This or Total War 3K?

[Silva]

How these titles contrast and which one do you like more? My budget allows me to pick only one for now.

I'm a fan of both series, loved RTK 4 and 8 back in SNES and PS2 days, and Shogun 2 is among my fave strategy games. My recent forays in each series was Thrones of Britannia and Nobunaga Taishi (found them good, but not exceptional). I'll probably get both eventually, but now I would like your opinions on which one to prioritize.

If I had to guess I would think TW3K is the best "pure game" while RTK14 is the best "historical sim", which is how I usually see these series contrast. TW being less preoccupied with historical accuracy but providing a more in-depth, challenging and balanced "gamey" experience, with RTK being more mindful of historical depiction and atmosphere. Don't know if that holds true for these entries though.

Thanks in advance!

[Dweller Beyond the Threshold]

You actually summarized it pretty well yourself. TW3K is a better game overall with a more refined strategy system and complex tactical battles. But ROTK is a much much better Three Kingdoms simulation game.

The characters of the TK are really at the front and centre of all ROTK games, their personality, strengths and weaknesses, as well as connections, likes and dislikes are all well illustrated and play a part in the game. TW3K is a Total War game first and foremost and Three Kingdoms game only as an afterthought. You get the traditional TW turn-based campaign strategy and the real-time battle, both of which are a lot more developed, refined and complex than ROTK's relatively simple and straightforward strategy and combat. But it really fails to capture the colorfulness of the story, the characters and the setting as a whole. You don't even get to the "three kingdoms" part of the story since the game has been officially abandoned right at the Battle of Guandu which is still in the pretty early part of the Three Kingdoms timeline. So you will never be able to get the full picture and many of the historical characters will be missing.

Now moving onto gameplay, the factions in TW3K are more balanced for the sake of gameplay; each faction has a large number of units and buildings; There is a decent progression system as your faction gradually grows stronger by unlocking for tech, reforms, stronger units etc. The diplomacy system is really well done for a TW game as well. And the real-time combat is top-notch even among TW games.

On the other hand, Koei's games suffer heavily from their relatively small budget: there aren't even any unit differentiation (all solders model are spearman) but instead rely on formation to differentiate them. The strategy aspect are pretty simple: you choose from a small number of options to grow your city, conscript soldiers, and then go to war. The combat is also pretty straightforward and mostly comes down to numbers game: the unit with higher numbers (number of soldiers, atk, def etc) tend to win with some simple tactical manoeuvre possible (like circling behind enemy to cutoff supply route), but it's nothing compared to the counterpart.

For me, I love the ROTK setting to death and it's the only reason I even play either of these games. I played a crap ton of ROTK 13 because the RPG element especially shines for me given how much I love the characters and being able to actually interact with each and everyone of them was really amazing for me. ROTK 14 unfortunately lacks this part which is the reason why I migrated to TW3K for a while. I enjoyed my time with the game especially with a bunch of mods that complemented some of the game's shortcomings, for example by adding back 200+ historical characters that are missing. But ultimately, for someone who's really after the setting and characters, TW3K proved lacking and I stopped playing it. So now I'm coming back to ROTK 14 and I'm enjoying it so far, and likely won't go back to TW3K again.

[BloodyPork]

TW3k is a total war in 3 kingdoms skin.

While rotk 14 is just another entry to the rotk series.

They are completely different thing, the only thing that is same between them are the historical period/setting. Trying to compare them is like comparing all these different ww2 video game series.

Honestly the easy answer is play both like everyone else, if I have to pick one I will definitely pick this over TW3k because that's just another Total War game and I have played all of them already. It's just like call of duty series where if you've played a couple you know all of them with few additions. The biggest issue with TW for me is how 99% of the battles that you are doing are basically sieging cities and waiting for your siege weapon to breach walls, like the fun part of TW is defensive siege battle and field battle, but in practice almost all the time you are just attacking cities with catapults. and it's extremely repetitive after 100+ hrs.

The issue with RTK 14 is the lack of roleplay elements and cut content (eg. debate), and it feels frustrating because while the game is serviceable and can be fun for hundred of hours, it is unfilled potential and Koei always fall short of greatness. If only they are willing to spend more time in developing a title (like how paradox continually improve a title) instead of quickly moving to another game and leave imperfect games for $$$, it could be much better. The lack of moddability is also a major weakness, because moddable games often provide far superior experience than vanilla.

[Silva]

Thanks for the input, folks. I'll get both evetually but budget is short now so your opinions are welcome. ;)

I don't mind the Total War formula much as I'm away from it for some time (last one I played was Thrones of Britannia 3 years ago). What scares me more is the apparent complexity in TW3K. The series used to be very simple on the strategic board but now they became almost Civ-like in complexity. Which would be great if I was 20 but these days I lack the patience for steep learning curves. Also, it's UI feels strangely... unpleasant. Shogun 2 UI was beautiful in a simple and elegant way, but TW3K one looks polluted.

