ZWAT Unlock Options

[Harrier]

This game seems to be drawing rather a harsh line between the various skill levels of it's player base and saying less than 0.1% of us deserve these outfits unless you brave the wildly unpredictable and genuinely frustrating RNG mechanic of nightmare, which at the time of writing also precludes any planning strategy. I am of the belief that there is always more than one way to tie a knot and most players have more time to play than they do nightmare levels of skill. If the ZWAT costumes were available to unlock for 2500 supply points per character (or other amount) everyone still has a reasonable chance to get one after the completing all the supply lines and has extra motivation to keep playing the game.

Nightmare does not offer any of this and from my perspective having a game withhold its best aesthetics to 99.9% of its player base seems rather punishing and something of a middle finger to the rest of us. This game is about teamwork but the hellish RNG element of nightmare mode reduces this core to building a sprint deck and hoping you can play with those that know this and how to use it. Most of the people who have unlocked them are either exploiting and/or undetectably cheating their way through it.

Another option is having these costumes automatically unlock for each character after you have clocked up 250 hours of playtime with them. Either way I really hope the developer considers letting go of the existing design around unlocking ZWAT and decides to be a bit more all-inclusive of player base,

[Raptor Jesus]

It doesn't take skill yo get zwat, It takes running and exploits.

[VeteranGhillie]

No, certain items should only be unlocked by completing some type of challenge. In this case it is Nightmare. Just being able to buy the skins with points would water down the accomplishment for people that have completed Nightmare and would give no incentive to even play the hardest difficulty outside of doing it for fun.

[Jhy]

Originally posted by Raptor Jesus:

It doesn't take skill yo get zwat, It takes running and exploits.

Raptor jesus is lying...
It just required RNGesus to be with you :
- for the mate
- for the weapon
- for the attachement
- for the spawn of tallboy
- for the card, random, buyable, corruption
- for not having specific boss at specific time
- having discount at seller
- having a good server
- doesn't get deconnected
- doesn't have insta leaver when they die,
- not having special door alarm at specific time
- not having crow who wait you & block the road at hell bells
- having a mate with copper card
- having not a team full of same weapon

except this, this is fine.

Also you are lucky, before the patch, you were required to be alive at the end of EVERY MAPS when i unlocked mine.

Your own team was making mistake because " MUST BE ALIVE AT ALL COST".

[ErikaLol]

The problem is how terribly designed Nightmare is. Most people as Nightmare currently sits will never do it, and I agree that's a big problem. I'm fine with having cosmetics locked behind difficulty but defending Nightmare as it sits is beyond absurd lmao.

The difficulty needs an overhaul or at the very least some massive changes to make it playable without speedrunning. If they just nerf the speedrunning cards and don't touch it, well Nightmare is gonna be even more miserable and bad. I dunno, it's just broken and pretty stupid right now in all honesty.

[CursedPanther]

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

No, certain items should only be unlocked by completing some type of challenge. In this case it is Nightmare. Just being able to buy the skins with points would water down the accomplishment for people that have completed Nightmare and would give no incentive to even play the hardest difficulty outside of doing it for fun.

You aren't reading the actual problem pal.

Like the OP has mentioned, right now a pretty big portion of the 1% players on average with recorded completion of all four NM acts(on Steam, significantly less on consoles) are either speedrunning(which does take a level of skills and remembering the usual sleeper locations) or are exploiting the infinite grenade glitch(which takes no skill other than knowing how to setup a macro script). This is the result of a horrendous RNG system and ridiculously imbalanced Mutations healthpool/spawning rate that leaves no room to a coordinated tactical approach among the team that can at least result in a near-guaranteed success.

2500SP is no small amount right now even for successful Vet runs that average a 50-55SP payout per mission. I agree that it's a pretty good alternative incentive to keep the majority of the playerbase around for the grinding, especially when the game boasts on its high replayability base on the RNG mechanics.

