How does caster progression work?

[MyCrabIsFight]

Hello, wasn't even born when this game was released but very much enjoying this remaster! Just wondering how caster progression worked, exactly. Do my casters retain spells once they change classes? WHen is best to change classes? My two casters have spell level 3 in their respective caster professions (conjurer and magician).

[Lord Marcus]

They retain all spells, each magic profession has seven levels, in order to become an archmage for BT2 you need to reach level 7 in four magic professions.

[astrosha]

According to Bardstaleonline.com ...

In BT2 to become an Archmage a caster "must have mastered at least level 3 spells in all four" of the other casting classes. In other words, as long as they've visited them all, and are level 5 or higher (that's when you can learn level 3 spells) in the fourth, they can go Archmage.

Of course, you want them to learn all of the spells. And unlike many games that allow returning to a class, once you leave it in BT, there's no going back. So you want to take each caster to level 13 and get the level 7 spells before changing class.

The old instruction books state that neither Sorcerer nor Wizard are available to newly created characters because they're powerful classes. The books did not state the requirements, not as I recall anyhow :
Conjurer : can start
Magician : can start
Sorcerer : know level 3 spells in any other casting class
Wizard : know level 3 spells in any two other casting classes

For some reason, I had thought that Archmage would follow that convention, and only require three other classes, not all four.

[Alefiend]

Originally posted by Lord Marcus:

They retain all spells, each magic profession has seven levels, in order to become an archmage for BT2 you need to reach level 7 in four magic professions.

He means level 7 spellcasting ability, not 7th experience level. You need to be level 13 to learn all the spells of a given class.

[astrosha]

Originally posted by Alefiend:

Originally posted by Lord Marcus:

They retain all spells, each magic profession has seven levels, in order to become an archmage for BT2 you need to reach level 7 in four magic professions.

He means level 7 spellcasting ability, not 7th experience level. You need to be level 13 to learn all the spells of a given class.

I know what he meant, and you have read his statement in the exact same way I did. However, what he said is incorrect.

You only *need* to have Third rank (exp level 5) spells in Conjurer, Magician, Sorcerer, and Wizard in order to become an Archmage in BT2. That is the point where a character can change casting class.

With the inability to go back to previously visited spellcasting classes, anyone not going to the Seventh rank (exp level 13) spells in the four previous casting classes is only shortchanging their mage(s).

[MyCrabIsFight]

Alright so, maxxx out that caster spell progession before changing classes then! Thanks all!

[Typhon]

Definitely.

Though it might be a nice QOL change, now that XP thresholds after 13 are normalised, to allow going back and "finishing off" a class, as it were.

[JPMcMillen]

Originally posted by Typhon:

Definitely.

Though it might be a nice QOL change, now that XP thresholds after 13 are normalised, to allow going back and "finishing off" a class, as it were.

The only thing is that the game doesn't keep track of what level you were in a former class, only what level spells you earned. This would be an issue in that if you leveled up your caster to a high level in this game, then switched to archmage in BT2, got to level 13, learned all the spells, then switched back to your previous class to get the power bump from spells whose effect is based on your characters level. Right now the game would have to assume you were only the minimum level required for the spells you learned. So other than extra HP/SP, you'd be back to that minimum level.

And in truth, if someone did shortcut a caster to get to sorcerer or wizard faster, later on it would be nearly as easy to just create a new caster and level him up from scratch. You'll already have plenty of gold to learn spells with and they will level up so fast they'll max out everything quick enough. You just have to make sure there's a caster in the party that can rez them (BEDE) if they get hit by some AOE attack.

[HARDENTH60]

Need to get all 7 spells for arch on bards tale 2 better level them up when you have time and bt2 not yet out

[astrosha]

Originally posted by DC UN1:

Need to get all 7 spells for arch on bards tale 2 better level them up when you have time and bt2 not yet out

While it is a very good idea to get all of the spells, IT IS NOT REQUIRED TO BECOME AN ARCHMAGE IN BT2.

I really wish people would stop spreading this misinformation around.

ITS A VERY GOOD IDEA TO FINISH EACH CASTER BEFORE CHANGING CLASS.

IT IS NOT REQUIRED, you can do it with the spells available at experience level 5 each class.

[DiceWrangler]

Is there any advantage for a caster to advance beyond 13th level in any of the caster classes? In other words, once all 7th level spells are learned, does it matter which caster class I continue to advance in?

[Space Dog]

Originally posted by DiceWrangler:

Is there any advantage for a caster to advance beyond 13th level in any of the caster classes? In other words, once all 7th level spells are learned, does it matter which caster class I continue to advance in?

Sorcerers and Wizards gain more HP per level, and Wizards can use some equipment not available to other classes. Apparently, Wizards are also better at resisting enemy magic and landing their spells.

So even though there's apparent freedom in how to build a caster, the single best way is Conjurer / Magician -> Sorcerer -> Magician / Conjurer -> Wizard. If you have two casters in the party you could skip the other "base" class, but then you'd miss out on a lot of HP and SP from the cheap early levels.

Leveling up is so ridiculously fast in this game there's no reason not to get 7th level spells from all classes you choose.

It's far from a perfect system but it's from 1980's and it's cute. :D