Six Ages: Ride Like the Wind
SPOILERS Orlanthi vs. Hyalorings/Rams vs. Riders BIG END GAME SPOILERS
I'm just gonna say it.

Hyalorings are better than Orlanthi in every way and I'm sad that they'll inevitably be subsumed into Orlanthi culture. Consider:

1. Steppe people are cooler than hill people, and less overdone.
2. Riders have a unique look. How many times have you seen that weird far central Asian phenotype with epicanthic folds but light hair in fiction?
3. Horses>Cows
4. Hyalorings are actually free. Orlanthi are a bunch of hypocrites. They worship a god of change but are staunch traditionalists. And as my Raven advisor once said in an event "Look at me, I'm Orlanth God of Freedom! Who will buy my slaves?!"
5. Hyalorings have their own gods, they don't just have to steal everyone else's. Storm Tribe is a bunch of dilettantes. We can see new stories instead of retread ground!
6. Elmal the King>Elmal the Loyal Thane>Yelmalio the made up cold sun that got his ass kicked by everyone.
7. Osara>Vinga. Actual origin and place in the pantheon with a character arc in everything, instead of just a placeholder for female clan members that like to fight.
8. Raven>Eurmal. He/she does the things you must do but can't. Eurmal just pointlessly betrays you all the time.
9. Horse archers are used by only the most successful of pre-modern empires. Shield walls are used by every little pissant clan in history.
10. Warm comfy hats.

Seriously though. I hope the eventual vanishing of their way of life and outlook is slow so I can enjoy them as long as I can in the coming ages. It's sad to think that eventually the only thing left of them is that one weird clan in Dragon Pass that worships Elmal instead of Orlanth.
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I thought the guys that ended up becoming Praxians had already branched off our group of riders? I could easily be mistaken though, I don't know the setting as well as others.

Also, are our descendants Rams by the next game? They still looked like kind of a mix to me, at least going by their appearance and outfits. A little darker skinned, face shape changed a bit. But they don't look like the Rams in Ride Like the Wind. Although one has a Death rune on their adviser portrait and the Hyalorings don't yet have a Death god.
Автор сообщения: lyreofsheliak

And re: the tabletop clan creation questionaire: That last option ("It was lucky that we lived in Heortland at the time.") always cracks me up. Although also--is it possible to get elemental affiliations other than Earth and Storm? I think I managed that once, but then I kept trying to get Darkness/Fire/Water (for Argan Argar, Elmal, or Heler) and failing, so I'm not sure what's going on.

As a total tangent, this game makes me wonder how the Orlanthi got worship of Heler and especially Argan Argar--how exactly did some Orlanthi pick up worship of a troll god? If the Foreigner's Wedding is a reflection of Beren/Redalda on the mortal plane, what mortal events reflect the myth of Argan Argar and Esrola?

Its definitely possible to have a dark/water/fire main elemental rune via that questionnaire, but you have to be pretty wishy-washy with the questions that give storm and earth points. Its very easy to get a majority of storm, by design, but the only question that gives dark/fire/water is the one about the remnant peoples

Details are light on Heler, but we know that his worship came as part of a great confederation of the vingkotlings and his people during the great floods. It seems to imply that the two peoples were actually in a long term war but somehow not only found peace, but moved in together but we don't get a reason why.

Argan Argar though has a lot about him, and basically represents the special relationship the people of Esrolia have with the trolls of the Shadow Plateau. One of the things that helped kick off the great darkness in the region is that there was a massive kinstrife and civil war amongst the vingkotling tribe of the Kodigvari, the high king tribe at the time, called the Sword and Helm Saga. And then to make things worse, the women that stayed home are sometimes said to have butchered some of the survivors of that civil war as part of the political takeover, instituting the tradition of matriarchy in Esrolia. They set it up so that Ernalda is Queen of the gods, and her many lovers are given, at best, the title of Husband-Protector, with who that is specifically varying based on who the political establishment wants to cozy up to (its usually orlanth but not always), in the...manipulative way that Ernaldans can be sometimes, very "get those other poor bastards to fight our battles for us and we come out on top".

At the tail end of the darkness the trolls are basically the species/race who fared the best and in a lot of places humans only survive as second class citizens in troll political entities. The troll demi-god Ezkankekko (son of Argan Argar and Esrola, at least claimed so) has a fairly strong kingdom based out of the shadow plateau in the grey age and he politics his way into an overlord position over the bay area and south dragon pass by simultaneously being a troll and not a troll, so he can use his influence to claim his father as one of the Husband-Protectors that was here to defend the motherland while Orlanth was off in the underworld or fighting chaos.

