I have never won a civ 4 game, i need tips!

[Please]

Hi, i was hoping a experienced civ IV player could take a minute to explain to me what i am doing wrong whilist playing Civ IV, as i never won a game, and well, i would like too.

I usually start out worker, warrior, settler and continue doing this until i have about 3- 4 cities, as i chop down the forests for that little production jump with settlers and wonders like the great wall and oracle. After that, i am top score, and then fall off HARD. I don't know what is happening, but, money somehow falls low that my research goes to 80% and then 60% then 40%, i always manage to keep it at 40% if not 60%. I build a medicore amount of troops to not loose a city against the warmongering AI, and dedicate cities for money, one for production, and so on. I play on the standard noble dificulty..

By the time we reach the medieval period i have been attacked 4 times by different civs and i just cannot seem to get gold back up, apparently there is a inflation system i don't know how to control. By this point in the game, i litterally begin to stagger, and loose momentum that i get early game. eventually getting attacked constantly by warmongering civs until i am defeated before i even get to the next age.

If anyone could help me by writing in detail what the hell i should be doing after early game, and, how not to get constantly attacked by the AI, i would really really reaaly appreciate it!

[Scathe]

hard to say what specific thing might be holding you up, chopping forests is good and all, but your workers need to get tile improvements into their priority pretty high. building a farm on a food resource and a mine on a gold or gem might go a long way to fixxing your problem if you're just spam chopping forests.

working unimproved tiles is one of the top problems players have, you need a lot of cottages too eventually for your economy, need a lot of workers to build up improvements. I might be able to give more tips in a bit, trying to think what you're doing wrong.

I don't personally ever use the great wall, building too many wonders and not enough military and workers may be an issue.

[Scathe]

https://steamcommunity.com/app/8800/discussions/0/1640915206464263438/

some overall good general advice is given in the thread I linked.
edit - especially the advice given by ghpstage.

[Scathe]

it can also help, though this is probably a more controversial piece of advice... it can help if you reject maps until you have good city sites for your first couple cities. you are looking for food resources like corn, rice, wheat, cow, and pig, as well as currency resources like gold or gems. starting with good food and good currency helps immensely to get ahead in the tech race and stay ahead.

these cities should also have a few sources of production, this is not as important due to slavery, but I personally always try to have it, so a few hills/plains or hills/grassland, copper, or cow/plains, as some examples. the cities should not be overloaded with these tiles, most tiles should be grassland or flood plain, for cottages.

[Please]

Originally posted by Scathe:

it can also help, though this is probably a more controversial piece of advice... it can help if you reject maps until you have good city sites for your first couple cities. you are looking for food resources like corn, rice, wheat, cow, and pig, as well as currency resources like gold or gems. starting with good food and good currency helps immensely to get ahead in the tech race and stay ahead.

these cities should also have a few sources of production, this is not as important due to slavery, but I personally always try to have it, so a few hills/plains or hills/grassland, copper, or cow/plains, as some examples. the cities should not be overloaded with these tiles, most tiles should be grassland or flood plain, for cottages.

Hey, thank you for taking a minute!

Upon reflection of what you type'd up, it seems i have very little workers, i usually don't have more than 6, and i don't build that much cottages, since the cities tend to be focused, they take a long time to grow the population say, where a city is surrounded by only hills with mines in the early game before machinery. I think it has something to do with this that performance is falling short.

I shall definitly check out that link, thank you!

[Scathe]

Overwhelmingly the most common mistake made at lower levels is to allow a civ to work a significant number of unimproved tiles, and more often than not this is caused by a combination of not having enough workers as well as not using them efficiently. As you note, its not easy at any level. I never got it perfect when I played regularly at Immortal.
The general advice for people playing around noble-prince is to go for around 1.5 per city, and while that is always sufficient to win at Noble/Prince 'optimal' does vary. If you end up with a small, compact empire your not going to need as many, but if you expand rapidly, or worse, go on a conquering spree your going to need a whole heap more than you would otherwise.

that is the important quote from ghpstage in the thread I linked. 1.5 workers per city as a rule of thumb. but getting the number of workers right is hard on any level.

[Scathe]

every city needs at least one food resource. if you don't have a creative leader, it is best for this food resource to be in the inner ring of the city's tiles so it can use it fast. if you have terrain with too much hills and no food, it is a bad site for a city.

try rejecting maps until your first 3 city sites all have two food resources, and your capital has gold or gems.

another controversial piece of advice - try playing with unrestricted leaders option in custom game options, and try playing with willem van orange leader and rome civilization. rome's praetorians may give you an advantage in early wars, and willem van orange is the leader with my favorite combo of traits, creative and financial. financial is in my opinion the strongest leader trait, while creative is down the list a bit, but easy to use, it makes city placement decisions alot easier for me, since you don't have to worry about how your early game cities will expand their borders and use all their tiles.

[Scathe]

https://steamcommunity.com/app/8800/discussions/0/1751268382256613476/

in that thread some of the analysis is a bit more advanced, but if you can follow what we're talking about, it may help you understand what a good map and good city sites can look like.

