Mixed Missile Salvos with Rolloff Launchers?

[codepants]

Is this possible? If so, I can't seem to figure it out.

Let's say you have a Cargo Feeder with 4 MLS-2 Launchers and 2 different missile types in your magazine.

I want to fire 2 of each type of missile, so four missiles simultaneously.

I can do this with one ship if I make two weapon groups each with two rolloff launchers, hold fire, set weapon group one to fire missile type 1, weapon group 2 to fire missile type 2, then release hold fire. This works, but is obnoxious.

Regardless, this doesn't work in formation, as all the launchers are lumped into one weapon group, so giving one attack command causes all four on each ship to fire the same missile, regardless of how they are grouped on the individual ships. Even if you formation-hold fire and formation-fire one type, then the other type, then formation-release fire, it fires the one type from all four on each ship, then they need to cycle before the second type is fired.

Ideally, this would be possible using the exact same interface for firing mixed salvos from non-rolloff launchers—you just click the little plus buttons and you're good to go. No hold fire required.

Seems like a missing feature that rolloff launchers can't do mixed salvos. Or, what am I missing?

[Tuna]

If you load different missiles into the launchers then you can mix the salvos that way. Otherwise its intentional that you cant freely mix the missiles coming out of the MLS launchers, as its one of the tradeoffs of the type.

[codepants]

I don't understand why, if I have two MLS launchers, I can't launch different missiles from each one separately. Different missiles in sequence from the same launcher, sure. But different missiles from different launchers? That seems like a pretty nonsensical limitation ("tradeoff").

I thought the tradeoff of rolloff launchers was only being able to launch one per launcher at a time—not also that you could only launch one type of missile from every launcher if you launch more than one at a time.

[Cadia101]

Roll off can launch up to 4 missiles by launcher no ?

[Firestorm🗿]

You should be able to if you set your launchers in separate groups instead of just one.

[HungryHunter]

Step 1: Have two or more rolloff launchers in different groups.
Step 2: Toggle your ships firemode to "hold" to hold fire
Step 3: Order the mix of missiles you want to launch.
Step 4: Toggle to "fire at will" when you are ready with the setup and have a clear sight to the target/first waypoint.
Step 5: enjoy your workaround of the Mix-missile update that only benefits ANS launchsystems (at the moment). There is no other way.

[codepants]

Okay you are all missing some things I already described in my original post.

Originally posted by Cadia101:

Roll off can launch up to 4 missiles by launcher no ?

Yes, but I want to launch four DIFFERENT TYPES of missiles.

Originally posted by Firestorm🗿:

You should be able to if you set your launchers in separate groups instead of just one.

Tried this, but with each individual ship, I can only fire the groups separately (not as simultaneous salvos), and with a formation, they are grouped into one fire group and thus I can only fire one kind of missile from the single group.

Originally posted by HungryHunter:

Step 1: Have two or more rolloff launchers in different groups.
Step 2: Toggle your ships firemode to "hold" to hold fire
Step 3: Order the mix of missiles you want to launch.
Step 4: Toggle to "fire at will" when you are ready with the setup and have a clear sight to the target/first waypoint.
Step 5: enjoy your workaround of the Mix-missile update that only benefits ANS launchsystems (at the moment). There is no other way.

Thank you for clarifying that there is no other way.

[Tempest Fox3]

Have your MLS launchers in separate fire groups. Load each fire group with the missile type you wish to fire. When you fire Hold SHIFT. It will say "mixed load". Now when you fire 1 missile is is 1 missile per fire group. So if you have 4 fire groups it'll fire 4 missiles, 1 of each type from each individual group. Likewise if you fire 4 missiles it'll fire 4 from each fire group. (assuming it can)

[codepants]

How do you load without firing?

And can that be done with a formation or only per individual ship?

[HungryHunter]

Originally posted by codepants:

How do you load without firing?

And can that be done with a formation or only per individual ship?

