Valheim

Valheim

6h0$t942 Sep 4, 2023 @ 4:49pm
Challenging seeds
Lay it on me, please
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Showing 1-14 of 14 comments
rodelis Sep 4, 2023 @ 6:20pm 
I wish I could find the video. Had a good list of annoyingly difficult seeds. Including one where you start on an island just big enough to sprint end to end with no food buffs. To get anywhere, you needed to figure out how to build a raft. It wasn't just a river separating spawn from everything else, it was smack dab in the middle of a large section of ocean.
knighttemplar1960 Sep 4, 2023 @ 10:26pm 
IHx7RIHAL

It all hills and rivers in the start area. There's only 1 spot flat enough for a medium sized lodge within a day's walk of the start point. Ocean access is hard to find and navigating the rivers in a Karve is difficult because the rivers are narrow and rock filled. Black forest is quite a walk from the start spot.
HOUSE_D Sep 5, 2023 @ 1:03am 
This may be the video you are talking about...I was just watching it before I saw your post. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrzWyowumuk&t=2s

If not then it may be some new info for you.
Cooperal Sep 5, 2023 @ 7:15am 
Originally posted by captainamaziiing:
Define 'challenging'. Once you get a Karve, they are all pretty much the same.
This. You can move a tree slightly to the left, put a river here and and lift some terrain there, but it is largely going to be the same adventure.

If you throw two pies at a wall, chances are that the resulting splats are not going to be identical in shape, but common sense dictates pie is pie. It is no different here with worlds.

What you probably want are some mods or some self-imposed rules.
rodelis Sep 5, 2023 @ 9:18am 
That absolutely is the vid I was thinking of. Had to wait till I saw the 2nd seed in it, but yeah, thats the one.
6h0$t942 Sep 5, 2023 @ 2:59pm 
ok, thanks all.
jonnin Sep 6, 2023 @ 12:34am 
Originally posted by captainamaziiing:
Define 'challenging'. Once you get a Karve, they are all pretty much the same.

This is a good question! So, reverse it. What makes a seed 'easy' --- its all about access. Your first swamp has 500 crypts instead of there being 0 in the first 13 swamp areas you found. The bosses are easy to find and not too far from spawn. The ocean is accessible and open (fair sized gaps between land masses, navigate but still see shores). The trader was right there easy to find. The major biomes (excluting mistlands and the poles) are all near spawn, maybe even on the first landmass, and in sizes that indicate crypts and silver (little mountains that are just a touch of snow and no stuff don't count).

So, the opposite of all that... hard to get around, inaccessible ocean or ocean travel is blocked by ginormous land mass. Bosses hard to find and far away. Lots of little biomes that lack resources, like those dreaded long thin and 0 crypt swamps. Trader's forest is in the middle of the plains or on the other side of a 10000 mile long mountain range. Its all about how quickly you can find what you need, in other words. In the grand scheme, all the seeds are the same if you don't mind taking it slow.
Psojed Sep 6, 2023 @ 1:35am 
I plopped those seeds from that video into the seed map. The map apparently generates different than from what he had in 2021. But even the versions shown in the video don't look very challenging.

1) Seed "wgwauTVtGh".
His main point was that Eikthyr is not on starting island, but on current version it is on the starting island. But it's not like it's a difficult thing to raft over to the next island to kill the deer anyway...
The mainland has 5 biomes, so it's basically an easy map with a faraway Trader.

2) Seed "FLOrida".
Starting island is a small meadows island, so basically you must raft over to the next island no matter what. But after you raft over, it's super easy mode. The closest mainland is one huge chunk of land that's connected, has 5 biomes, three bosses and a trader. Curiously, his version in the video AND the current game version both have those things I mentioned, so I don't understand why he thought it was a challenging seed at all.

3) Seed "ALLFATHER".
Again, this is just a normal difficulty seed. Starting island only has 3 biomes this time (Meadow, BF, Mountain), but basically any other island you sail to has stuff you need. In his version, trader was quite close, and in current patch, the trader is literally on the starting island, so again I don't get how he thought it was a challenging seed.

PS:
Originally posted by jonnin:
So, the opposite of all that... hard to get around, inaccessible ocean or ocean travel is blocked by ginormous land mass.
I don't think any seed like that exists. There's always ocean that lets you sail through if your starting island is not good enough.

Originally posted by jonnin:
Bosses hard to find and far away. Lots of little biomes that lack resources, like those dreaded long thin and 0 crypt swamps.
I don't think bosses are hard to find, because Vegvisirs exist. In that case, the "hard" seed would be a huge landmass that's all meadows and black forest and bosses are in the outer ring, behind plains. Something like seed "xV2pLimZea".
Last edited by Psojed; Sep 6, 2023 @ 1:54am
jonnin Sep 6, 2023 @ 11:40am 
I understand, and agree. BUT ... vegvisirs are notoriously difficult to find themselves on some maps. I guess, all bets are off if you LOOK at your seed online. Armed with that, its going to be fairly straightforward no matter how annoying the RNG hit you.

