The Bard's Tale Trilogy

The Bard's Tale Trilogy

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Best Characters to Create--Races/Jobs/Stats/Etc.
What are the best combinations, and what Party would you recommend?
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Showing 16-30 of 35 comments
This is for what I am looking: what race goes with Paladin, and what Attributes, and numbers, should I have--this question goes for Bard, Rogue, etc.
JPMcMillen Aug 15, 2018 @ 2:33am 
Originally posted by lindseyrtackett:
This is for what I am looking: what race goes with Paladin, and what Attributes, and numbers, should I have--this question goes for Bard, Rogue, etc.
1. Don't remember, but if you pick a race and Paladin isn't a class option, back up and try a different.
2. As for attributes, as high as the dice gods give you, and don't be afraid to reroll as many times as you need to get good numbers. If the numbers you think are important keep comming up low, try switching to a different race. When it comes to attributes, not all races are even close to equal in all attributes.
3. For other classes, pretty much the same. Just try to find a race that will give you the highest score in the attributes that class will probably benifit from.

It's not all that important and there is no "best characters" to create. Espeically since 50 different players will give you 50 different answers on exactly what they think the best party is. Because in truth, there really isn't one.
PirateEmcee Aug 15, 2018 @ 2:57am 
Originally posted by lindseyrtackett:
This is for what I am looking: what race goes with Paladin, and what Attributes, and numbers, should I have--this question goes for Bard, Rogue, etc.

If you play it like fairly straightforward D&D, you'll be on the right track. Also, keep in mind that the Review Board will improve one stat by 1 point each level up. With patience (save and restore) it's possible to get the stat you want each time. Front line characters would benefit most from getting CON to 18 ASAP, to maximize the HP bonuses as much as is possible. Similarly, casters want to reach 18 INT quickly for the Spell Point boost.

Front-line characters -- classic fighters -- tend to want STR and CON. STR so they hit harder, CON so they have more health. Every point over 14 nets an extra health at level up, added to whatever the HP increase range is (Warriors & Paladins would get 1-16 +1 if they had 15 CON for instance). I try to have decent DEX as a secondary stat as you get 1 better AC (lower) per DEX over 14. Except for Hunters and Bards, fighters get an extra attack every four levels after the first (so +1 attack at L5, +2 attacks at L9, and so on).

--Warriors are very, very straightforward. High STR & CON. Have DEX if you can. They can wield nearly any weapon or armor in the game, except for a few that are specifically for the Paladin due to their holy nature.

--Paladins are holy warriors, nearly identical to Warriors except for a few things. They resist evil magic/traps better and so often make better party leaders (the first spot). Mechanically, they get the equivalent of a few extra levels of spell resistance. Eventually, everyone can resist as well as a Paladin, but it takes a while and Paladins reach max resistance at a lower level (IIRC, it's in the low 30s). They pretty much want STR and DEX as the Warrior. I choose Paladins over Warriors, usually, because they loose the least in the third game when you need to give up a fighter class to become a Geomancer.

--Monks will improve their AC (visible) and to-hit chances (not visible) each level, in addition to any benefit of high DEX. After somewhere around L4-6, unequip their weapon and let them go at it barehanded. They have more restrictions on their weapons and armor than the other fighter types, but, after about L6, you don't want them using a weapon anyway; their AC also naturally drops as a result of their class abilities. Eventually, they do the most damage per hit of any fighter. But they will still get outclassed by the magic users.

--Hunters are fighters who do not get extra attacks. Instead, they have a critical hit ability that gets better with time. Criticals in the Bard's Tale games are instant kills. So, the Hunter only ever needs to do one point of damage, but, as long as it is a critical hit, the monster *will* die.

--Bards are warriors who have given up hardcore fighting for magical music. Similarly to Hunters, Bards do not get extra attacks but, instead of a critical hit ability, they can sing songs that do many things. They can lower armor class, heal themselves or their entire party, reduce the effect of evil magics, and so on. A Bard can sing as many songs as they have experience levels -- and then they need to go get a drink at a tavern.

In general, you can't go wrong with high STR and CON for these classes. Max CON first, to maximize HP gain per level. I tend to go with DEX as a secondary. Luck also improves a character's chance to avoid traps and evil magic.

You may recall I mentioned something called a Geomancer. They're a specialized magic user class, only in BT III, but it's worth thinking about them now. Only warrior types can become Geomancers. But, in order to cast these spells, they lose something from their old class.

--all classes with extra attacks lose them
--Hunters lose their critical hit abiliity
--Bards lose their songs
--Monks lose their AC and to-hit bonuses

This is why I suggest a Paladin to make the switch to Geomancer. AFAIK, they lose only their multiple hits but retain their extra resistance to evil magic/traps.


