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Because opponents with a silver star and even more with a gold star get a bonus to everything.
So they have more shields and firepower than this ship size allows if a player took the ship with this equipment.
Player goes for hull points, then he cannot also take strong shields like the opponent, and cooler to be able to use beams on the yacht as long as opponents do it, and then the player still needs drive and side drive of the opponent is also super fast and mobile, and the player also needs modules that opponents never need like Warp instead of which the opponent naturally also has space for drones.
And all of that up there on a shuttle up to the largest class just because it has a silver or gold star.
Rather, you have to find a more precise balance of star's depending on ship size than it is now, normal gold star yachts with 3'000+ hull and felt 1'000 shield, and 2 beams in continuous fire, while being super fast and agile , just don't make sense for a yacht, especially when every yacht has a gold star.
Because when the factions are at war, you only see that they all turn each other off without any problems and that the side with the station is most likely to win, and if the player participates then the side where you help wins more.
I strongly disagree. There is absolutely a balance issue here. Nerfing the scaling rate just kicks the can down the road. It just means you're facing impossible godmode ships a little later, but they're still coming for you eventually (and apparently the current behavior is 'working as intended' for the hardest difficulty?). At the very least there should be some kind of soft cap, like a logarithmic curve, where for every 100 times as much bounty, the hunt squads "only" get 10 times stronger. But even then I don't like the implications of just ramping up stats of enemy ships.
Allowing ravagers to have essentially illegal stats is one thing, but for every random hunter squad sent after you to have ships that are 10 times more powerful than is physically possible for you to make the same ship hulls? I find that disgusting. Where are all these godmode ships coming from? Why don't factions use them in contested sectors? If gold stars are this common in the universe, then why can't I be a gold star? No. If the infinitely scaling bounty system wants to send harder and harder challenges, then make them consist of more or bigger ships, not just increasing levels of godmode. Make it feel like the hunt squads consist of ships that actually exist in the universe somehow.
I don't have the game. I'm considering buying it. However, these weird balance decisions (that seem more about "git gud scrub" than about making the universe feel like a coherent place that's lived in) are turning me off from it.
I feel similarly about the nonsense nonphysical material/energy called "flux". Why can't reactor cores provide energy to charge things? What even is "flux?" Why can't I choose to stack flux generation or storage? The feature seems to exist for the sole purpose of making it a bad idea to use charging weapons or spinal mounts. Getting only 1 flux every 30 seconds or so, or else sacrificing the ability to warp? No thanks. And since you aren't allowed to stack flux generation, and for some reason the Warp Diverter generates flux faster on smaller ships, all the more reason to stick with a smaller ship, as is tradition. Why? Why is it like this?
Second off, nerfing the scaling rate makes it harder to get there on normal/relaxed, and means that if you do get these fleets (the only endgame challenge right now) it's because you knew that they existed, and you wanted to get them. It's not kicking down the road unless you actually want it; it's making it easier on people who didn't realize the consequences of their choices.
Finally, flux. Reactors cores do provide energy to charge things, almost everything uses energy. Flux is used only for specialized things, like charging weapons and barriers. And flux doesn't make using spinals a bad idea - spinals are practically op without it, and with it are so op that next update they'll be capped to only using a max of 3 flux, to not be too powerful. 1 flux every 30 seconds is actually a lot; my battleship only ever runs low when I'm using the spinal at max speed, which I rarely ever need to do. And sticking to smaller ships? That's just a choice; everything is carefully balanced to insure that all ship sizes are equally viable throughout the entire game. I've afk'd ravagers in capital ships, and torn them apart in shuttles. You really don't need to stick to a specific size of ships to be powerful.
If you have concerns, you can just not buy it. But complaining about balancing and features, when you've never actually experienced them, won't help you decide. Buy the game and maybe refund it later, or don't buy it. Or go watch a youtube video or twitch stream of someone playing it, and ask them about it. There are better ways to learn than complaining without knowing.
If one is traveling in a yacht without a fleet, the hunter fleet is also more suitable than a huge swarm of yachts where all have 1'000 to 3'000+ HP.
And with a class 5 and 6, the fighter fleets also consist of larger ships than just yachts, instead of all yachts which again only have 3'000+ HP.
The Problem on balance is for your own fleet, what kind of ship do you have, what kind of ships do you have in the fleet.
So you could at least adjust the balance so that you can see how far you have to adjust the silver and gold stars so that the balance fits better.
