team.
So maybe these Doc were awfully bad but it doesn't mean you are losing a huge DPS when you are supposed to only spend a few seconds healing someone before returning to fight.

Why should we run a glass cannon build on a Doc.
Are you supposed to deal the missing extra damage that the other players can't deal to enemies with their Barrett or LMG or Machete? is it your duty on Earth?
If the other players can't deal with the horde or mutations when they are 3 with big guns and a full deck, the problem is not that you need or don't need a healer but why couldn't you be a good healer who makes the run smoother and who actually contribute to the fight at the same time?

Regarding melee/tank, they are very good even at surviving even in NH with proper placement and good reactivity.
I completed all NH as a melee/tank and you take a lot of trauma overall for sure but you survive and can finish missions without being downed.
So it depends on players and how they play.

For instance, some people are just too confident when they play melee because you can 1-hit most enemies but they just don't know what to do when an unexpected event occur and when they are surrounded by enemies, so they get down quickly and suddenly.
Or they don't know when to move forward or when to back up.

[심장을 파고들어 넌]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von kozerd.lb:

If the other players can't deal with the horde or mutations when they are 3 with big guns and a full deck, the problem is not that you need or don't need a healer but why couldn't you be a good healer who makes the run smoother and who actually contribute to the fight at the same time?

Well, QuckPlay is a good place to train some skills btw.
Some players completely don't understand, what need to do and where need to hide in certain situations. And they are just dying.

[심장을 파고들어 넌]

Sue No Hope QuickPlay experience. 13 minutes of pain. I think 9 out of 10 quickplay nh runs for you guys is the same
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN2mQAlJnQ0
Sue's melee cards: https://i.imgur.com/dK8gJMI.jpg

[TsarFlow]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von kozerd.lb:

Any healer can still use his gun when not healing or reviving.

Why should we think about not having enough firepower if someone is playing Doc while the 3 other players should have enough DPS with their high damage weapons? Like a sniper build can kill any mutation in a few bullets. Same for a random grenadier build. Melee would remove all common riddens without any difficulty.

You can totally play as Doc with more than 2 healing cards, a few economy cards (copper/scavenger), a reliable weapon like the M1A which can already kill most common enemy with 1-shot and be good enough for shooting weakspots with ease.
Plus, with the new card Suppressing Fire, you can actually slow down many enemies and greatly help the team with a single card investment for this weapon.

It seems that the healer players you met (or yourself) didn't have time to shoot a single bullet and were waiting for someone to heal or were too busy healing (nobody is healing 24/7 anyway) then quickly assist the team.
So maybe these Doc were awfully bad but it doesn't mean you are losing a huge DPS when you are supposed to only spend a few seconds healing someone before returning to fight.

Why should we run a glass cannon build on a Doc.
Are you supposed to deal the missing extra damage that the other players can't deal to enemies with their Barrett or LMG or Machete? is it your duty on Earth?
If the other players can't deal with the horde or mutations when they are 3 with big guns and a full deck, the problem is not that you need or don't need a healer but why couldn't you be a good healer who makes the run smoother and who actually contribute to the fight at the same time?

Regarding melee/tank, they are very good even at surviving even in NH with proper placement and good reactivity.
I completed all NH as a melee/tank and you take a lot of trauma overall for sure but you survive and can finish missions without being downed.
So it depends on players and how they play.

For instance, some people are just too confident when they play melee because you can 1-hit most enemies but they just don't know what to do when an unexpected event occur and when they are surrounded by enemies, so they get down quickly and suddenly.
Or they don't know when to move forward or when to back up.

That's how you see the game, and I dont. But I respect that and understand it.

And no, I'm not running like an idiot with a few bandages. But when you play a full-healing-deck Doc and see your team getting down again and again and again and again even if you heal them all day long, you think twice about how you should have played.

Playing a Doc with 3-4 healing cards is far enough if you really want to, but then pick eco/speed (run like hell)/damage and we'll agree. I'm really talking about a full Doc healing build, there is no need to get that kind of build. As I said earlier, I'm myself using 2 healing cards in my build I'm using with any character : EMT and Med Pro.

Now, the question was : is Doc a must ? You answered yourself by a no. Having a healer may be more comfortable for some, but having someone dedicated to that job only and killing like 50 riddens only in a chapter isn't a MUST. You'll go faster forward while having someone dealing damage + you can save someone not by healing but by killing what deals damage to him.

Btw, you may feel that the game is smoother when everyone is max HP because many go on panic when they're lower than 60. When you're used to play with low hp (with Glass Cannon already but with some hits also), you just play safer until you can go hard again.

