Is the silver sword good in ashlands?

[RedHaze1911]

Or is it obsolete after Yagluth pretty much?

[Falcon]

For Ashlands, use Mistwalker or Frostner.

[electricdawn]

People still use Frostner? I found it lackluster for pretty much anything other than very specific enemies (like Stone Golems). I used the silver sword for Yagluth.

For almost everything else, the Black Metal Atgeir rules supreme.

Disclaimer: I'm still in the start phases of Mistlands and haven't found enough cores yet... :P

[bacon]

it was obsolete before yagluth, as blackmetal sword deals more DPS against all targets.

its fine in ashlands, due to the spirit damage. but mistwalker is obviously better.

[OctoberSky]

If used by a skilled player it is a good weapon in the Ashlands.

[ling.speed]

Originally posted by bacon:

it was obsolete before yagluth, as blackmetal sword deals more DPS against all targets.

Not really. At the same forge level, Silver sword out dps-es blackmetal given enough time as it has higher damage per stamina.

So for short easy to win skirmishes Blackmetal "wins more", while silver is pretty much on par in big fights when it actually matters. And thats before spirit damage.

Ofc there are many enemy hp/player skills brakepoints to skew it more toward BM being better, acutal combat in numbers is quite complex, but stamina is as a fuel for everything so it should not be ignored.

Which is why old weapons still work decently in later biomes, like frostner, older spears, finewood bow, stagbraker, bronze axe, antlers etc etc.

Originally posted by electricdawn:

People still use Frostner?

It is annoying how good frostner is in Ashlands, just for dishing damage... if only it didnt had the stupid knockback it would be right up there with the newest weapons. It comes down to specifics of Ashland combat which im not gonna spoil, but it definitely makes a comback there.

[John]

Originally posted by electricdawn:

People still use Frostner? I found it lackluster for pretty much anything other than very specific enemies (like Stone Golems). I used the silver sword for Yagluth.

For almost everything else, the Black Metal Atgeir rules supreme.

Disclaimer: I'm still in the start phases of Mistlands and haven't found enough cores yet... :P

You'd be surprised how good it is. It still kills seekers easily cause they are weak to cold damage, cold also slows them, the weapon has good knockback so it basically has double crowd control. For ashlands, skellies are weak to blunt, spirit hits them and enemies there are weak to cold. It's stupid how good an investment Frostner has been. In ashlands you choose Frostner or Mistwalker, lots of cc or a bit more damage, i would still choose Frostner over Mistwalker as i see dying as failing, so i choose cc.

[electricdawn]

Thanks, people. I will keep that in mind (and try Frostner on seekers).

[Nerevar]

some serious missinformation in this thread.

first off :

seekers are not WEAK to frost damage. they are neutral to it. they have no actual weakness.

seekers simply resist ALL 3 forms of phys dmg. so pure phys dmg weapons in generel suck vs them.

golems are some of the worst enemies to use frostner on. they are fully immune to frost AND spirit. thats less dmg than a bronze mace vs a golem. same for moder.

and ashlands skeletons are NOT weak to blunt dmg. another false claim i see posted commonly. the charred are neutral to blunt. they arent weak to it. the only things weak to blunt in ashlands are lava blobs (irrelevant for obivious reasons as attacking them is a waste of stamina and time due to thier nature) the skeletons are also not weak to frost either they are neutral.
they are also neutral to slash dmg. and mistwalkers slash is over TWICE as high as frostners blunt. its no contest there at the baseline.


the people who still argue like stamina cost per swing is a factor are all playing badly or just look at numbers. dont do that. its fully irrelevant. you NEVER spam your stamina bar empty. NEVER. its bad play. in any case. and the tiny bit of stamina saved per swing does NOT make up for the loss in raw dmg. it was always the worse choice if stamina was the only factor for the comparison argument. just ignore this metric for good. it just does not matter unless you have 0 skill in the weapon class and in that case you should level it up to a bit first to begin with.

the silver sword is math wise on par with mistwalker or a tiny bit better. for ashlands vs some enemies there. however you lose the frost slow and if you dont let the spirit dmg tick out fully youll actually do worse dmg. and this is only vs the charred mind you. vs other enemies the silver sword is flat out worse.

mistwalker is just flat out better vs most targets compared and the frost slow is just not comparable in terms of usefulness to begin with.

frostner is only better than mistwalker if you have a high club skill and low sword skill. people never mention this and make blanked statements on which is better. but is this the key factor here. if you have 10 swords and 70 clubs of course frostner will perform better in ashlands than mistwalker. but assueming equal levels its always worse no contest. the lower stamina cost does not make up for the dmg loss. it never does.

i still see people useing draugr fang in ashlands because they never got the memo that snap was already better in mistlands and in ashlands its a no brainer due to the spirit dmg and poisen immunity and resistence on enemies. the stamina again DOES NOT MATTER at all. its not even close dps wise.

people who still believe a tiny bit of stamina saved on some actions does matter in valheim combat. it does not. it never did. people who think this matters are button mashers. mashers die in ashlands regardless of what they do. as mashing is bad play in this game. this is why stamina per swing just doesnt matter especially if your weapon skill is halfway decent. people always compare this and list the full stamina cost values. which are only ever in effect at level zero skill. nobody has zero skill by the time they get to ashlands unless they die like a madman.

[electricdawn]

That's very interesting. Thanks as well. I'll try my lvl 4 iron mace vs. my lvl 3 Frostner on a stone golem. What you say makes sense, as the physical blunt damage of Frostner is actually pretty low (that's why I never used it but for stone golems, which was probably wrong as well).

It does work on making fulings slower, but if you don't really care about that... what is Frostner good for to begin with, I wonder?