Tempest Fox3 way of loading work only if the missile arnt fully loaded (yellow bar still filling). Ones its full only "hold fire" or very quick cancle clicking can change the missile load.
You also have to do this kind of setup for each ship so far i tested.

[Tempest Fox3]

Originally posted by codepants:

How do you load without firing?

And can that be done with a formation or only per individual ship?

Toggle Hold fire on the ship and then cancel the fire order. You have to set it up individually on each ship but once set up you can fire the entire formation using shift like you normally would.

[codepants]

I appreciate all these workarounds but it sounds like a "real" fix is still needed by the devs.

[HungryHunter]

Originally posted by codepants:

I appreciate all these workarounds but it sounds like a "real" fix is still needed by the devs.

There is no “fix” required, this is not broken, just user unfriendly.
All we need is some more ways to customize our weapons.
One way can be to be able to create ammobelts and ading more ammotypes in general.

[Magic]

As HungryHunter said, and besides, you can cancel the launch in the "hold" state, and later launch it to another ship.
But seriously for now there's very little need of mix salvo on rolloff launchers, it's more often used as a finisher for a crippled ship rather than decent PD penetrator

[Hardly]

One fun thing about MLS launchers, is if you use shift-right-click to issue a formation fire order for the MLS, every ship in the formation will fire whatever is loaded in its MLS.

So if you have one tug filled with arad/act, one with act/decoy, one with act/[wake], it doesn't care. If they're all in a formation, and you issue a formation MLS fire order, each ship will fire missiles, and hey presto, mixed salvo.

With a bulk liner or monitor where you may have many MLS, as mentioned, you can use hold fire, and cancelled fire orders, to load a specific type into each weapons group of MLS. Once again, issue a formation fire order (even if only 1 ship), and it will fire from every MLS on the ship, and you'll get a mixed salvo.

Put another way: when you do a shift- formation fire order, it will fire from *every* MLS in the formation, and if you have different things loaded into the various MLS, it will not care, but will dump what ever is loaded out into space.

I use this technique frequently for MLS tug blobs, as well as on MLS bulk freighters, in order to mix in a small number of missiles carrying decoys, for example.

The thing is, OSP tech is generally less flexible than ANS, it usually has a specific strength (with MLS, the ability to quickly launch many missiles, without programming channels or programming time), and a specific weakness - in this case, a limitation in the ability to rapidly swap between missile types - to counterbalance that strength. You see a similar pattern with the OSP guns - big autoloader, to rapidly fire a lot of shells, followed by an extended reload cycle, limiting the ability to quickly switch ammo types or pressure multiple targets.

[codepants]

Originally posted by HungryHunter:

There is no “fix” required, this is not broken, just user unfriendly.
All we need is some more ways to customize our weapons.
One way can be to be able to create ammobelts and ading more ammotypes in general.

If you want to call if "user unfriendly" that's fine, but I'm going to call it "needs a fix." Or maybe we could mutually agree on "needs betterment?"

Originally posted by magic:

As HungryHunter said, and besides, you can cancel the launch in the "hold" state, and later launch it to another ship.

As I said, I don't want to have to use the "hold" state. "If you just click 50 times, you can do what you want" is a workaround, not a solution. If your tire is leaky, and your mechanic says "just pull over every 5 minutes and put some air in it," that's a workaround, not a solution.

Originally posted by magic:

But seriously for now there's very little need of mix salvo on rolloff launchers, it's more often used as a finisher for a crippled ship rather than decent PD penetrator

What if I want to use rolloffs in a different way?

Originally posted by Hardly:

One fun thing about MLS launchers, is if you use shift-right-click to issue a formation fire order for the MLS, every ship in the formation will fire whatever is loaded in its MLS.

So if you have one tug filled with arad/act, one with act/decoy, one with act/[wake], it doesn't care. If they're all in a formation, and you issue a formation MLS fire order, each ship will fire missiles, and hey presto, mixed salvo.

This is actually really useful. Thank you!