[Please]

Originally posted by Scathe:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/8800/discussions/0/1751268382256613476/

in that thread some of the analysis is a bit more advanced, but if you can follow what we're talking about, it may help you understand what a good map and good city sites can look like.

Its amazing how much your helping me! Wish other games had such amazing people like you on these older gems of games! Truely a treasure.

Another thing i noticed reading your link and above, is that your city placement and tiles worked are minimal, i notice a lot of open tiles, and your city's do indeed all have atleast one or two food sources with minimal roads. I am completely stunned that at 950bc you have cities that size as Rome, which is my goto civ at the moment, mainly due to warmongering AI's those preatorians really are good!
I also got a good idea on expansion thanks to you, 3 cities till 950Bc is a good point by the looks of it, expanding in AC looks optimal.

I would like to ask, if you don't mind, how do you play say, Rome in the medieval ages, what do you usually do in that period, i struggle alot dealing with the AI at that time. I would love to read your opinion! :]

[Scathe]

in fact, in that thread, I did receive criticism from other good players for not expanding fast enough, and at 950 bc I did have 4 cities, not 3. but yeah, glad you found that helpful. you definately need monarchy fast to cover 9 happiness for a city that fast. hereditary rule is great.

I got criticism in that game for not using slavery as much as I could have, which would have lowered my population, but, that game was a win on monarch, so trying to emulate it may help :)

I am usually the first one to discover civil service and machinery, this allows me to slow tech rates to like 20% for a few turns to generate lots of gold to convert lots of axemen to macemen. the advanced unit usually wipes out a civilization still defending itsself with archers and axemen. usually this gets me to around 8 cities, then I make peace, which is easier because I have the strongest army strength on the map so AI are more likely to want peace. I rush technologies faster than the AI, I rush to rifling and wipe out my continent with riflemen. my enemies are usually still in medieval tech level when I wipe them out with my riflemen.

I can't understate the importance of cottages on your tech rates.

[Please]

Originally posted by Scathe:

in fact, in that thread, I did receive criticism from other good players for not expanding fast enough, and at 950 bc I did have 4 cities, not 3. but yeah, glad you found that helpful. you definately need monarchy fast to cover 9 happiness for a city that fast. hereditary rule is great.

I got criticism in that game for not using slavery as much as I could have, which would have lowered my population, but, that game was a win on monarch, so trying to emulate it may help :)

I am usually the first one to discover civil service and machinery, this allows me to slow tech rates to like 20% for a few turns to generate lots of gold to convert lots of axemen to macemen. the advanced unit usually wipes out a civilization still defending itsself with archers and axemen. usually this gets me to around 8 cities, then I make peace, which is easier because I have the strongest army strength on the map so AI are more likely to want peace. I rush technologies faster than the AI, I rush to rifling and wipe out my continent with riflemen. my enemies are usually still in medieval tech level when I wipe them out with my riflemen.

I can't understate the importance of cottages on your tech rates.

My bad for that, perhaps a re-read is in order if i messed that up, Thanks Scathe, i will apply these tips in a new session soon. Much love men

[red255]

tried to make a guide once. realized how much of my strat had the policy of saving and loading, or otherwise random factor manipulation. felt bad.

anyways god knows your map settings, so I'll assume mine.

you start out with one city, so you want to scout, so your first build is a scout or warrior, and you send them out to see if you have any neighbors who are too close, or good places to build cities and goody huts.

the goody huts we generally save before opening and only really get good things from them, Techs or Gold mostly. Maps are a certain reload. hate maps.

so then We find a rival within say 10-15 squares of us and not on a hill, we are going to warrior chump him to get rid of him and use his capitol as our first city. so make a bunch of warriors, maybe get them from huts, if you can get to him after the buddahism and hinduism is researched and before Slavery this is best, and then you just send your men to die and hopefully win. if you can send the warriors to the tundra to kill some wolves to level up to city Raider 2 this is much easier.

we then take one city and have it make wonders and the other one is making workers and settlers.

we are looking for a city location, ideally you want to find some city with 4 or more flood plains and plop down a city there and cottage it up, 3 cottage flood plain cities are good for your economy.

so now we have two capitols and 3 flood plains commerce cities, now we want to start grabbing resources. Copper, iron, Horse. we probably have some of those things from our two capitols,

Gold, Gems, Ivory, happy stuff is great.

but yeah make some cities where we can get some serious food and hammer for production.

middle age, we want to make the sistine chapel, the university of sankore, the apolstalic palce and the spiral minneret, and then use slavery to whip out whatever state religion we have. temples and monestaries everywhere.

we also want to spread religion to the commerce cities so they can build monestaries.

so that every religion we found/or find should be +10% research in our commerce cities

we should also try early to get some great priests with our excess food, Oracle and Temple of artemis help for this but just build a bunch of temples somewhere with alot of food and then set the citizens to priest to work on a great priest and make great priest building to fix commerce in a holy city.

usually I found Confusionism because code of laws helps with the expansion of an empire early on.

once I have my 3 or 4 religion wonders my economy is golden, so we make an army for taking over the world.

