T5 Archers?

[natfrog123]

This has been missing since the game launched. Where are they? We have been getting new unit after new unit but we still do not have the original base units from the original trees filled out. When is this coming? I know they are going to be hot garbage but geez give them to us already. More range, more damage, more health, more armor pierce, and higher number of arrows than the longbows. Give us T5 archers already. Oh and for the love of all things good in the world give them faster movement speed. Makes no sense that something that has no armor and carries a piece of wood with a string on it can't outrun a unit wearing heavy armor, carrying a massive weapon made of steel, and take literally one hit to kill.

[ChaosKhan]

Originally posted by natfrog123:

This has been missing since the game launched. Where are they? We have been getting new unit after new unit but we still do not have the original base units from the original trees filled out. When is this coming? I know they are going to be hot garbage but geez give them to us already. More range, more damage, more health, more armor pierce, and higher number of arrows than the longbows. Give us T5 archers already. Oh and for the love of all things good in the world give them faster movement speed. Makes no sense that something that has no armor and carries a piece of wood with a string on it can't outrun a unit wearing heavy armor, carrying a massive weapon made of steel, and take literally one hit to kill.

Ranged are cancerous troops and already ruin the game well enough without a T5 archer unit. Gotta love those sieges with over half the team having Pavise and just waiting for someone retarded enough to pull out a melee unit and take all the dmg for them so they can farm kills to boost their score.

[Stundorn]

I just started the game some days ago and dont know much about meta etc...
I also know i did a lot wrong by just not knowing and make bad choices maybe.
Until only using basic units and although i'm already 60+ - dont ask me all the levels and tiers are so confusing - i still learn a smth. from every siege i do.
Archers bring tactical play into the game, i also want T5 Archers and use Longbow as my only purple unit atm.
They do well, but position them right and know when to use them at best is most often not the case due to the dynamics a battle has.
I read a lot about to get Namkhan and this or that unit and to not play nodachi, because it's weak, but well...
until i think everything is somehow viable and usefull when used at the right moment and in the right way/ positioning.
And very often you have just bad luck or made a dumb decision you could or just couldnt forsee.
I plan to unlock some more basic units and then maybe head for this or that Season unit to unlock them.
I think i'm anyway not interested in the ultimate endgame of this game and finetune everything with doctrines - this seems to become too grindy and tedious for me.

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

Originally posted by natfrog123:

This has been missing since the game launched. Where are they? We have been getting new unit after new unit but we still do not have the original base units from the original trees filled out. When is this coming? I know they are going to be hot garbage but geez give them to us already. More range, more damage, more health, more armor pierce, and higher number of arrows than the longbows. Give us T5 archers already. Oh and for the love of all things good in the world give them faster movement speed. Makes no sense that something that has no armor and carries a piece of wood with a string on it can't outrun a unit wearing heavy armor, carrying a massive weapon made of steel, and take literally one hit to kill.

Ranged are cancerous troops and already ruin the game well enough without a T5 archer unit. Gotta love those sieges with over half the team having Pavise and just waiting for someone retarded enough to pull out a melee unit and take all the dmg for them so they can farm kills to boost their score.

Most of the rewards in the game come from absorbing damage. If a player is using ranged units and get 300 unit kills they usually have less score than someone who tanks the damage. As for them being "cancer", Every bit of damage done to a unit is damage YOUR mele or shield unit doesn't have to do. Instead of it taking your unit 3 hits to kill something it takes 1. If your unit can kill something in one hit they aren't taking excess damage from a prolonged fight. Meaning your unit is on the field longer and can take disadvantaged fights and come out on top. There is only 1 "cancer" unit according to almost everyone and that is the Namkans and that is not the fault of the longbow units. Personally I never see the bleed damage tick for much more than 300 anyways but apparently people say it can tick for thousands but like I said I have NEVER seen it tick that high.