[Raptor Jesus]

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

No, certain items should only be unlocked by completing some type of challenge. In this case it is Nightmare. Just being able to buy the skins with points would water down the accomplishment for people that have completed Nightmare and would give no incentive to even play the hardest difficulty outside of doing it for fun.

You aren't reading the actual problem pal.

Like the OP has mentioned, right now a pretty big portion of the 1% players on average with recorded completion of all four NM acts(on Steam, significantly less on consoles) are either speedrunning(which does take a level of skills and remembering the usual sleeper locations) or are exploiting the infinite grenade glitch(which takes no skill other than knowing how to setup a macro script). This is the result of a horrendous RNG system and ridiculously imbalanced Mutations healthpool/spawning rate that leaves no room to a coordinated tactical approach among the team that can at least result in a near-guaranteed success.

2500SP is no small amount right now even for successful Vet runs that average a 50-550SP pay out per mission. I agree that it's a pretty good alternative incentive to keep the majority around for the grinding, especially when the game boasts on its high replayability base on the RNG mechanics.

The completion of vet is pretty low as well

[Reeva!]

Originally posted by Harrier:

This game seems to be drawing rather a harsh line between the various skill levels of it's player base and saying less than 0.1% of us deserve these outfits unless you brave the wildly unpredictable and genuinely frustrating RNG mechanic of nightmare, which at the time of writing also precludes any planning strategy. I am of the belief that there is always more than one way to tie a knot and most players have more time to play than they do nightmare levels of skill. If the ZWAT costumes were available to unlock for 2500 supply points per character (or other amount) everyone still has a reasonable chance to get one after the completing all the supply lines and has extra motivation to keep playing the game.

Nightmare does not offer any of this and from my perspective having a game withhold its best aesthetics to 99.9% of its player base seems rather punishing and something of a middle finger to the rest of us. This game is about teamwork but the hellish RNG element of nightmare mode reduces this core to building a sprint deck and hoping you can play with those that know this and how to use it. Most of the people who have unlocked them are either exploiting and/or undetectably cheating their way through it.

Another option is having these costumes automatically unlock for each character after you have clocked up 250 hours of playtime with them. Either way I really hope the developer considers letting go of the existing design around unlocking ZWAT and decides to be a bit more all-inclusive of player base,

ZWAT is garbage. It looks awful. I'd say wearing the ZWAT outfits on any character is as insufferable as Nightmare difficulty itself.

[Guzma]

Originally posted by Raptor Jesus:

It doesn't take skill yo get zwat, It takes running and exploits.

tell me you're a soyboy, without telling me you're a soyboy.

Just play NM and have fun , ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥

[Jaskajopuli]

I wish they made nightmare even harder.

[Horror]

should speed run it and exploit while you can, cause if you thought that last patch was piss just WAIT till this next one!

[CursedPanther]

Originally posted by Naomi_chi:

ZWAT is garbage. It looks awful. I'd say wearing the ZWAT outfits on any character is as insufferable as Nightmare difficulty itself.

With looks aside but from the lore point of view, the ZWAT outfits are the ones that make most sense for the cleaners to wear on their missions? They might be immune to the parasites due to various reasons but they are clearly not immune from the physical damages sustained during the many engagements. I mean Hoffman is still Hoffman in the riot gears, but it sure beats Karlee pretending the next punk rock party is just down the block or something.

These eight are way under-dressed for 'regulars' doing this as a job.

[VeteranGhillie]

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

No, certain items should only be unlocked by completing some type of challenge. In this case it is Nightmare. Just being able to buy the skins with points would water down the accomplishment for people that have completed Nightmare and would give no incentive to even play the hardest difficulty outside of doing it for fun.

You aren't reading the actual problem pal.

