☣️Resident Evil 2: Classic Fixed Camera Mod🧟

[Apexnexius]

Finally fixed camera classic Resident Evil (RE2 Mod)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kYmEu4x60o
https://www.nexusmods.com/residentevil22019/mods/1446
Modder alphaZomega made it happen!

Enjoy Biohazard / Resident Evil gamers !

[mdesaleah]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Автор сообщения: mdesaleah

Yep.

Not only do fixed cameras provide more artistic settings and strong atmosphere, but it also lets games generally look much better.

RE1R still holds up due to the 2D backgrounds being very well made, while also allowing the actual core resources and graphics to be taken up by the characters and enemies.

Same thing applies today if it was done. It would allow for far better looking characters and enemies.

Cause lets be real here, the current RE2R characters have already started to age poorly.

Again: WE CAN DO THAT QUALITY IN REAL TIME.

Ever played Code Veronica?

"We can do it in real time" is probably something you would have said back then too xD.

Just cause graphics "look good" now, doesnt meant pre-rendered backgrounds cant still be used to provide advantages in other areas with very minimal downsides. Less intensive in environments while keeping the same level of detail and allows for improved character models.

[Seamus]

Автор сообщения: mdesaleah

Ever played Code Veronica?

Yes. 24 years ago.

How exactly is that a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ yardstick vs a MODERN title?

You realize graphics have changed in 24 years, right?

[mdesaleah]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Автор сообщения: mdesaleah

Ever played Code Veronica?

Yes. 24 years ago.

How exactly is that a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ yardstick vs a MODERN title?

You realize graphics have changed in 24 years, right?

And you realize that with every generation theres always a "the graphics will never get better than this" crowd right?

You're just filling the role many people said way back during the Dreamcast for CV.

[Seamus]

Автор сообщения: mdesaleah

And you realize that with every generation theres always a "the graphics will never get better than this" crowd right?

You're just filling the role many people said way back during the Dreamcast for CV.

And that's not an answer.

I'm not saying code veronica's 3d environments look as good as remake/0's pre-rendered scenes.

I'm not the one that brought up the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ game in the first place.

I'm asking on what planet at 24 year old dreamcast game is a viable yardstick vs modern titles.

[Fire Angel]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Again: WE CAN DO THAT QUALITY IN REAL TIME.

Doing the game as realtime render rather than pre-rendered does not prevent fixed camera angles from being used. It DOES however mean that the game won't have a fixed resolution it's intended to run at and the backgrounds will look pixelated above that resolution.

Have none of you ever actually looked at how rendering works?

These games are made for console so no matter how advanced a PC is at rendering everything in-game if consoles are a few steps behind it would benefit both parties if for an official fixed camera version of this game to put all the detail and crazy high textures into the characters and moving objects while the backgrounds are crisply pre-rendered. Imagine if all that work rendering the RPD was instead put into Leon and a few zombies. The consoles would be able to handle it like a piece of cake, unlike if everything was rendered in game. Many sacrifices to visuals would have to be made to render everything in game and that would carry over to the PC version.

[Seamus]

Автор сообщения: Fire Angel

These games are made for console so no matter how advanced a PC is at rendering everything in-game if consoles are a few steps behind it would benefit both parties if for an official fixed camera version of this game to put all the detail and crazy high textures into the characters and moving objects while the backgrounds are crisply pre-rendered. Imagine if all that work rendering the RPD was instead put into Leon and a few zombies. The consoles would be able to handle it like a piece of cake, unlike if everything was rendered in game. Many sacrifices to visuals would have to be made to render everything in game and that would carry over to the PC version.

Doing the backgrounds as pre-rendered would help absolutely nothing. They didn't compromise on character models due to the environment rendering in this game.

The characters look the way they do because capcom did them via photogrammetry rather than hand sculpts.

They wouldn't magically change their style for doing them with pre-rendered backgrounds.

So you going to actually answer the question at some point? Because you haven't.

[Apexnexius]

@ Seamus

You seem to be in the practical "good enough" crowd of developing.

But a lot of us fixed camera fans want 3d model graphics that are pushing the limit of what is possible!