Since there is no option to buy the fleets away, you have such a bad reputation that you only see such fleets all the time.
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flux
I would like to have an option for weapons that use flux to turn them off for flux as well, so that I can use those weapons without consuming flux.
And this function also for the special weapon slots that consume flux.
The special shields can't be used if you have any of the other stuff, so the charge weapons are useless as you always lose everything to your flux, and the special slot makes shields useless as this weapon uses so much in a single shot.
That you can turn off weapons for use flux without using flux for it.
Or you can set how much flux energy you want to use for what, and how much is left over and weapons are not allowed to use that you have at least 1 flux for the shield.
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Steam refunds only work if you play for less than 2 hours.
And 2 hours is not enough to see the things that are at stake here, they only come after 4 to 10 hours, depending on how you play, and the hours are meant for everyone who played the game a little, for which the If you have never played it, it can take even longer, so no returns are possible.
10 times stronger is a bit of an exaggeration. Sure, hunter fleets at that point can have thousands or tens of thousands of HP/Shields... but you can easily dip into the low-mid thousands yourself; depending on skills, ship, and equipment. Likewise with Damage, they could have rapid fire weapons with 5k+ DPS(Vulcans are the worst) but you can also build an omnissiah cannon that explodes for 12k+ DPS.(Granted you'd only be able to fire the damn thing once every ~10 seconds)
That aside, IMO, it is actually quite hard to get enemies like this to spawn. You'd need to have a lot of Bounty from Perks, Effects, and negative Rep to have these "Hunter Killer" fleets spawn on you. Like playing on Hardcore, picking 2-3 perks that increase Bounty, picking a ship that increases Bounty, then earning 1-2 more Bounty perks through play ... then getting ~-2000+ rep with a faction or two.
And since this is a late game issue, it's likely going to be the only thing that can remotely challenge you by that point. I mean, if you want an "in universe" reason for these inexplicablely strong enemies hunting you... consider your fame has become such that the entire universe perceives you as a threat, thus your enemies are sending other legends after you. You've become the John Wick of space.
Uh Flux is practically OP. You can use it to make yourself nigh invulnerable, process 10+ ore in seconds(normally takes minutes) or drastically increase your DPS. Spinal Mount charge Lasers literally become Death Stars. Also note you can have upwards of ~9-12 Flux charges, which is a lot when most things get major benefits at ~2.
The whole deal between sacrificing Warp(smaller size is faster because small ships need faster warp speeds) vs passive ~30 second generation is for a playstyle choice. You sacrifice Warp for Flux gen speed since you plan on not running away and being in extended fights. If you do plan on running away or to have the fight over quickly; you go with passive gen.
TLDR: I don't know, call me biased but seems weird someone is going to complain about late game balance when they haven't even played the game. Especially when this "imbalance" is mostly due to stacking Bounty too high for you to deal with. IMO, the only thing that needs to change is their frequency. Half the time another wave will spawn in while you are still dealing with the first lol.
only their hull strength. Their weapons can't keep up with ours so they'd melt otherwise; a fully tricked out player ship will still have them beat, even if not quite as healthy. It's one of those RPG effects where even though enemies have way more health the combat gets balanced by your own damage, avoidance and recovery abilities.
They do. There's less high level contested sectors right now so we don't see the highest ones much, but there's elites in attack fleets.
Believe me, everyone noticed. I'm not sure who you saw trying to deal with 60 golds, but it takes significant time and effort to get there - although admittedly there was a lack of decent warnings about this so new players risked building themselves up to hunters with certain playstyles, which they can't handle without even realizing they'd begun doing so. And that wasn't right, so that's gonna be getting fixed.
As for flux I wrote a simple, if a bit old guide, and large ships have their own interests in the capacitor. I recommend getting at least a primer from reading that. Charge systems are being worked on though as right now a few are too good with flux and most are too bad without it. But you're in need of more information about what the system is right now. It has some flaws, but you're currently way off about what they are.
Warp Flux Loader in purple is 2
And if there is Orange, the extreme ones are hard to come by, as long as these modules increase memory at all and don't do anything else.
So in violet 7 , and if orange goes then 9 , how do you get 12 flux. ?
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Later the balance is not optimal.
All the time the game is in a good balance, and as soon as these fighter fleets come along, that balance breaks.
As soon as the time comes, you can make new characters again if you don't have all your desired equipment there before they come, type of modules in purple or even in orange.