Like the OP has mentioned, right now a pretty big portion of the 1% players on average with recorded completion of all four NM acts(on Steam, significantly less on consoles) are either speedrunning(which does take a level of skills and remembering the usual sleeper locations) or are exploiting the infinite grenade glitch(which takes no skill other than knowing how to setup a macro script). This is the result of a horrendous RNG system and ridiculously imbalanced Mutations healthpool/spawning rate that leaves no room to a coordinated tactical approach among the team that can at least result in a near-guaranteed success.

2500SP is no small amount right now even for successful Vet runs that average a 50-55SP payout per mission. I agree that it's a pretty good alternative incentive to keep the majority of the playerbase around for the grinding, especially when the game boasts on its high replayability base on the RNG mechanics.

Not every single mode needs to be completed by the majority or even a large minority. Why can't there just be modes that are hard for the sake of being hard and rewarding for the people that beat them? I have all 8 ZWATs and while we did do a fair bit of speedrunning for some of them we did most of it the "slow" way.

And no, 2,500 supply points is not a lot, especially if you grind the game at all. I have almost 60,000 SP just waiting to be used. Stop trying to make games be participation award games.

[CursedPanther]

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

You aren't reading the actual problem pal.

Like the OP has mentioned, right now a pretty big portion of the 1% players on average with recorded completion of all four NM acts(on Steam, significantly less on consoles) are either speedrunning(which does take a level of skills and remembering the usual sleeper locations) or are exploiting the infinite grenade glitch(which takes no skill other than knowing how to setup a macro script). This is the result of a horrendous RNG system and ridiculously imbalanced Mutations healthpool/spawning rate that leaves no room to a coordinated tactical approach among the team that can at least result in a near-guaranteed success.

2500SP is no small amount right now even for successful Vet runs that average a 50-55SP payout per mission. I agree that it's a pretty good alternative incentive to keep the majority of the playerbase around for the grinding, especially when the game boasts on its high replayability base on the RNG mechanics.

Not every single mode needs to be completed by the majority or even a large minority. Why can't there just be modes that are hard for the sake of being hard and rewarding for the people that beat them? I have all 8 ZWATs and while we did do a fair bit of speedrunning for some of them we did most of it the "slow" way.

And no, 2,500 supply points is not a lot, especially if you grind the game at all. I have almost 60,000 SP just waiting to be used. Stop trying to make games be participation award games.

You clearly don't get it. No one is asking to remove Nightmare here.

[VeteranGhillie]

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

Not every single mode needs to be completed by the majority or even a large minority. Why can't there just be modes that are hard for the sake of being hard and rewarding for the people that beat them? I have all 8 ZWATs and while we did do a fair bit of speedrunning for some of them we did most of it the "slow" way.

And no, 2,500 supply points is not a lot, especially if you grind the game at all. I have almost 60,000 SP just waiting to be used. Stop trying to make games be participation award games.

You clearly don't get it. No one is asking to remove Nightmare here.

How could you possibly of come to the conclusion that I think people want to have Nightmare removed from what I said?

[The Deprived]

Originally posted by CursedPanther:

Originally posted by VeteranGhillie:

Not every single mode needs to be completed by the majority or even a large minority. Why can't there just be modes that are hard for the sake of being hard and rewarding for the people that beat them? I have all 8 ZWATs and while we did do a fair bit of speedrunning for some of them we did most of it the "slow" way.

And no, 2,500 supply points is not a lot, especially if you grind the game at all. I have almost 60,000 SP just waiting to be used. Stop trying to make games be participation award games.

You clearly don't get it. No one is asking to remove Nightmare here.

You missed the point mate. He clearly stated the game mode should be hard and ZWATs should be rewards for doing the challenge. If you just allowed people to buy the skins, why even have the challenge in game? Just for ♥♥♥♥♥ and giggles? Makes no damn sense. They give you great skins to buy in the base supply webs with the Apocalypse sets. Grinding SP in this game isn't hard. ♥♥♥♥, I've had the supply lines completed in less then a week. Now, I'm sitting on 30k+. Just because y'all struggle to beat the game on Vet doesn't mean to nullify the challenges/rewards for said challenge just because you want to be included.