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by davidvicas:

of course...and give them wings as well....tell me what the ♥♥♥♥ is fun playing shooting units? you just stand and stare at your screen...shooting units are everything that ruin this game....not enough that you are waiting 10 minutes to get in a game...then 2-3 until siege arrives...then 4-5 min you spend in changing the area cuz everything is full of shooting ♥♥♥♥♥...so you are not playing...and the one with shooting units are not playing either... they should reduce their power or the best would be if there wouldn't be any shooting ♥♥♥♥ and we could finally play that 10-15 min normally (sorry for my English)

Different strokes for different folks? Shield units are boring to me. Let me stand on the front line with my piece of steel and take on several units at the same time. THAT seems dumb to me. It's also why bows/crossbows/slings/firearms were invented in the first place. Someone finally figured out getting stabbed in the back while surrounded by multiple attackers just wasn't fun. So why not kill them before they get to me. It's called being smart.

[ChaosKhan]

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Most of the rewards in the game come from absorbing damage. If a player is using ranged units and get 300 unit kills they usually have less score than someone who tanks the damage.

This used to be the case until the season before the last. Then it got "rebalanced" because all the scrubs running 100+ kills with T5 cav weren't satisfied that the game didn't give them an S for running over fights and then not doing anything for 5 mins while healing up and looking for opportunities to farm kills safely. Now, kills reward substantially more than taking damage. Try it out yourself.

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Different strokes for different folks? Shield units are boring to me. Let me stand on the front line with my piece of steel and take on several units at the same time. THAT seems dumb to me. It's also why bows/crossbows/slings/firearms were invented in the first place. Someone finally figured out getting stabbed in the back while surrounded by multiple attackers just wasn't fun. So why not kill them before they get to me. It's called being smart.

Well, there are always people who find non essential jobs to be boring, but it doesn't make essential jobs suddenly less essential. Obviously, they need therefore to be rewarded better than non essential ones. The game takes place in a time frame, where melee was still the predominant way to fight battles. Ranged simply plays a secondary role in such a set up. Feel free to like ranged more than melee and play it. The point is, to live with the fact, that the playerbase and the devs will do claims and adjustments to make sure, that ranged really stays secondary. Ranged has been hammered down over the seasons and chances are that it will receive even more nerfs in the future.

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Most of the rewards in the game come from absorbing damage. If a player is using ranged units and get 300 unit kills they usually have less score than someone who tanks the damage.

This used to be the case until the season before the last. Then it got "rebalanced" because all the scrubs running 100+ kills with T5 cav weren't satisfied that the game didn't give them an S for running over fights and then not doing anything for 5 mins while healing up and looking for opportunities to farm kills safely. Now, kills reward substantially more than taking damage. Try it out yourself.

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Different strokes for different folks? Shield units are boring to me. Let me stand on the front line with my piece of steel and take on several units at the same time. THAT seems dumb to me. It's also why bows/crossbows/slings/firearms were invented in the first place. Someone finally figured out getting stabbed in the back while surrounded by multiple attackers just wasn't fun. So why not kill them before they get to me. It's called being smart.

Well, there are always people who find non essential jobs to be boring, but it doesn't make essential jobs suddenly less essential. Obviously, they need therefore to be rewarded better than non essential ones. The game takes place in a time frame, where melee was still the predominant way to fight battles. Ranged simply plays a secondary role in such a set up. Feel free to like ranged more than melee and play it. The point is, to live with the fact, that the playerbase and the devs will do claims and adjustments to make sure, that ranged really stays secondary. Ranged has been hammered down over the seasons and chances are that it will receive even more nerfs in the future.

As much as what you said is factual, i can't personally continue to to support the Namkan "META". Namkans need to be nerfed and I completely agree with a nerf to namkans even as an archer commander. However the tier 5 gunners have a unique mechanic, do a ton of damage, and have a ton of range, yet they still are not known for getting tons of kills except in VERY RARE situations. That being said a T5 archer unit can/should exist as we already have access to big hitter ranged damage units and the game has yet to be broken with every player running gunners. It simply doesn't happen. Same can be said with the T5 muskets and the T5 crossbows and the T5 flame throwers. In VERY SPECIFIC situations they can clear out an area but so can a treb and so can cav so it shouldn't be to hard to make the new archers a TRUE upgrade to the longbows we currently have and slap a heft leadership cost on them.