Rogues/Thieves are in a class (ha) by themselves. They're not fighters and not magic users. In the Remaster, they become a little more viable.
--they can hide in the shadows to avoid being a target in combat until they come back out and when they come back out to attack, they get to make a critical strike like a Hunter
--they can identify and disarm traps, potentially saving your spell points
--they have the abiliity to identify items when you find ones you don't know about so you might not need to pay Garth to ID it for you (any item, even the basic gear, can be awarded in treasure after a fight as an unknown item)

Strictly speaking, Rogues aren't required until BT III and, with their limited use in the original version of the games, often weren't used til then. But, now, they may be of use to you. I would focus on CON, as with pure fighters, but then look to shift to DEX or perhaps Luck after CON is maxxed.



Casters are going to be the majority of your damage after a certain point. Monsters will just have too much health for a Warrior or Paladin, often even Monks, to kill in one attack, even with five or six attacks. But the casters won't survive to do their ungodly amounts of damage without the meat shields. Max INT first for bonus spell points per level.

The game allows you to start only as a Conjurer (they deal with physical stuff like summoning real monsters to join you, healing party members, summon a mobile light, and so on) or a Magician (they modify things, like cause hands or weapons to do more damage, cause walls to glow with light or disappear temporarily, and that sort of thing) . They're both useful, so have at least one of each (more on "at least" in a bit).

Sorcerers (they're mentalists -- possessions, creating ilusionary summons, causing psychic damage) are more powerful, and so aren't available at the game start. They only can be used once you've mastered (spell level 3 or better) at least one of the two starting classes.

Wizards (deal with demons and related energy manipulation) are the most powerful casters. You have to have two of the other three caster classes mastered (at least spell level 3) before you can become a Wizard.

Casters learn spells ever odd-numbered level (1, 3, 5, and on). There are 7 spell levels per class. Casters master their class at character level 13. Only change caster classes once you have all seven spell levels: once you change, you can't go back.

Conjurers and Magicians earn levels the fastest; Sorcerers are a little slower (more XP per level than them); Wizards are the slowest (most XP per level of all four casters in BT I). Start with the Conjurer or Magician, then change to Sorcerer, then Wizard, and then whichever one is left. That way, your endgame in BT I will be simpler -- your casters will gain levels faster, improving your spell penetration and resistance, as well as getting spell points much faster. (Once you transition to BT II, they'll all become Archmages as that class gets added in the next game.)

Again: make sure your casters learn all seven spell levels before they go on to the next caster class. I can't stress that enough. If you switch too soon, you're just going to regret it later when a Dreadlord has murdered your two casters who had mastered the Conjurer spells, and you really need to teleport (a high level Conjurer spell) to the dungeon entrance but the only caster you have still breathing left the Conjurer class too soon. Enjoy that walk.

Party make up for the Remaster can be different than for the original series, and tastes vary. Many people don't like Bards; I would never make a party without one.

That said....

Paladin
Monk or Hunter
Bard
Rogue
Caster
Caster
Caster

I suggest three casters for several reasons.
1) they really do the most damage in the game
2) a fighter in slots 5-7 is wasted as they really can't do much back there (yeah, missle weapons...meh)
3) in BT III, one of the casters needs to become a Chronomancer, otherwise you can't play most of the game; having three casters now means you'll still have two powerful standard casters once you give one up to being a Chronomancer later

If you decide you don't like the Bard, you could sub in another Hunter or Monk in his/her place. For the Remasters, though, I'd suggest keeping the Rogue in slot #4. Rogues are actually useful in the Remaster of BT I and so there's no reason not to have one from the start.
huffadopolis Aug 15, 2018 @ 3:16am 
That part about making conjurer/magician last class in bard's tale 1 no longer applies in the remaster per the devs, so you can end on whatever magic class you prefer or end up at :)

Originally posted by defster:
A question for the devs.

In Bards Tale 1, experience required pr level after level 13 is insanely high for Wizards. While other classes require 200-230k xp per level, Wizards need 1300k xp. To bypass this, people used to go back to Con or Mag after obtaining all Wizard spells, at the price at not being able to ever equip Wiz-only items like Elf Cloak, Mithril Helm etc.

In BT2 and BT3 this is not an issue as all classes require 200k pr level after 13, even Archmages.

Is this being "fixed" in your BT1 remaster?


Originally posted by MaDPuPPeT:
XP requirement is reduced in the remaster as we wanted a quicker game for people with less time to grind out the levels.
Also, it has keep the 200k/level after level 13 across all 3 volumes now. (though that is now 100k/level)

The legacy mode has an option to return the XP to its original levels for people that want the full xp grind.
PirateEmcee Aug 15, 2018 @ 3:19am 
Originally posted by huffadopolis:
That part about making conjurer/magician last class in bard's tale 1 no longer applies in the remaster per the devs, so you can end on whatever magic class you prefer or end up at :)

Originally posted by defster:
A question for the devs.

In Bards Tale 1, experience required pr level after level 13 is insanely high for Wizards. While other classes require 200-230k xp per level, Wizards need 1300k xp. To bypass this, people used to go back to Con or Mag after obtaining all Wizard spells, at the price at not being able to ever equip Wiz-only items like Elf Cloak, Mithril Helm etc.