Long story short, among other things Ezkankekko teaches humans to be more like trolls and trolls to be more like humans, even to the point where they can shapeshift between one form and the other. They call that tribe the Kitori and they were the favored caste in his empire for government positions like tax collectors, which caused no little strife with the local Orlanthi and eventually lead to repeated wars between the Kitori and the Heortlings. If you have a group of humans who's main male god is Argan Argar, its very likely that they have at least Kitori ancestry, though they might have fallen out from the main Nightcult.
I am fairly sure that the Praxians are someone else--they're descended from that guy fighting the lion on the god plane, and not related to the Riders except possibly through the questers you lose to that event.

The Grazers/Horse-Spawn are descended from the Pure Horse clans, I think. At this point the Pure Horse Clans are sort of separate from the other Riders, but it's seen as "this is a form of religious devotion that some Rider clans in every large group of clans are going to go for" rather than a separate culture. They still intermarry with other clans, and I think technically clans can still go from regular to Pure Horse and possibly the other way around. (Your clan can't, but your people don't seem to think it's as implausible as building a city, for example. It's just a bad idea for you in particular because [s]the game isn't set up for it[/s] you would have to have slaves and your ancestors would be Very Unhappy.)
Автор сообщения: rwmipi
I thought the guys that ended up becoming Praxians had already branched off our group of riders? I could easily be mistaken though, I don't know the setting as well as others.

If we ever had a connection at all, yes. The only real connection we have with Prax is via Hyalor's dad Yamsur, but there's basically nothing written about him in the first place. You could make some sort of presumption that that means that riding, as a technological breakthrough, happened in Genert's Garden and came to Dara Happa via human immigration but its all just guesswork.

Yelorna is referred to by Praxians as one of the Invader deities, alongside Yelmalio and other assoiciated sun and star gods, so worship of her doesn't seem to be native, or at least isn't recognized as such by the third age.

Also, just in general, if we assume that gloranthan gods are real and have an existence outside of their current worshipers, it shouldn't be impossible for the same deity to show up in multiple cultures independently, even with different names.

But she does fill the same niche as Osara and Vinga, an outlet for women constrained by a patriarchal expectation of what their lives should be. I think we will probably be able to make a better case for that when the Gods and Goddesses of Glorantha book comes out.
Yep, those are Vingan warriors in those two drawings.
(and hard yes, I cannot disagree with OP. Riders FTW.)
Автор сообщения: Merlkir
Yep, those are Vingan warriors in those two drawings.
(and hard yes, I cannot disagree with OP. Riders FTW.)
Are they? Or are they just Orlanthi women with red hair and motion runes? Motion is one of Orlanth's main things.
Well. I drew them as Vingans. ;)
Автор сообщения: Merlkir
Well. I drew them as Vingans. ;)
Oh. Had no idea you worked on the game.
I am however told that it's not specifically said if they are Vingans or not. So feel free to speculate. ;)
Well still, it's a good indication.
Автор сообщения: El Perrito Super Gordito
Its definitely possible to have a dark/water/fire main elemental rune via that questionnaire, but you have to be pretty wishy-washy with the questions that give storm and earth points. Its very easy to get a majority of storm, by design, but the only question that gives dark/fire/water is the one about the remnant peoples

That may've been what was tripping me up--I thought that the dark/fire/water points were from picking Argan Argar or Heler as a god or Beren and Redalda as ancestors. I expect I was making a lot of Orlanth-like choices in some of the areas I didn't think were directly relevant. (Ah, is there a list of which actions give which points anywhere?)
david  [Разработчик] 5 дек. 2019 г. в 17:00 
Are you looking at Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes p.37-58?
Отредактировано david; 5 дек. 2019 г. в 17:00
Oh, yeah you were right actually, the online version of it does count the choice of first awakened god as a check in a certain rune. I was looking at the print version in Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes which actually lays out the math behind it, I wasn't actually sure if it was possible without checking but didn't notice that the online version specifically notes that change

there's also the pdf version that they put up for free download download[www.drivethrurpg.com] but that, again, doesn't have the math part of it. I'm not sure if that they ever made available without the book.
I mean, on one hand, I'm totally on board with the horse thing and having a Lawful Good patron god who actually LEADS instead of running around drinking and killing ♥♥♥♥. Orlanthi are ♥♥♥♥-smeared barbarians, and they were even in the first game.
But on the other hand, where is my healing goddess heroquest? I wanna be part of the coolness that is Erissa, just like I was with Chalana Arroy in KODP. C'mon, A Sharp. Lemme give Erissa a tub of icecream. We'll sit in the story tent and ♥♥♥♥♥ about men. It'll be great.
Отредактировано moonlite; 6 дек. 2019 г. в 9:02
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Дата создания: 30 ноя. 2019 г. в 20:24
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