There are really (as you said) no seeds that lack ocean and ocean access at the full map bird's eye view, but there are PLENTY with huge lakes and U shaped island bits have you sailing a long and winding path just to get clear of your starter island and trying to avoid being tricked into landing on another part of it after a few min.

Thinking on it a bit more since last night, its really all about the iron. Comes down to "can you find a bunch of swamp crypts easily". Part of that is luck, depending on where you sailed, and part of that is finding the BM veg or boss swamp sooner rather than later as it usually has a good number of crypts. I think if you can luck into a ton of iron, you can do anything else with only modest aggravation, with the exception of finding the plains and mistland bosses. Both of those have few, hard to find veg and easy to miss or not find boss alters.

an example from a few random map clicks...
67ycG9UmkQ

imagine getting iron on this thing. Your spawn is "next to" the "ocean" but sailing from there makes it exceedingly likely you just land back on your starter island. Same if you sail off the ocean after heading north. If you don't get a bonemass veg, you have to go exactly to BM's location in the south to find enough iron to get going, or very risky, somehow stumble across the one in the far east near plains and across the ocean. Trying to sail a lap around your starter island is going to be an exercise in frustration, and sailing around looking for iron on nearby islands would be maddening as well. Even if you score BM's location, its only 7 or so crypts, enough to make your armor and weapons but not even close to all you will need, so you still have to scout out another source.
Last edited by jonnin; Sep 6, 2023 @ 12:38pm
Psojed Sep 6, 2023 @ 12:30pm 
Eikthyr Veg - you find it automatically.
Elder Veg - automatically as you delve for Cores, Shrooms and money.
BM Veg - automatically as you delve for Iron.
Moder Veg - my experience is that I find the altar before the Veg :D otherwise you have to look for it.
Yagluth Veg - you have to look for it.
Queen - automatically as you delve for Black Cores.

4/6 you find automatically due to doing something else that everyone wants to do.
2/6 you have to look for, but "look for it" in both cases means you just need to run and look around for specific structures.
Doesn't sound like "notoriously difficult".

---

Iron is big yes. But why is iron big.

Before, you had to hack away at a rock like a moron to get singular pieces of copper, then dig deep to find the buried parts of the vein, then find a tin deposit elsewhere, and to top it off you needed two copper bars and one tin bar for a single Bronze bar. Bronze tools need more metal bars than iron tools.

Now look at iron. Not only there's no rock to hack at that fills up your inventory, you're getting steady iron drops, and if you get lucky, you find free iron deposited in chests. One crypt can give you hundreds of iron bars.

It has nothing to do with seed difficulty or finding bonemass swamp or finding good number of crypts in the same place.
jonnin Sep 6, 2023 @ 12:39pm 
Iron is big yes. But why is iron big?

Because its used in every tier after swamp as well as your home's support, chests, and more. I probably have 2500 bars or more in my homes. I suppose you can go light armor and smaller wood homes and keep the need for it much lower, but the heavy armor, builder approach to the game is hard locked on this one resource and having access to a big crypt farm greatly eases the pain.
Last edited by jonnin; Sep 6, 2023 @ 12:42pm
Psojed Sep 6, 2023 @ 1:18pm 
You do you man, but stockpiling 2500 iron is just your decision. If I wanna play builder, I go to creative mode. Think of a normal playthrough. Your average player in a normal playthrough won't get anywhere close to 2500 iron :happy_creep:

And I think we're getting off-topic with all this iron talk.
Psojed Sep 6, 2023 @ 1:36pm 
Originally posted by jonnin:
an example from a few random map clicks...
67ycG9UmkQ

imagine getting iron on this thing. Your spawn is "next to" the "ocean" but sailing from there makes it exceedingly likely you just land back on your starter island. Same if you sail off the ocean after heading north. If you don't get a bonemass veg, you have to go exactly to BM's location in the south to find enough iron to get going, or very risky, somehow stumble across the one in the far east near plains and across the ocean. Trying to sail a lap around your starter island is going to be an exercise in frustration, and sailing around looking for iron on nearby islands would be maddening as well. Even if you score BM's location, its only 7 or so crypts, enough to make your armor and weapons but not even close to all you will need, so you still have to scout out another source.

I can imagine getting iron in that seed really easily.
Kill deer, delve Black Forest dungeons, you find the Veg for Elder. Look where the closest Elder is on that map. Two swamp crypts right next to that Elder altar :)

If you get lucky and one of them spawns a BM Veg, it'll send you to BM further north, where there's loads of crypts, so even an iron maniac would have it easy.
UnluckyNoob Sep 6, 2023 @ 7:29pm 
Originally posted by rodelis:
I wish I could find the video. Had a good list of annoyingly difficult seeds. Including one where you start on an island just big enough to sprint end to end with no food buffs. To get anywhere, you needed to figure out how to build a raft. It wasn't just a river separating spawn from everything else, it was smack dab in the middle of a large section of ocean.
That's amazing map for no boat beginners(FLOrida seed). Once you'll manage to escape that island without raft you'll be ready for everything.
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Date Posted: Sep 4, 2023 @ 4:49pm
Posts: 14