In BT2 and BT3 this is not an issue as all classes require 200k pr level after 13, even Archmages.

Is this being "fixed" in your BT1 remaster?


Originally posted by MaDPuPPeT:
XP requirement is reduced in the remaster as we wanted a quicker game for people with less time to grind out the levels.
Also, it has keep the 200k/level after level 13 across all 3 volumes now. (though that is now 100k/level)

The legacy mode has an option to return the XP to its original levels for people that want the full xp grind.

Huh. Good to know. Thanks. :smile:

Any word on the reasons for the original split? Did they change that too?

It used to be that Sorcerers and Wizards originally got more HP and SP per level than Conjurers and Magicians. And Wizards, additionally, had much better spell penetration than C/M and a bit better than S also -- which was why Sorcerers were a little more expensive to level and Wizards were hideously more expensive to level.
Which Classes should have high Dexterity? Do Hunters using bows benefit from higher Dexterity, or only Strength?
PirateEmcee Aug 15, 2018 @ 3:40am 
Originally posted by lindseyrtackett:
Which Classes should have high Dexterity? Do Hunters using bows benefit from higher Dexterity, or only Strength?

Ultimately, all your front-line fighters want good DEX — just not first.

Honestly, I never bothered with missle weapons. Too much trouble to go back and forth. I just had my casters handle ranged because there was almost always something wanting to close to melee and bite my face off in the OT.

So far, that’s held up. I haven’t needed my fighters to carry ranged weapons, and I’m into the Sewers.
herrglocke Aug 15, 2018 @ 4:07am 
So is it then consensus that the 7th slot should be filled with a regular character and not (as the remaster itself still advises) be kept free for a random monster?
asmodemus Aug 15, 2018 @ 4:13am 
Yeah, I'm totally just running an extra character. What the Gold Box games and Might and Magics did was reserve spots ONLY for NPCs. When there is the option having an NPC or PC... how can you go past an extra PC? Particularly when later games make you want to have extra characters to convert and whatnot.
tremir Aug 15, 2018 @ 4:16am 
Yeah.
With monsters being unable to level, an extra PC is probably a much better option
Though I do miss the undocumented earth elemental you could just summon up in the original BT1
VoidEngineer Aug 15, 2018 @ 4:50am 
To be clear, missile weapons can allow your front line guys to hit things at range that they might not be able to otherwise. Items like Aram's Knife or a Songaxe are very useful for those situations. Also, you'll have to run with 6 characters at a few points in the game to progress through puzzles.
kmwill23 Aug 15, 2018 @ 5:34am 
I notice a lot of Monk hate in this topic! Having played the original game multiple times over the years, I always rolled 3 monks, 3 casters. Now I run 4 monks and 3 casters. I started with 1 bard and 2 casters to abuse the fire horn.

The monks get low AC incredibly and start hitting hard unarmed after 4 levels. That low AC allows me to venture into dungeons I have no right being in. I use this to get down to catacombs 3 to firehorn the 69 wights.

Played for 3 hours last night. Have level 18 monks and 2 wizards now. Actually just completed all other classes for my casters, so lvl 1 wizards.

Monks also do not require any item management. Their AC gets so low that you don't need armor. Their unarmed damage is so high you don't need weapons.

You might slide in one Hunter. At high level they crit-kill all the time.
Sterno Aug 15, 2018 @ 5:54am 
Originally posted by kmwill23:
I notice a lot of Monk hate in this topic! Having played the original game multiple times over the years, I always rolled 3 monks, 3 casters. Now I run 4 monks and 3 casters. I started with 1 bard and 2 casters to abuse the fire horn.

Agreed. 3 monks and 3 casters was the ultimate cheese combo in BT1, and the 7th slot we get now just means you can take another monk, though you might have to sometimes swap him for a bard for a certain puzzle.

In BT2 when monster hp totals get a lot bigger, the hunter's critical hit can be a better choice, but you never really end up beating the monk's low AC. And in the 3rd game, if I remember right you need a rogue at the end.

Ultimately, after about level 11 or so, your front line stops mattering other than their ability to tank. Your backline mages will be the ones killing everything with their AOE spells.
Last edited by Sterno; Aug 15, 2018 @ 5:55am
tremir Aug 15, 2018 @ 6:05am 
In BT3 there were several fights with an enemy at 90' who could kill you really fast if you closed into melee, so yeah, having a rogue sneak into range and backstab was the easiest way to win them. Not sure it was the only way, but definitely the easiest.
This is my Party, with all of them have AT LEAST 17 in their respective needed-Attributes, and all of them have at least 12 Dexterity, with the front-line having at least 14:

Paladin, Hunter, Rogue, Bard, Conjurer, and two Mages.
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Date Posted: Aug 14, 2018 @ 1:25pm
Posts: 35