[ChaosKhan]

That's the point: Ranged has to remain situational. That's why T5 archers should never happen, since archers are a versatile ranged type with very little limitiations on the current siege maps.

A straight upgrade for the Longbows would simply lead to a superior archer unit making all other archers obsolete.

[Sardorim]

Watch them still be worse point per point compared to Namkhans.

[Lachanche]

t5 archers are longbows with the ability of namkhan. boom, problem solved

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

That's the point: Ranged has to remain situational. That's why T5 archers should never happen, since archers are a versatile ranged type with very little limitiations on the current siege maps.

A straight upgrade for the Longbows would simply lead to a superior archer unit making all other archers obsolete.

Except we already know they do exist. They just need to hurry up and come out. Also be an upgrade over the current longbows as they come after the current longbows in progression. I wouldn't mind a 200lbs draw weight longbow unit. Fully capable of pinpoint accuracy from 150m of near straight up firing and down pouring to a specific location as well as area attack like the current longbows with a chance of natural crit and headshot damage. This would be amazing. They would still do less dps than every mele unit but be a high value target like the gunners.

[ChaosKhan]

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Except we already know they do exist. They just need to hurry up and come out. Also be an upgrade over the current longbows as they come after the current longbows in progression. I wouldn't mind a 200lbs draw weight longbow unit. Fully capable of pinpoint accuracy from 150m of near straight up firing and down pouring to a specific location as well as area attack like the current longbows with a chance of natural crit and headshot damage. This would be amazing. They would still do less dps than every mele unit but be a high value target like the gunners.

Except that you don't know that they exist. No idea why you think that troops with the "?" icon in the main tree have already been developed and just not released.

The unit you're describing is utter, imbalanced crap btw. It should NEVER be introduced into the game.

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Except we already know they do exist. They just need to hurry up and come out. Also be an upgrade over the current longbows as they come after the current longbows in progression. I wouldn't mind a 200lbs draw weight longbow unit. Fully capable of pinpoint accuracy from 150m of near straight up firing and down pouring to a specific location as well as area attack like the current longbows with a chance of natural crit and headshot damage. This would be amazing. They would still do less dps than every mele unit but be a high value target like the gunners.

Except that you don't know that they exist. No idea why you think that troops with the "?" icon in the main tree have already been developed and just not released.

The unit you're describing is utter, imbalanced crap btw. It should NEVER be introduced into the game.

Exists as in are coming and YES we know they are coming.

[Elgroscriss]

Sure as hell would prefer they balance the already out units than releasing yet another broken T5 thingy.
But hey, next season, I heard its the feudal japanese theme so if its so, maybe theyll release their yumi archers as a T5 unit and youll be happy.

[ChaosKhan]

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Exists as in are coming and YES we know they are coming.

Source or liar.

Originally posted by Elgroscriss:

Sure as hell would prefer they balance the already out units than releasing yet another broken T5 thingy.
But hey, next season, I heard its the feudal japanese theme so if its so, maybe theyll release their yumi archers as a T5 unit and youll be happy.

Rumors about a "japanese" season have been around for over a year already and reocur every season. I'll believe it only when I see it.

[natfrog123]

Originally posted by ChaosKhan:

Originally posted by natfrog123:

Exists as in are coming and YES we know they are coming.

Source or liar.

Originally posted by Elgroscriss:

Sure as hell would prefer they balance the already out units than releasing yet another broken T5 thingy.
But hey, next season, I heard its the feudal japanese theme so if its so, maybe theyll release their yumi archers as a T5 unit and youll be happy.

Rumors about a "japanese" season have been around for over a year already and reocur every season. I'll believe it only when I see it.

Source? Go IN GAME and hover over the block to the right of the longbowmen. Says coming soon. You are welcome.