Working with both Unity and now Unreal Engine on a daily basis.
You don't seem to understand team developer resource allocation, and a dev team's artistic goals for a game.
You're arguments are mute based off single dev or cost effective team development of a game - catering to expected graphical standards of today's contemporary released games.
You are in the mindset of "we do things the way we do because this is how we do things the way we do" (cost effectiveness, cooperate expectations and budgeting).
Your counterargument in circular.

Set your mind free from the constraints of real time 3D environments.

Are you actually aware of how good we able to make a player controlled 3D character look these days before removing details, fluid facial expression animation and fabric textures before putting the 3D character model into a real time 3D environment?

Do you know how far some of the best artist have come working on realistic indoor close up camera in-door environment and outdoor foliage? And how to we can implement realistic lighting and shadows.
You don't seem to be aware of the trade offs going from a fixed camera to real time 3D environment.

Purchase a theater ticket to a modern movie blockbuster and think hard about how much resources in a dev team it is possible to allocate into a fixed camera Resident Evil game with revolutionary high quality character models and fixed camera environments.

Set your mind free from the constraints of real time 3D environments for a moment.


EDIT:
Do you understand how good we are able to make Jill Valentine look these days by letting her walk towards the camera point of view down a indoor hallway by using a fixed camera pov? i bet you don't.

[Seamus]

Автор сообщения: Apexnexius

@ Seamus :Northmen::Northmen:

You seem to be in the practical "good enough" crowd of developing.

But a lot of us fixed camera fans want 3d model graphics that are pushing the limit of what is possible!

And if you had any vague understanding of how rendering works you'd know that doing the backgrounds as prerendered has its own limitations you're completely ignoring.

Like fixed asset resolution.

And inability to have a dynamic scene.

I'll ignore the rest of your idiotic rambling as it's the usual "I'm totally a dev and know what I'm talking about!" garbage.

You also don't seem to understand the difference between fixed camera and pre-rendered. They aren't the same thing.

You don't have to pre-render the scene as a static image to do a fixed camera angle.

If you actually spent time doing 3d work you'd know that.

[Apexnexius]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Автор сообщения: Apexnexius

@ Seamus

You seem to be in the practical "good enough" crowd of developing.

But a lot of us fixed camera fans want 3d model graphics that are pushing the limit of what is possible!

And if you had any vague understanding of how rendering works you'd know that doing the backgrounds as prerendered has its own limitations you're completely ignoring.

Like fixed asset resolution.

And inability to have a dynamic scene.

I'll ignore the rest of your idiotic rambling as it's the usual "I'm totally a dev and know what I'm talking about!" garbage.

You also don't seem to understand the difference between fixed camera and pre-rendered. They aren't the same thing.

You don't have to pre-render the scene as a static image to do a fixed camera angle.

If you actually spent time doing 3d work you'd know that.

I'm not going to engage a quarrelsome person.
Have fun 3D modeling with time constraints.
We're done. I'm out.

[Seamus]

You didn't engage to begin with.

You tried to sound smart and said things that made no actual sense to anyone who actually understands tech.

[deidian]

And this hasn't actually touched the topic of "fixed cameras" at all: it was just about whether is or not nonsense in the current days doing 2D prerendered backgrounds and compose the 3D characters on top...

[Seamus]

I don't get it either, tbh. Every time I asked they'd just point at code veronica as though a dreamcast game somehow matters in 2024.

[dece870717]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Автор сообщения: Apexnexius

@ Seamus :Northmen::Northmen:

You seem to be in the practical "good enough" crowd of developing.

But a lot of us fixed camera fans want 3d model graphics that are pushing the limit of what is possible!

And if you had any vague understanding of how rendering works you'd know that doing the backgrounds as prerendered has its own limitations you're completely ignoring.

Like fixed asset resolution.

And inability to have a dynamic scene.

I'll ignore the rest of your idiotic rambling as it's the usual "I'm totally a dev and know what I'm talking about!" garbage.

You also don't seem to understand the difference between fixed camera and pre-rendered. They aren't the same thing.

You don't have to pre-render the scene as a static image to do a fixed camera angle.

If you actually spent time doing 3d work you'd know that.

I've just read through this whole topic, and it is an interesting conversation to read. I grew up (37 years old now) playing all the originals and the first RE remake and RE 0, I more so side with the pre-rendered/video file type backgrounds in this discussion, but the reasons may be more so based on a kind of intuitive assuming it would look better, not a hard deep thinking about it.