So, depending on the game experience, you start new, or how much you enjoy not making progress, it is better to create a new character instead of struggling to get the right equipment, especially if you are on a yacht, the ships need the right modules since you don't have as much space for equipment as on big ships.
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The hunter fleets can achieve anything with all weapons, but players are forced to only take very specific items.
And with weapons where you could do well before Jäger fleets, Jäger fleets can be rubbish, so in the end everything plays the same, especially if you play with yachts where much less is possible.
What? You are complaining about something in the game without having played it, and with that attitude!!?
...
Breathe, Laious, breathe... :P
They only become gold stars if you really push it, let me explain it, as Hunter Fleets (enemy spawning to attack you) mechanics are not very clear and many players trigger it without realizing it. In fact, I already made some changes for next patch in that regard and will keep doing so, specially for explaining that.
How it works:
The enemy start spawning once you are hostile with a faction OR the marauder presence in the sector thinks you are a good target. But early on they are only 1 or 2 normal ships, not even silver stars. The squad size and strength increases with your negative reputation and if you have 'bounty' perks (you will often attract more powerful enemies).
So... The Hunter Fleets are only strong if you make them to be, either by killing too many of a faction or stacking 'bounty' perks.
Important: Normally, if you destroy a ship while defending yourself (when they attack first) it will NOT grant you negative reputation with that faction, unless those are the actual hunters they are sending to collect the prize on your head.
Again, strong hunter fleets only happens in late game as a consequence of player acts, but even so, I'm about to add more explanations and warnings to make it clear.
And most of the players are not among those who can play like others in videos.
And then you like the game, you know self, and then a game can put you off.
So you also want to know whether something is still being done, or whether everything that puts you off should stay the same in the long term, or whether something is still going to be adjusted.
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Started yesterday with a "Kurma" , with "Outis" , and "Acquired Wisdom" and "The Last Starfighter" for the size of the ship.
"The Last Starfighter" just makes enemies stronger.
And Hardcore. ( No Perma Dead )
Start sector, come Red Skulls, with 3 yachts, and already with 1 corvette and 2 yachts, all at least 1 gold star, the others silver to gold.
Also started yesterday, that up there with "Hephaestus", the wiki means attracts enemies +10 points, I saw a lot less Red Skulls and Bandits with that, in the starting sector.
With both I have a crew that repairs the ship over time, which doesn't attract any opponents.
With the "Kurma" I die more than 4 times until I was finally able to explore the sector, the "Hephaestus" dies not once with which I saw much fewer opponents only once Extremely strong, but they were destroyed by the station.
With "Hephaestus" I did another sector and saw just one weak group there, why was it harder with "Kurma" although attracting opponents is only 1 perk and hardcore, this and this while the other ship even has +10 more points.
The only difference is the +10 points of "Hephaestus", and with that I saw fewer opponents, and only once came really stronger ones than on "Kurma".
Using a bug/exploit but it appears to have been fixed since I last used it lol. (It had to do with equipping a fleet ship, letting it gain flux, unequip flux items, swap, re-equip.)
Well I think that is more personal choice than a fault with game balance. IMO, only using yachts is purposefully restricting yourself and making the game harder in some ways so it can be easier in others. Yachts are great for dodging, jousting, etc. but their small size makes them very squishy and limited with what they can have.
Just as using bigger ships makes the game easier since you can have more stuff but harder because you lose out on dodge and smaller enemies can swarm you.
Yeah but these fleets only become an issue if you make them an issue. It takes quite a bit to make them have such high Bounty that they become so overpowered. However, as has been said, you can still overcome them with the right setup and play.
That said, I can understand why people would dislike them and think they are a problem. I just don't think they are a problem. If I am doing a combat focused save, then I'll already be getting the things I need to stop them. If I am doing a mining/trader save, then I am not going to be getting such high Bounty that they become a problem.
IMHO, these fleets are only a major problem to newbies and people who don't know how Bounty works. That's why I think the thing that should change is their spawn frequency and have better warnings/tooltips explaining how Bounty works.
In other games there is often Buy Reputation to get him neutral again.
So you can minmax tankiness to faceroll a fleet of X strength. Great. But since the enemies scale infinitely, can you faceroll a fleet of X+1 strength? X+10? X+100? X+1000? This is neither an answer to the problem of infinite scaling, nor to the question about whether scaling should be done by handing out arbitrarily high stats in the first place. Does it really make sense that you should be attacked by a fleet of 15 ravagers?