which is 8 trebuchet, 10 macemen, 2 longbowmen per city, 2 crossbowmen, 2 pikes, 2 knights.

and then just make more trebuchets, and longbowmen. Trebuchets are City Raider 2. (barracks + vassalage.)

you just throw the trebs at the enemy cities after taking off the defense, after the trebs are done the macemen should easily win and gather XP. take the city, Heal, leave two longbowmen there, leave two longbowmen there, replace your lost trebs, and move on.

spread your religion, whip your temple and monestary and courthouse.

and you should easily take over their region without a strong hit to your economy.

this should allow you to expand until you collect the entire island. after a certain point you just need to take a few cities and get the enemy to capitulate. this means you've defeated them for the purpose of a conquest victory, so if you capitulate all the other civs you win.

and its much faster than hunting down every city they own and rebuilding them.

they can still win a cultural or space race victory. they will vote for you in a diplomatic victory setting. but yeah after it becomes likely you'll easily win with what you have just capitulate the enemy.

[Please]

Originally posted by red255:

tried to make a guide once. realized how much of my strat had the policy of saving and loading, or otherwise random factor manipulation. felt bad.

anyways god knows your map settings, so I'll assume mine.

you start out with one city, so you want to scout, so your first build is a scout or warrior, and you send them out to see if you have any neighbors who are too close, or good places to build cities and goody huts.

the goody huts we generally save before opening and only really get good things from them, Techs or Gold mostly. Maps are a certain reload. hate maps.

so then We find a rival within say 10-15 squares of us and not on a hill, we are going to warrior chump him to get rid of him and use his capitol as our first city. so make a bunch of warriors, maybe get them from huts, if you can get to him after the buddahism and hinduism is researched and before Slavery this is best, and then you just send your men to die and hopefully win. if you can send the warriors to the tundra to kill some wolves to level up to city Raider 2 this is much easier.

we then take one city and have it make wonders and the other one is making workers and settlers.

we are looking for a city location, ideally you want to find some city with 4 or more flood plains and plop down a city there and cottage it up, 3 cottage flood plain cities are good for your economy.

so now we have two capitols and 3 flood plains commerce cities, now we want to start grabbing resources. Copper, iron, Horse. we probably have some of those things from our two capitols,

Gold, Gems, Ivory, happy stuff is great.

but yeah make some cities where we can get some serious food and hammer for production.

middle age, we want to make the sistine chapel, the university of sankore, the apolstalic palce and the spiral minneret, and then use slavery to whip out whatever state religion we have. temples and monestaries everywhere.

we also want to spread religion to the commerce cities so they can build monestaries.

so that every religion we found/or find should be +10% research in our commerce cities

we should also try early to get some great priests with our excess food, Oracle and Temple of artemis help for this but just build a bunch of temples somewhere with alot of food and then set the citizens to priest to work on a great priest and make great priest building to fix commerce in a holy city.

usually I found Confusionism because code of laws helps with the expansion of an empire early on.

once I have my 3 or 4 religion wonders my economy is golden, so we make an army for taking over the world.

which is 8 trebuchet, 10 macemen, 2 longbowmen per city, 2 crossbowmen, 2 pikes, 2 knights.

and then just make more trebuchets, and longbowmen. Trebuchets are City Raider 2. (barracks + vassalage.)

you just throw the trebs at the enemy cities after taking off the defense, after the trebs are done the macemen should easily win and gather XP. take the city, Heal, leave two longbowmen there, leave two longbowmen there, replace your lost trebs, and move on.

spread your religion, whip your temple and monestary and courthouse.

and you should easily take over their region without a strong hit to your economy.

this should allow you to expand until you collect the entire island. after a certain point you just need to take a few cities and get the enemy to capitulate. this means you've defeated them for the purpose of a conquest victory, so if you capitulate all the other civs you win.

and its much faster than hunting down every city they own and rebuilding them.

they can still win a cultural or space race victory. they will vote for you in a diplomatic victory setting. but yeah after it becomes likely you'll easily win with what you have just capitulate the enemy.

Why thank you! Also a good one, i will apply it also.

[MasoMaat: De Hoge-Ping Krijger]

I have roughly the same problem
But every time i get in a fight with any enemy lower lvl higher doesnt matter
My unit losses! Even in a 1v3!

[Please]

I managed to conquer my first continent, clean game start to that point yesterday. All thanks to you guys!

This game is so much fun!

[red255]

Originally posted by Maso25:

I have roughly the same problem
But every time i get in a fight with any enemy lower lvl higher doesnt matter
My unit losses! Even in a 1v3!

hold ALT to see odds. you want your attack value to be twice theres for a 100% chance of winning.

if you don't have 99.99 chance of winning, sacrifice your sacrifice units. (or use bombers after you get them) to do collateral damage. strip away the defense and do collateral damage to lower their HP.

if its just one unit vs your guys you attack horse with spears, you attack melee with crossbowmen, you attack archers with ....usually they are in cities so city raider.

you have an enemy unit sitting in a hill with a forest, its going to be messy killing him. we need to get him to leave the forest.