[RedHaze1911]

Originally posted by Nerevar:

some serious missinformation in this thread.

first off :

seekers are not WEAK to frost damage. they are neutral to it. they have no actual weakness.

seekers simply resist ALL 3 forms of phys dmg. so pure phys dmg weapons in generel suck vs them.

golems are some of the worst enemies to use frostner on. they are fully immune to frost AND spirit. thats less dmg than a bronze mace vs a golem. same for moder.

and ashlands skeletons are NOT weak to blunt dmg. another false claim i see posted commonly. the charred are neutral to blunt. they arent weak to it. the only things weak to blunt in ashlands are lava blobs (irrelevant for obivious reasons as attacking them is a waste of stamina and time due to thier nature) the skeletons are also not weak to frost either they are neutral.
they are also neutral to slash dmg. and mistwalkers slash is over TWICE as high as frostners blunt. its no contest there at the baseline.


the people who still argue like stamina cost per swing is a factor are all playing badly or just look at numbers. dont do that. its fully irrelevant. you NEVER spam your stamina bar empty. NEVER. its bad play. in any case. and the tiny bit of stamina saved per swing does NOT make up for the loss in raw dmg. it was always the worse choice if stamina was the only factor for the comparison argument. just ignore this metric for good. it just does not matter unless you have 0 skill in the weapon class and in that case you should level it up to a bit first to begin with.

the silver sword is math wise on par with mistwalker or a tiny bit better. for ashlands vs some enemies there. however you lose the frost slow and if you dont let the spirit dmg tick out fully youll actually do worse dmg. and this is only vs the charred mind you. vs other enemies the silver sword is flat out worse.

mistwalker is just flat out better vs most targets compared and the frost slow is just not comparable in terms of usefulness to begin with.

frostner is only better than mistwalker if you have a high club skill and low sword skill. people never mention this and make blanked statements on which is better. but is this the key factor here. if you have 10 swords and 70 clubs of course frostner will perform better in ashlands than mistwalker. but assueming equal levels its always worse no contest. the lower stamina cost does not make up for the dmg loss. it never does.

i still see people useing draugr fang in ashlands because they never got the memo that snap was already better in mistlands and in ashlands its a no brainer due to the spirit dmg and poisen immunity and resistence on enemies. the stamina again DOES NOT MATTER at all. its not even close dps wise.

people who still believe a tiny bit of stamina saved on some actions does matter in valheim combat. it does not. it never did. people who think this matters are button mashers. mashers die in ashlands regardless of what they do. as mashing is bad play in this game. this is why stamina per swing just doesnt matter especially if your weapon skill is halfway decent. people always compare this and list the full stamina cost values. which are only ever in effect at level zero skill. nobody has zero skill by the time they get to ashlands unless they die like a madman.

Considering that half the players here are moms n grannies, button mashers cant be ignored. I often catch myself losing track of the stamina bar. Half because im quite average skilled and half because i play other games where there is no stamina bar xD
So basically the silver sword is good for button mashers and mistwalker is good for when you master the stamina bar awareness...

[Draconis]

Originally posted by electricdawn:

That's very interesting. Thanks as well. I'll try my lvl 4 iron mace vs. my lvl 3 Frostner on a stone golem. What you say makes sense, as the physical blunt damage of Frostner is actually pretty low (that's why I never used it but for stone golems, which was probably wrong as well).

It does work on making fulings slower, but if you don't really care about that... what is Frostner good for to begin with, I wonder?

You'll notice, that the iron mace is much better. Especially if you manage to parry an attack from the golem. If you do that you can outright kill the golem by simply keeping on doing the primary attack. 6 quick hits after parry, and it will be staggered again, long enough to kill it.
This does not really work with frostner or porcupine.
The next strong weapon against stone golems is the Demolisher (Mistlands) - but that one's two-handed and slows you down. And after that one, it's the Flamemetal Mace.

That's why I always carry an Iron Mace in the mountains. With this, killing golems is faster than digging holes for them.

[Faceplant]

Assuming a decent skill in sword, the difference in stamina usage for a full 3-attack combo between silver sword and mistwalker is 9. It takes 1 second to start regen and less than 1 second to recover that. Add a second to that, and you'll have recovered all of the stamina used.

With mistwalker, if your enemy is still alive after that attack, it's going to be frozen long enough for you to fully recover. Or, since you surely have way more stamina than the 32ish that it takes for the attack, you can just keep pounding it while it's frozen until it's dead.

IMO, it's no contest. I haven't even found a reason to upgrade to an Ashland-level sword because mistwalker works so well.

[Str8blazn]

Originally posted by electricdawn:

That's very interesting. Thanks as well. I'll try my lvl 4 iron mace vs. my lvl 3 Frostner on a stone golem. What you say makes sense, as the physical blunt damage of Frostner is actually pretty low (that's why I never used it but for stone golems, which was probably wrong as well).

It does work on making fulings slower, but if you don't really care about that... what is Frostner good for to begin with, I wonder?

In my opinion, Frostner shines with it's cc capabilities. It's not a matter of caring or not, slowing enemies down helps you in combat. It's a pretty significant slow.
While most times you don't want it to happen, the knockback can help as well in certain circumstances too.
The frost and spirit damage are what make it a great choice as well, as most enemies in Ashlands are weak to spirit or frost.

[Draconis]

I think the silver sword is good in ashlands. For dying.

[Faceplant]

Originally posted by Draconis:

That's why I always carry an Iron Mace in the mountains. With this, killing golems is faster than digging holes for them.

You don't drag golems in holes to save time, you drag them into holes to prevent spawns. The only time you need to do anything with stone golems is if they're near a place you want to stay for a while. Dragging one into a hole means no more spawns. It also can keep drake distracted for days.

If you can parry, you can kill a stone golem in 4-5 (secondary) hits with an iron sword. Time is not really an issue with most weapons.