One thing again, what if your sniper/DPS/melee dies ? This is over. Not every sniper can aim the weakspots well, not every melee plays right as you mentionned, not every DPS get rid of everything on its way. And this is an "ideal" world you're talking about. I prefer being able to deal the extra missing damage as you said, instead of being a walking pharmacy.

[TsarFlow]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Fiure:

Sue No Hope QuickPlay experience. 13 minutes of pain. I think 9 out of 10 quickplay nh runs for you guys is the same
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oN2mQAlJnQ0
Sue's melee cards: https://i.imgur.com/dK8gJMI.jpg

Nice ! But that's strange, you don't have the corruption card : "laggy servers and teleporting riddens hitting you from 10 feets".

[Hellfox]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von TsarFlow:

BAHAHAHA he got mad again. I remember him saying in another thread "toxic haters here, go play offline if you're not happy".

There is no need in any "role" if you can play with some people who have experience in this game. A "to-do-all" is FAR ENOUGH to carry to the end without any problem.

You need a Doc healing in your team ? Then first question yourself why you're taking that much damage you need a healer in your team. EMT Bag and Med Professionnal in your deck is MORE than enough, and only one carrying this btw. And more, a healer is a bad damage dealer, so if no one defends him, that's the end for him. Give him some damage !

You need a tank ? Again, learn to dodge attacks and you'll never need any one camping in a place to save your ass. Play melee if you have fun with, but no need to use damage/trauma resistance.

You only need players that can obliterate anything on the way and are able to dodge any attacks. If you complain about speed cards, we are only using "Run like Hell". No need of more.

Take some eco cards (CS, MG, LP if you want more) and buy anything on the road that fits your playstyle and is a buff.

And this have done many NM runs and NH easily, finishing with a huge deck (hmm) and many coppers left at the end. Idk if you can see my deck screenshot on my profile, but guess you should just take a look (again, it fits MY playstyle).

Then, if you play with randoms, don't complain. That's obvious you'll not match up with 3 more skilled players everytime. Again, I quote you : go play offline if you're not happy (or even find some friends but if you're that toxic anytime without even questioning yourself, I guess you don't have many).

I hope to meet you someday on a random game, seeing you camping in a corner. :)

Hahaha, what advice you and kozerd.lb are giving who never play co-op with full team. You play solo no doubt because the way you are saying is already that you never play co-op or just only on nightmare and no hope on solo with bots. I saw your deck and it works with bots.

[GSPOTxJESUS]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Prince Ian:

You guys need to stop thinking that you're better than you actually are.

I agree with OP because I am the only one in existence that is good at this game, that means no one else can be. Humble yourselves!

[SaiJaku Kami | Erina]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Fiure:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SaiJaku Kami | Chino:

which melee builds or buckshot bruiser can't help a lot if there are too many in the surrounding

Because every melee build you have seen is just a copy paste from youtubers.
Every melee deck with SLUGGER/BRAZEN/CROSS TRAINERS (why?)
By the logic we have Mean Drunk/Meth Head (both are splash area damage, Meth Head gives additional +% attack speed boost and with a Claws there is also additional multiplier), so why we need to boost our attack speed? There is no need to do that at all, also no need to waste card slot for stamina cards.
Instead of this, why not using maximum hp regeneration boost (also by hitting mutations we can regen our hp depended of healing efficiency and it can be above 20 hp per a hit!): +%50 + %25 +%15 +%15 +%20 overheal; + 1hp; + 1 temp hp; + 2 hp per mutations hit - now calculate this all and finally we can get +20-30 hp regen per hit (clean hp bar) and ! trauma heal self. Even the corruption cards like -%50 healing efficiency/lots of festering ridden hits not a problem with it. And this build can heal teammates perfectly well also.

Well you need to have a high DPS teammate when only facing tallboys or boss, but usually with randoms, you don't know what deck they are using. I can even see Jim using a SMG all the time (maybe SMG build). Doc can did best with trauma heal and free bandage. With randoms, Doc is almost a must, otherwise it has 90% chance that your team get wiped out (ofc high dps is also required).

I don't use stamina build, I use food scavenger instead of cross trainer. The only card I use is Adrenaline fueled.

[SaiJaku Kami | Erina]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von TsarFlow:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von kozerd.lb:

Any healer can still use his gun when not healing or reviving.

Why should we think about not having enough firepower if someone is playing Doc while the 3 other players should have enough DPS with their high damage weapons? Like a sniper build can kill any mutation in a few bullets. Same for a random grenadier build. Melee would remove all common riddens without any difficulty.

You can totally play as Doc with more than 2 healing cards, a few economy cards (copper/scavenger), a reliable weapon like the M1A which can already kill most common enemy with 1-shot and be good enough for shooting weakspots with ease.
Plus, with the new card Suppressing Fire, you can actually slow down many enemies and greatly help the team with a single card investment for this weapon.