I'm pending to RTK14 now. Gameplay looks simpler for my old brain (while still good) and I love the presentation. The only obstacle is it's price, here in Brazil it's ridiculously high, almost 2/5 of the national minimum wage.

FAKE EDIT: is the music really bad or I was unlucky on my youtube pick? I was watching a Lu Bu playthrough and the music felt like something out of a Disney cartoon.

[Silva]

About the music, I found the music DLC allows one to include RTK 12 and 13 tracks into the game. It's good enough for me.

[Dweller Beyond the Threshold]

The game is on sale now so it's a good time to buy it :)

About the music, it's nothing exceptional but I also don't remember being cringed by any particularly bad selection. But it's fairly easy to swap out with your own musics, I believe there are tools to do that on some Chinese websites.

[Silva]

Thanks! I decided for RTK14 and will be getting it in this sale. My brother have Total War 3K on Steam and allowed me to play a bit through the shared account feature. Found it nice but too complex for my tastes these days, if that makes sense.

About the music, I'm on PS4 so I can't use mods, but there's a DLC that allows using music from RTK12 and 13.

[vandurlast]

Originally posted by UnhappyLawbro:

For me, I love the ROTK setting to death and it's the only reason I even play either of these games. But ultimately, for someone who's really after the setting and characters, TW3K proved lacking and I stopped playing it. So now I'm coming back to ROTK 14 and I'm enjoying it so far, and likely won't go back to TW3K again.

I find what your saying very interesting.
For someone such as myself who knows only a very, very broad overview of the 3 Kingdoms period how informative will playing this game be?
Does enough of the story and characters get explained so that i will end up with an understanding of who/what the factions and events are or is this more of a battle game with skins on that appeal to people who already know those characters?

[BloodyPork]

Originally posted by vandurlast:

Originally posted by UnhappyLawbro:

For me, I love the ROTK setting to death and it's the only reason I even play either of these games. But ultimately, for someone who's really after the setting and characters, TW3K proved lacking and I stopped playing it. So now I'm coming back to ROTK 14 and I'm enjoying it so far, and likely won't go back to TW3K again.

I find what your saying very interesting.
For someone such as myself who knows only a very, very broad overview of the 3 Kingdoms period how informative will playing this game be?
Does enough of the story and characters get explained so that i will end up with an understanding of who/what the factions and events are or is this more of a battle game with skins on that appeal to people who already know those characters?

I would say Total War is better for people who have no idea about the series actually, it just focus on the liege and main characters basically, and most of the generals would be ahistorical random generics. The quality of the characters doesn't always correlate with how good they are historically either, this and the generics are actually turn off for people who knows the actual history/novel.

On the other hand, the more knowledgeable you are about the setting, then the more charm ROTK will be, because each officers are actually unique and correlates much more to their actual selves in the novel, such as in terms of personality and ability. Otherwise most of these 1000s officers are just a bunch of randoms you have no idea about. Especially if you aren't familiar with Chinese names it's just a bunch of randoms and you have trouble knowing which one is what.

[Silva]

If one plays for the historical characters, perhaps RTK13 is a better option though, as it allows you to directly interact and form relationships with them, rather than just using them as little dudes on a map like 14 does.

[paladin_66]

Honestly, I just bought it after it finally being on sale and I have played and owned every single one back to #1. It was not nearly as bad as people make this one out to be. It was not the best one and frankly my BIGGEST gripe was the INSANELY slow movement speed. I mean, it took me like 10 turns to move an army to attack a city sometimes. It was maddening. That being said, I just also picked up TW on sale and played that and I found TW to be pretty much like every other TW game with a ROTK skin. Some things were good and interesting and there were some advantages but it also came down to the same TW formula...build an army with a full bar of power, overwhelming other armies until the calculator estimates victory (was never once wrong), auto complete, repeat until you win. Like all other TW games, it is slow between turns and crashes every so often. Overall, it was fun and all but I preferred ROTK for a ROTK experience. 14 is definitely not the best in the series but it was not horrendous.

[Silva]

It seems to me the displeasure with RTK14 come from old veterans who expected it to be like 11. It was the same with NA Taishi, which was poorly received but is actually a fine game when all is said and done.

About Total War 3K, I found it a stark improvement over the previous ones I played, with factions that actually feel and play differently. A couple ones even allow a Tall style gameplay, something I had never seen in the series before. That said, yes, it's the same formula at the core so I can understand if one feels fed up by it. It's the same I feel for Civilization series.

All in all, I would say both games are pretty good on their own ways, and the negative receptions seem exaggeration on the part of some old fans.

[MnM Ondreyson]

7 and 11 are my favs. After 11 the series got pretty crappy, no actual "strategy" anymore. 7 had the RPG system, 11 had a neat RTS map. I agree that Id love an RPG system again, where you can improve characters stats over time, but they dont seem interested in reintroducing it. Each ROTTK game they introduce seems more and more of a cash grab.

As for total war, its ok. Nothing amazing, but not bad either. Dont get it expecting ROTTK though, as it uses TW gameplay, set in a ROTTK setting.