Seamus, I think you'll find the pre-rendered sentiment somewhat common, https://www.reddit.com/r/residentevil/comments/rx0cqj/remake_still_looks_gorgeous_20_years_later/

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/yy9m2d/resident_evil_1_remake_came_out_in_2002_resident/

I'm not sure about whether it would actually be better or not, I lack the development/graphical and etc background information necessary to really get a definitive conviction about the matter. All the arguments being made here for pre-rendered resonate, and on the surface, seem good/convincing. I'm sure there's some people in the game development scene that could answer this definitively, it'd be interesting to see what they would say. Someone needs to email Capcoms development/Resident Evil creators department and demand an answer, lol.

[Seamus]

Автор сообщения: dece870717

I've just read through this whole topic, and it is an interesting conversation to read. I grew up (37 years old now) playing all the originals and the first RE remake and RE 0, I more so side with the pre-rendered/video file type backgrounds in this discussion, but the reasons may be more so based on a kind of intuitive assuming it would look better, not a hard deep thinking about it.

Seamus, I think you'll find the pre-rendered sentiment somewhat common, https://www.reddit.com/r/residentevil/comments/rx0cqj/remake_still_looks_gorgeous_20_years_later/

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/yy9m2d/resident_evil_1_remake_came_out_in_2002_resident/

I'm not sure about whether it would actually be better or not, I lack the development/graphical and etc background information necessary to really get a definitive conviction about the matter. All the arguments being made here for pre-rendered resonate, and on the surface, seem good/convincing. I'm sure there's some people in the game development scene that could answer this definitively, it'd be interesting to see what they would say. Someone needs to email Capcoms development/Resident Evil creators department and demand an answer, lol.

I'm aware the sentiment exists. I'm saying it makes no sense because we can do that imagery without being a static pre rendered scene.

It accomplishes nothing these days. Doing fixed camera angles doesn't require them. There's just no upside to it at this point.

As I said, the pre-rendered backgrounds only exist for the resolution they're rendered for. Want to use a higher resolution? Enjoy noticeable artifacting and pixelization.

Want to use an ultrawide monitor? Enjoy black bars because there's no visual data to show when making the image wider.

Want to have an animation happen to not have it be 100% just a static image? Cut in a video file that comes with its own shortcomings like compression artifacts making it stand out from the pre rendered background.

It's all a lot of damn nostalgia goggles.

[dece870717]

Автор сообщения: Seamus

Автор сообщения: dece870717

I've just read through this whole topic, and it is an interesting conversation to read. I grew up (37 years old now) playing all the originals and the first RE remake and RE 0, I more so side with the pre-rendered/video file type backgrounds in this discussion, but the reasons may be more so based on a kind of intuitive assuming it would look better, not a hard deep thinking about it.

Seamus, I think you'll find the pre-rendered sentiment somewhat common, https://www.reddit.com/r/residentevil/comments/rx0cqj/remake_still_looks_gorgeous_20_years_later/

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/yy9m2d/resident_evil_1_remake_came_out_in_2002_resident/

I'm not sure about whether it would actually be better or not, I lack the development/graphical and etc background information necessary to really get a definitive conviction about the matter. All the arguments being made here for pre-rendered resonate, and on the surface, seem good/convincing. I'm sure there's some people in the game development scene that could answer this definitively, it'd be interesting to see what they would say. Someone needs to email Capcoms development/Resident Evil creators department and demand an answer, lol.

I'm aware the sentiment exists. I'm saying it makes no sense because we can do that imagery without being a static pre rendered scene.

It accomplishes nothing these days. Doing fixed camera angles doesn't require them. There's just no upside to it at this point.

As I said, the pre-rendered backgrounds only exist for the resolution they're rendered for. Want to use a higher resolution? Enjoy noticeable artifacting and pixelization.

Want to use an ultrawide monitor? Enjoy black bars because there's no visual data to show when making the image wider.

Want to have an animation happen to not have it be 100% just a static image? Cut in a video file that comes with its own shortcomings like compression artifacts making it stand out from the pre rendered background.

It's all a lot of damn nostalgia goggles.

Great points, thanks. Listing out the various cons definitely helps me look at it a bit more objectively.