It seems that the healer players you met (or yourself) didn't have time to shoot a single bullet and were waiting for someone to heal or were too busy healing (nobody is healing 24/7 anyway) then quickly assist the team.
So maybe these Doc were awfully bad but it doesn't mean you are losing a huge DPS when you are supposed to only spend a few seconds healing someone before returning to fight.

Why should we run a glass cannon build on a Doc.
Are you supposed to deal the missing extra damage that the other players can't deal to enemies with their Barrett or LMG or Machete? is it your duty on Earth?
If the other players can't deal with the horde or mutations when they are 3 with big guns and a full deck, the problem is not that you need or don't need a healer but why couldn't you be a good healer who makes the run smoother and who actually contribute to the fight at the same time?

Regarding melee/tank, they are very good even at surviving even in NH with proper placement and good reactivity.
I completed all NH as a melee/tank and you take a lot of trauma overall for sure but you survive and can finish missions without being downed.
So it depends on players and how they play.

For instance, some people are just too confident when they play melee because you can 1-hit most enemies but they just don't know what to do when an unexpected event occur and when they are surrounded by enemies, so they get down quickly and suddenly.
Or they don't know when to move forward or when to back up.

That's how you see the game, and I dont. But I respect that and understand it.

And no, I'm not running like an idiot with a few bandages. But when you play a full-healing-deck Doc and see your team getting down again and again and again and again even if you heal them all day long, you think twice about how you should have played.

Playing a Doc with 3-4 healing cards is far enough if you really want to, but then pick eco/speed (run like hell)/damage and we'll agree. I'm really talking about a full Doc healing build, there is no need to get that kind of build. As I said earlier, I'm myself using 2 healing cards in my build I'm using with any character : EMT and Med Pro.

Now, the question was : is Doc a must ? You answered yourself by a no. Having a healer may be more comfortable for some, but having someone dedicated to that job only and killing like 50 riddens only in a chapter isn't a MUST. You'll go faster forward while having someone dealing damage + you can save someone not by healing but by killing what deals damage to him.

Btw, you may feel that the game is smoother when everyone is max HP because many go on panic when they're lower than 60. When you're used to play with low hp (with Glass Cannon already but with some hits also), you just play safer until you can go hard again.

One thing again, what if your sniper/DPS/melee dies ? This is over. Not every sniper can aim the weakspots well, not every melee plays right as you mentionned, not every DPS get rid of everything on its way. And this is an "ideal" world you're talking about. I prefer being able to deal the extra missing damage as you said, instead of being a walking pharmacy.

I respect your opinion. That's why I choose support scavenger, amped up and on your mark to help team survive longer. Doc still able killing riddens in no hope with headshots with pistol, but even you have damage cards, you are still not likely to be possible to kill mutation. After some rounds or coming out from hive, you already have a good quality pistol to kill normal riddens. For primary weapon, I always choose sniper rifle for disturbing the charge of exploder and retch. It is already enough for how Doc do unless you are melee healing build (I'm working on that). I can heal people with around 40% or below to survive much more longer.

For solo or group up friends, maybe Doc might not needed, but with randoms, I suppose Doc is a must on the team.

[SaiJaku Kami | Erina]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Skemo:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von SaiJaku Kami | Chino:

well if it is NM or below, then it really doesn't need with randoms, but it comes in NH, the number of riddens, damage of them, the trauma damage of them are very high which melee builds or buckshot bruiser can't help a lot if there are too many in the surrounding, not to say copper is very limited in NH.

your mele build probably sucks then.. i have no issues with mele medic in nohope carrying newplayers everyday... try changing stuff around . there are multiple ways to make your own deck that suits your playstyle dont complain about difficulty there is a counter to everythign in this game.

I'm not complaining the difficulty. I just compare the difficult between NH and NM. Melee medic is a good carrying deck, it can eliminate riddens very easily but is quite hard to kill tallboys or exploder something else if your team don't have a high dps.

[TsarFlow]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Hellfox:

Hahaha, what advice you and kozerd.lb are giving who never play co-op with full team. You play solo no doubt because the way you are saying is already that you never play co-op or just only on nightmare and no hope on solo with bots. I saw your deck and it works with bots.

Did you even read everything I wrote ?

My deck fits my playstyle and works with any randoms on NM (NH if I get to play with good mates). Please, dont answer when you're not even reading everything.

Again, play how you like, I'm just telling how I feel about the game needs and mechanics.

No more time to spend for you if you don't take time to read the whole thread before talking ♥♥♥♥.