You assume I haven't watched multiple videos. You assume I haven't searched through the forums and discord. Most of all, you assume I come here bearing malice. I'm not someone who goes around "Complaining About Shows You Don't Watch". If you check my Steam profile, one of the precious few that are not private these days, you'll find that my Steam account is 14 years old, I have 325 games, and I have 3 mods in the workshop (I have actually made many more mods but I'm too antisocial and depressed to finish polishing them up to upload them). I am not the usual demographic for a troublemaker. I quietly participate in official Discord servers, I quietly participate in bugtrackers, I quietly participate in dev streams on Twitch, but I believe this is the first time I've ever left a comment in the Steam community forums. If my motivation were to trash Star Valor, then I wouldn't even be here at all. I left a comment precisely because I'm interested in the game and want to spark meaningful discussion about systems in the game that don't seem to make sense as currently designed.
People are acting like I barged in here swinging like a drunken sailor, when I actually thought I was very careful and measured. The only mistake I see upon reflection is the use of the word "disgusting", which should have been something more like "baffling". I was very anxious about posting, and now I'm even more anxious about this followup. I've been composing for hours...
Why am I hesitant to participate in Steam community forums? Well, look at what happened. My points were largely ignored (infinite scaling is still infinite even if it's slower; flux is still an inexplicable quantity somehow differentiated from energy and heat), I was called ignorant ("complaining without knowing"), and I was told to get lost ("you can just not buy it"). This is frustrating, because I did not say anything that Moon-Shadow hasn't also said in long ramblings in dozens of discussion threads I've read through. All I did was condense and crystallize the ideas I've seen multiple users express, wrapping those ideas in a logical framework of ludonarrative dissonance. But I guess it's okay for the goofy forum regular to go on long rants (that maybe nobody but me reads), but not okay for some out-group tribe member like me who is seen as an interloper. After all, I did not build up enough community karma to earn the privilege to make observations. Fine. It's not like I don't know how this works. Here's the text that's been at the top of my Steam profile for a decade:
🤷♀️
Thank you for at least responding to my points, trying to explain the relevant details and why you think I'm wrong, instead of treating me like a troll and telling me 'then don't buy it lol'. As I see it, the problem with saying "your enemies are sending other legends after you" is that their stats aren't just phenomenal, they're unattainable. Sure, you might be able to build a ship that outperforms them in one specific domain, but they'll dramatically outperform you in all others, and there's just no way for the player to match that. Maybe this matters to me more than it matters to others. I care about parity between player characters and NPCs, so I prefer systems like D&D 3.5e where PCs and NPCs run on the same rules.
That said, I'm perfectly capable of just learning to live with silly game mechanics. And I might still buy the game and wind up doing exactly that. Even so, saying "well I'm able to have fun" doesn't mean the mechanics aren't silly. I did not expect "why should enemy ships have unattainable godlike stats, instead of being difficult encounters in other more organic ways" to be so controversial. 😕
Another thing I want to stress is that I understand that you don't get attacked by god fleets for no reason. The person who started this thread, MasterWaffle, seems like he wants a hardcore dogfighting experience, which is why he's playing a solo fighter on Hardcore difficulty. He went looking for nailbiting battles, but what he got instead was insurmountable stats where each small fast enemy ship is stronger than a station (his words, not mine). The problem here is not that there's optional hard challenges in a video game and I'm a big fat baby who cries about challenges I haven't even experienced for myself. I'm not a game journalist. The problem is that the very people who want those challenges (and yeah I think I'd actually be one of them) find the challenges presented don't properly deliver on their promise. Or at least that's what I gather from all the content I've consumed, though apparently I'm extremely wrong and deeply unworthy in some inscrutable way that has more to do with me than with the points I'm expressing.
I had already read your guide. It's a good guide. Or at least I think it is, for whatever that's worth. Which I guess isn't much, since I haven't bought and played the game, so my opinion is worth less than nothing. But still, thanks for engaging instead of just telling me where I can stick it.
I already understand that charging is really good with flux and really bad without flux. However, since flux can also be used for other things like barriers or passive bonuses (interceptor), and there's no way to tell flux-eating weapons "please don't eat my flux", it seems like you're disincentivized to use flux-eating weapons, especially on big ships, and if you want to use them on small ships then you basically have no choice but to take the hit to your warp drive. This just seems thematically weird to me, regardless of where the balance finally settles down. A lot of people are calling the change where spinal weapons consume only 3 flux a "nerf" (because it means less burst damage), but I did see a few people point out that it actually makes them better behaved, because now they don't eat all your flux.